T Nation

Nomaviron Bold 200 Cycle and PCT

Hi

Just wanted youre input on the following was thinking of doing the next cycle

Week 1-10 Nomaviron (test e 250mg and prop 50mg)
Sunday 1ml Wendsday 1ml

Week 1-10 Bold 200 (Boldenone Undecylenate/equipoise 200mg)
Sunday 1ml Wednesday 1ml

2 Weeks After last shot

PCT Nolvadex/Kessar
Day 1-3 40mg ed
Day 4-14 20mg ed
Day 15-28 10mg ed

Here is my question do you bro’s think i need pregnyl (hcg)? If i do how would i work it alot of people say 250iu’s twice weekly(for how long?) some say at the end of the cycle but not with the nolva so like 3000iu’s 5 days after last shot and then again e5d 3000iu’s/1500iu’s then start nolva? if i don’t need it i wil save some $$$ and should i run anything with the noma and bold keep in mind $$$ have got a bit extra but if i can save it towards my next cycle that would be great.Ooo and can i mix everything in 1 syringe?(hcg) Thanx for youre input.

Start the h.c.g at week four 250-500i.u run it the length of cycle at this point.

and yes twice a week

DA JUDGE

u need to inject more like eod

~Start the HCG the first Sat and run 250-400iu on Tues and Sats. Even though it takes several weeks for the Test and everything to “kick-in” it only takes several days for suppression at the testicular level to start.

Using HCG from the beginning is ideal, and not waiting until 3 or 4 weeks of suppression has taken place, or even worse - until the end of your cycle. Running the smallest dose needed - but, being that we want to start right away, it will be hard to know that dose, so I’d start with 250iu each dose.

I personally have found 400iu to be my sweet spot and it’s somewhat based on science, but empirical many do great with 250iu twice a week. I would stop the Hcg at the end of the cycle, though you could run start up to PCT:

But, running it any farther is counter-productive as if during PCT the artifical “LH” fromt the HCG is going to cause your testicles to respond, then they will respond to your natural LH as well which raises quite quickly as exogenous testosterone/aas levels lower to and below endogenous levels.

~Run an low-dosed AI from the same time, something like Arimidex at 25mg/day. Run it 2 weeks past your cycle, right up to PCT.

~When you start the Nolvadex, there is no practical reason to run doses higher than 20mg/day, as it’s been shown plainly in published scientific literature that the higher doses do nothing more to stimulate endogenous testosterone production, which is all we are wanting at that time.

Now, if we were wanting estrogen/gyno control, then the higher doses would be warranted. But, remember that we are running an AI until the exogenous test lowers enough for homeostatis to occur and we are not running an old school HCG regime that would raise estrogen by a great deal.

~You can mix the compounds into the same syringe.

~As far as something else to add… I’d start by dropping the EQ and replacing it, rather than adding to it myself. Otherwise just keep it simple and run the two and save the money for the next one. Even just Test or Test and an oral at the end would be good.

Hi

Thank you for all youre input and taking the time guys, making these adjustments

Week 1-10 Nomaviron (test e 250mg and prop 50mg)
Sunday 1ml Wendsday 1ml

Week 1-10 Bold 200 (Boldenone Undecylenate/equipoise 200mg)
Sunday 1ml Wednesday 1ml

Week 1-10 Pregnyl (Hcg)
Saturday 250iu Tuesday 250iu

2 Weeks After last shot

PCT Nolvadex/Kessar
Day 1-14 20mg ed
Day 15-28 10mg ed

Can i use Proviron (Mesterolone) in the place of Arimidex from week 3-12 at 25mg ed?

Dave cause of the prop i know i wanted clean test e just couldn’t get it, only got the nomaviron wich is the mix with prop as you can see so thats way i am going twice a week, should still get of the starting line a bit quicker with the prop mix.

Also heard something of shouldn’t run Hcg for longer then 4 weeks but i think thats not wright? Proberly in high dosages, cause of estrogen build-up and desensitize the testicles? So if this is on the spot i can see why the judge says from week 4.

[quote]lsd wrote:
Hi

Thank you for all youre input and taking the time guys, making these adjustments

Week 1-10 Nomaviron (test e 250mg and prop 50mg)
Sunday 1ml Wendsday 1ml

Week 1-10 Bold 200 (Boldenone Undecylenate/equipoise 200mg)
Sunday 1ml Wednesday 1ml

Week 1-10 Pregnyl (Hcg)
Saturday 250iu Tuesday 250iu

2 Weeks After last shot

PCT Nolvadex/Kessar
Day 1-14 20mg ed
Day 15-28 10mg ed

Can i use Proviron (Mesterolone) in the place of Arimidex from week 3-12 at 25mg ed?[/quote]

No. 25mg/day Proviron will not be enough to lower your estrogen enough in almost all circumstances given your cycle doses. It would be complimentary, and I would run it, plus past your cycle and into at least half of your PCT.

Here’s what I would add to the above if you want to run the Proviron (I would):

Week 1-12 Arimidex
Everyday .25mg

Week 1-14 Proviron (Could wait until week 4+ or so to save money)
Everyday 50mg

Week 15 Proviron
Everyday 25mg

Beat

Thanks again for the advice the reason i was asking about the proviron is i have a hard time getting Arimidex can’t i just take the proviron in higher dosages or should i just wait until i can get arimidex?

Thanks again.

Proviron has some ability to inhibit aromatase activity, in the same way that Drostanolone does, but that doesnt make it an ‘Aromatase Inhibitor’ which is a class of specific drugs that are used primarily for this function.

Proviron is actually the AAS Mesterolone.

JJ

[quote]lsd wrote:
Beat

Thanks again for the advice the reason i was asking about the proviron is i have a hard time getting Arimidex can’t i just take the proviron in higher dosages or should i just wait until i can get arimidex?

Thanks again.[/quote]

How DHT and some of its derivatives work to reduce estrogen and progesterone effects:

The following pertains to DHT as well as Proviron, Masteron and Methyl-DHT, and probably some others like Winstrol (progesterone); and is a very basic explaination without details or references.

  1. SHBG lowering -the high SHBG lowering causes the faster destruction of estrogen and without an increase in estrogen leads to a lowering by that effect.
    (Winstrol has the advantage here with only needing 6mg to be as effective as 50mg of Proviron)

  2. Causes a decreased estrogen-induced RNA transcription; basically estrogen cannot transcript its effects at the receptor due to a ‘blockage’ of sorts.
    (Proviron and Masteron has the advantage here as being closer to purer DHT’s)

  3. DHT helps prevent estrogen-dependent augmentation of progesterone receptors, which is, as far as I can see the only way that progestins are capable of causing ‘progesteronic’ sides anyway.
    (All seeming equal in this effect, empirically Winstrol has the advantage)

Proviron is going to be the best for estrogen control because it and Masteron have the strongest effect for #2, but Proviron is also quite good at #1 while Masteron isn’t so much. This is not meant to imply that DHT compounds can replace AI’s in an cycle, but merely to point out some of their effects in that regard; Doses and sensitivity would determine that.

I would recommend looking into some research chemicals or just keep looking. I can however say that 350mg/Prop and 350mg/Mast left my E2 at something like 38ng/ml which is completely acceptable, but I just wouldn’t count on using one of the DHT compounds for estrogen control without having a backup and/or blood tests for reference.

Hi

I will have to put it of until i can get arimidex then, thanks for all the input. Rather safe then sorry. brook so i take it that this thread you wouldn’t agree with?

I am going to go it like this then
Week 1-10 Nomaviron (test e 250mg and prop 50mg)
Sunday 1ml Wendsday 1ml

Week 1-10 Bold 200 (Boldenone Undecylenate/equipoise 200mg)
Sunday 1ml Wednesday 1ml

Week 1-10 Pregnyl (Hcg)
Saturday 250iu Tuesday 250iu

Week 1-12 Arimidex .25mg ed

2 Weeks After last shot

PCT Nolvadex/Kessar
Day 1-14 20mg ed
Day 15-28 10mg ed

Why do you say that? Because I haven’t commented on your cycle?

Well let me correct that… :wink:

[quote]Week 1-10 Nomaviron (test e 250mg and prop 50mg)
Sunday 1ml Wednesday 1ml[/quote]

seems fine… prop should be used EOD at least, BUT at only 50mg it really isnt worth it.

[quote]
Week 1-10 Bold 200 (Boldenone Undecylenate/equipoise 200mg)
Sunday 1ml Wednesday 1ml[/quote]

Fine… this is 600mg test:400mg eq. A nice ratio IMO…

[quote]
Week 1-10 Pregnyl (Hcg)
Saturday 250iu Tuesday 250iu[/quote]

fine too - i think 250iu is better used 3x/wk actually, but only from what i have read, not from personal experience… :wink:

[quote]
Week 1-12 Arimidex .25mg ed

2 Weeks After last shot

PCT Nolvadex/Kessar
Day 1-14 20mg ed
Day 15-28 10mg ed [/quote]

Are you not going to have a stasis period? Do you think that arimidex will be necessary for the 2 weeks between the last shot and your PCT?
I know what beat says about nolvadex and doses higher than 20mg, but i find that for me personally, i have gotten better libido results in the past from 40mg ED than from 20mg ED… may be worth trying when you are at that point. It wont hurt IMO… :slight_smile:

JJ

[quote] Brook wrote:
Are you not going to have a stasis period? Do you think that arimidex will be necessary for the 2 weeks between the last shot and your PCT?
I know what beat says about nolvadex and doses higher than 20mg, but i find that for me personally, i have gotten better libido results in the past from 40mg ED than from 20mg ED… may be worth trying when you are at that point. It wont hurt IMO… :slight_smile:

JJ[/quote]

~He’s not using the stasis taper, if he was I would say there would be no need for the Nolvadex, just one more drug to cause sides at that point; why have a longer period for triglyerides to recover? and I don’t like to idea of using it during a taper anyway, it seems like a “just in case” stategy which is usually senseless imo

~Estrogen is not going to lower much a few days after the last shot, and not the first week either - the arimidex is for estrogen control and precaution until the Nolvadex is started which would then act as a mild control as well as it’s intended benefits. Arimidex also raises testosterone, better than Nolvadex, so it’s also a pre-pct period as we don’t want to risk lower estrogen too much during recovery and risk all that extra heart trouble.

~Personally Nolvadex decreases my libido, but then again I’m not the best person to recommend or not as I don’t tend to use it. I guess he should experiment if 20mg isn’t working or just try it and see if it offers him a greater benefit.

like it… thanks beat.

the only part i disagree on is the use of nolvadex (or any SERM, just i just say tamox as it is the most common, torem may be better) during the taper - however seeing as he isnt using this method, i’ll save it for another time!

:wink:

Hi

Guys sorry there was suppose to be a link in there that talked about proviron and its use as an Ai before arimidex that was the thread i was referring to

BLOW UP MOTHER FUCKERS AND SUCK MY BEAST HOES!!!11

I let a so called friend at a bar use on line name i did not write that bull shit!

Any who if some one could please erase that i would be in your debt.

P.S never trust a stranger.

THE JUDGE

if it is your account judge - you should be able to…!

I’ll look into that tomorrow it’s been a long day sigh-ugh-narugh partner