T Nation

NK Nuclear Program Continues

#1

I know it all is most likely just Fake News…and it comes from those losers in U.S. Intelligence…but I thought I’d post it to get you guys take anyway…

“…U.S. intelligence agencies believe that North Korea has increased its production of fuel for nuclear weapons at multiple secret sites in recent months — and that Kim Jong Un may try to hide those facilities as he seeks more concessions in nuclear talks with the Trump administration, U.S. officials told NBC News…”

"The intelligence assessment; which has not previously been reported; seems to counter the sentiments expressed by President Donald Trump, who tweeted after his historic June 12 summit with Kim that “there was no longer a nuclear threat from North Korea.”

"Analysts at the CIA and other intelligence agencies don’t see it that way, according to more than a dozen American officials who are familiar with their assessments and spoke on the condition of anonymity. ’

"They see a regime positioning itself to extract every concession it can from the Trump administration — while clinging to nuclear weapons it believes are essential to survival."

@loppar?

Others?

(No real surprise to me…or to those losers in U.S. Intelligence…but what do they know,right?..)

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#2

So a ruthless dictator took advantage of a sheltered, clueless and naive real estate developer who relied on his “gut instinct” and refused to listed to any kind of input beforehand? Shocking! Shocking! Shocking! Who could have predicted that?

Apart from literally everyone - I think on this forum alone there were a hundred pages on Trump’s inability to handle foreign policy.

All those Europeans and that Canadian guy are so mean to me, and Kim and Vladimir are sooo nice! I want to hang out with those guys!

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#3

The arrogance to me is Trump boasting that “all” any President had to do before him was to get “tough” with North Korea (like he did)…and they would do his will…

Right.

#4

Not only that, but the actual document is more vague that the one Kim’s daddy signed with Madeleine Albright, also committing to “eventual denuclearization”

But Trump’s deranged negotiating tactics actually make perfect sense if you don’t consider him as a head of state but a reality TV star - he’ll promise anything, make all concessions about boring political stuff he (and his base?) don’t care about, even telegraphing them well ahead of the summit in exchange for good television - smiles, handshakes, pats on the back between two formerly implacable enemies and a fake great success.

Because Fox News will scream about Trump’s amazing statesmanship and only fake news deep state agents will actually read the communiques.

And if he was fooled by a bizarre figure that is Kim imagine what we’ll happen when he’ll be alone for two hours with a KGB agent.

Russian State TV is claiming that Putin is preparing a two-hour educational briefing for Trump to explain to him who are the real enemies of USA (hint: Canada, Western Europe), something that the “deep state” allegedly is keeping a secret from him.

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#5

No more missile tests lately.

What have you guys contributed to the situation?

Snark and cynicism? If that ever solved anything we’d already be living in a leftist utopia.

#6

Which were Kim Jong Un’s visible means to get Trump to the table in order to “negotiate”.

Not sure who “you guys” refers to; but if it’s U.S. Intelligence against the word of Trump; I’ll take the former…

Are you kidding me? The Right has plenty, with some to spare. (Have you listened to Fox in say, oh, the past ten years; and to Trump himself? Or read a week’s worth of Tweet’s from the P-O-T-U-S?).

Trump has taken snark,cynicism and vitriol to a whole new level.

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#7

And no missile tests before that, during the lulls in the “we’re all crazy” routine.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/2009/08/04/bill-clinton-meets-with-kim-jong-il-on-mission-to-win-release-journalists.html

From almost ten years ago:

North Korea’s official Korean Central News Agency announced Clinton’s visit with a brief dispatch but did not say who he would be meeting during his trip.

But analysts say Kim Jong Il is eager to smooth over relations with Washington as he prepares to name a successor.

Kim, 67, reportedly is in ill health, suffering a stroke a year ago on top of chronic diabetes and heart disease. He rules the impoverished communist nation of 24 million with absolute authority, but has not publicly named the next leader. He is believed, however, to be grooming his third son, 26-year-old Jong Un, to take over.

Internal stability is key to a smooth transition, and establishing relations with Washington would be one way to rule out a threat from a superpower that has 28,500 troops stationed just on the other side of the border with South Korea, analysts said. The two Koreas remain technically at war because their three-year conflict ended in a truce, not a peace treaty, in 1953.

Releasing the journalists would be a face-saving segue into talks, analysts said.

During a nuclear standoff with North Korean in 1994, former President Jimmy Carter went to Pyongyang and met with leader Kim Il Sung, Kim Jong Il’s late father. That visit, during Clinton’s presidency, led to a breakthrough accord months later.

The last high-ranking U.S. official to meet with Kim Jong Il was Madeleine Albright, Clinton’s secretary of state, who visited Pyongyang in 2000 at a time of warming relations. Ties turned frosty when George W. Bush took office in the White House in 2001.

Since Obama took office, Pyongyang has expressed interest in one-on-one negotiations with Washington. The latest provocations were seen in part as a way to draw a concerned U.S. into bilateral talks.

“Denuclearization”, “freeze of missile tests” etc. - this is now the third (fourth?) repeat of the same themes in the last 30 years - the only difference is that there was a tv-friendly summit.

#8

You guys. Yinz. The two of you.

Masterful statesmen that you and Loppar are, what would you have done to bring Kim to the table and end his aspirations of nuclear capability?

I’m of the opinion that he isn’t going to stop. That bell will not be unrung. It could even be debated (and has been) that NK has every right to nucyaler armaments. So we put on a political dog and pony show to recognize NK as a nuclear capable state and he stopped firing missiles. Is that not good enough for you, or were you expecting complete denuclearization with anything less to be considered a failure?

#9

Then we agree…

And contrary to Trump’s declarations; we DO still have to worry about North Korea’s Nuclear Program…

(Now…on to the Russian “Summit”…)

#10

Right. Just as we would had any other candidate taken the office.

Barring an outright war wherein we actually kill the leadership and all of the mechanisms (including scientists and engineers) by which the nuclear capabilities are developed, this was going to be a concern anyways.

So what difference does it make that it was Trumps dog and pony show and not Hillary, John Kerry, Gary Johnson, or Ted Cruz?

#11

Completely off topic- Discovery channel changed the narrator on “How It’s Made” to a female. That’s fucked up. This episode on evaporative cooling towers is Ruined!

#12

Yeah, but:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/06/30/north-korea-believed-to-be-deceiving-us-increasing-nuclear-production-report.html

The difference is, none of them would have given away US-SK joint military exercises for free. Nor would they have heaped praise upon Kim.

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#13

In the context of 'potus torching relationships with non dictators" it just seems kind of alarming that Kim is the great guy in the world.

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#14

Yes. I’ve visited Seoul and from talking to people there my (probably very limited) understanding is that South Koreans do not fear a nuclear attack by NK but a sudden conventional strike that could cause untold casualties.

Seoul is in the range of NK heavy artillery and they we’ve been stockpiling tubes and shells for decades ready for a such scenario.

And US-SK war games were a major deterrent.

#15

@EyeDentist

I just wanted you to know that it didn’t go unnoticed that you posted an article for a “real” news source!

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#16

Trump “negotiates” with Kim (which means they agreed on what to order for lunch) and declares world peace. Kim then returns to NK and they continue to do what they have been doing. Trump comes out and says that Kim was dishonest and didn’t play fair (too bad this isn’t about a golf course or he would have gotten his lawyers involved). The stage is now set for military action.

#17

Anyone think Putin advised Kim to fire those missiles this week to put pressure on Trump or to make him look bad?

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#18

Of course he did. Since the POTUS regularly announces on Twitter how much he personally invested into reaching a deal with Kim, the list of humiliating “concessions” that China and Russia will ask from Trump for reigning in Kim is getting bigger by the day.

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#19

Absolutely. No one should have any illusions that Trump’s self promotion as a master deal maker is anything but a sham. Among his litany of foreign policy blunders, his unilateral erosion of efforts to combat nuclear proliferation are among the worst. Whether it’s accelerating a new nuclear arms race with Russia, the abdication of the Iranian Nuclear Deal, or naive, maximalist demands of North Korea, Trump has set the US and her allies back years if not decades.

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