T Nation

Nicotene, Caffeine, and Testosterone

I just started TRT with a new Doc - injecting 200mg test cyp each week. Mine was low. I am 47. Test level was 322. It has been 4 weeks since 1st shot. Should I be feeling this yet ? OH, I am also taking .5mg arimidex on M, W, F and will do this for 10 weeks and tghen do HCG for 2 weeks, take blood tests, get teh test amt adjusted if necessary to brin my levels up to 900-1200 and start the next 10 week cycle. I think that is the way it will work. And maybe HGH and DHEA if those are low.

Doc convinced me to give up coffee and cigs. I did. I feel the need for the stimulus though - the coffee at least.

Are their big negative effects from drinking coffee on my test levels now ? Say, 1-2 cups a day maybe.

And how does smoking cigarettes affect that test level ?

Caffeine and cigarettes are neutostimulants. They should not have any effect on your Testosterone levels.

You may want to start reading some of the useful posts in the “Over 35 Lifter” forum.

Did the doctor advise to give up cigs and coffee because of how they affect your test levels? Or was it just a general health issue that he wanted to get you off them?

I do not know if either will effect test levels one of the guys here will probably know and let you know.

I gave up cigs quite easily but I struggle without my caffine, I end up turning to chocolate!

I can’t see how a few cups a day will harm you, besides you are on TRT now so you are getting a steady supply of test anyway.

I have never heard of caffeine affecting estrogen or test levels. I drink plenty of coffee and I seem to be alright. Anecdotal but it seems like if this were any kind of issue it would have come up before.

Cigarettes, now, are terrible. Good for you for quitting. I smoked for over 10 years myself (13-23) and quitting was the best thing I ever did.

If memory serves caffeine does increase, at least transiently, estradriol levels.

He wants you to quit smoking for obvious reasons IMO, the caffeine may be more of a BP issue or something.

[quote]Cortes wrote:
I have never heard of caffeine affecting estrogen or test levels. I drink plenty of coffee and I seem to be alright. Anecdotal but it seems like if this were any kind of issue it would have come up before.

Cigarettes, now, are terrible. Good for you for quitting. I smoked for over 10 years myself (13-23) and quitting was the best thing I ever did.[/quote]

Caffeine is actually quite notorious for increasing estradiol levels.

[quote]Dopamineloveaffa wrote:
Cortes wrote:
I have never heard of caffeine affecting estrogen or test levels. I drink plenty of coffee and I seem to be alright. Anecdotal but it seems like if this were any kind of issue it would have come up before.

Cigarettes, now, are terrible. Good for you for quitting. I smoked for over 10 years myself (13-23) and quitting was the best thing I ever did.

Caffeine is actually quite notorious for increasing estradiol levels.[/quote]

Uh-oh. Looks like I’m in trouble then.

[quote]zdragonslayer wrote:
I just started TRT with a new Doc - injecting 200mg test cyp each week. Mine was low. I am 47. Test level was 322. It has been 4 weeks since 1st shot. Should I be feeling this yet ? OH, I am also taking .5mg arimidex on M, W, F and will do this for 10 weeks and tghen do HCG for 2 weeks, take blood tests, get teh test amt adjusted if necessary to brin my levels up to 900-1200 and start the next 10 week cycle. I think that is the way it will work. And maybe HGH and DHEA if those are low.

Doc convinced me to give up coffee and cigs. I did. I feel the need for the stimulus though - the coffee at least.

Are their big negative effects from drinking coffee on my test levels now ? Say, 1-2 cups a day maybe.

And how does smoking cigarettes affect that test level ?[/quote]

Does your MD really have you taking 1.5mg of A-dex a week to combat the estrogen conversion of 200mg of Cyp?

[quote]sapasion wrote:
Does your MD really have you taking 1.5mg of A-dex a week to combat the estrogen conversion of 200mg of Cyp?[/quote]

Yes, why ? It is cheap. He said a mg would do. To save money he gave me a script of 1mg pills and told me to cut them in half. I am overweight and am having a hard time getting it off. I used to be able to drop lbs easily. Maybe that is why.

I am 5’8 and 265 lbs. I can bench 450 raw, squat 480 and DL 485 (started benching in 2002 at age 42 and squats and DLs at age 44 in 2004). I want to get down to 220 or 198 or hell I will take 242 right now.

He also told me to quit smoking (as I mentioned), quit all diet sodas and caffeine, give up fried foods and fast foods, eat lean meats, lots of veggies and fruit and only drink water. I have done this for 5 weeks and will go back to him in 5 more to re-evaluate.

The problem is, after 5 weeks, I have not lost a lb. My waist lost an inch though - a notch in the belt. I no longer have the cigs or caffeine as stimulants I guess. In the past everytime I quit smoking I gained 15 lbs of fat. This time I have nto gained anything but have not lost anything either. It sucks. I am adding coffee back in and more cardio - I continue to lift weights 3 days a week at least though. Seems like I might be recovering quicker. Not sure. I hope he bumps my dose up in April when I go back. Should I feel a greater sense of well-being yet ?
or what should I feel from the test ?

Thanks for all the replies fellows !

at 200mg a week im afraid your not really going to feel anything.

Your overweight, good for you for doing something about it, but this may contribute to your general feeling of wellbeing, and you will find that when the weight does start coming off you, the wellbeing will increase with each pound of fat.

If your dose is bumped up then you may notice a difference though.
I would also bring up the adex with your doc.
I dont take that much a week when i use 4 times the amount of test!!

all the best

[quote]testanabol wrote:
at 200mg a week im afraid your not really going to feel anything.

[/quote]

It all depends. Lately I inject 250mg (2Xweekly) at a time and I can feel mood, sexual and bloating effects at or before the second shot of the cycle. I think I am sensitive to all drugs though. Also I can say for sure that 200mg a week will be very effective at sparing muscle while the OP loses weight. So he’s got that to look for too.

i wouldnt worry too much about the weight loss for now, you did say you lost an inch from your waste line so that is a start of progress in the right direction i would suggest you try to figure out your b/f%-lbm and total daily diet intake…

dieting is a hard thing to do!yes but a diet is…knowing what amounts of carbs,cals,protein, and fats you consume! after that name it whatever diet you want.

as for me I love my stimulants…btw do you have blood pressure problems?

Yes on the BP problems - only slightly high though and not at all with medication. I take atacand for it 16mg. It goes down when I get around 220 lbs though.

I am interested as to why your doctor has asked you to stop drinking diet soda.

My father is chronically obese and he received the same advice from his doctor, but I never understood just why that is.

If you get chance, please ask your doc whats so bad about diest soda, cheers

He said that aspartame and all artificial sweeteners are poison, basically. And something about drinking more than 1 liter of diet drinks a day affects prolactin levels, which decrease test. I do not understand much about hormones yet but somehow they can make you fat and affect your health negatively. He told me to only drink water. He does so himself.

The Doctor was an interesting fellow. He is an old man (I’d say 70ish), but agile and spry - does a lot of bicycling. That is what he is into. He is kinda short and told me he used to weigh 220. Now he weighs 165 or so. He has an MD, PhD and is a noted surgeon. He usually just treats other physicians. I had written him a long letter explaining my fatigue and faxed him 12 pages of recent blood tests I had other doctros do. He called me right away and had me in his office. Gave me a 200mg injection of test right away and hande me a 10ml vial and all the pins and stuff.

He told me stories of being interested in longevity and hormones, so he went to China and Switzerland to anti-aging clinics for a few weeks or a month at a time. He said he saw old men 100 yrs old playing tennis and riding bicycles -long-distance. He was amazed at what he saw. I do not remember all the details but he does test himself and HGH. I think he is into DHEA too. He told me to exercise as much as possible - cardio and weights, give up fast foods and deserts (all refined sugar), anything low-fat, all fried foods, caffeine, cigarettes, alcohol, etc…

He walked out with me as it was the end of the day and he had an apple in his hand and a bottle of water. Very cool guy. When I go back in April he will give me HCG for 2 weeks and take all the blood tests I did not have done and the other applicable ones and maybe adjust the T to get my level to 900-1200 (rather than the 322 it was) and check the IGF-1 and see if I might need some HGH and/or other hormones (probaby DHEA).

Here is one thing on his pamphlets that is interesting:
"Interestingly, a sea gull ages all at once - the last few weeks of its life. A thirty-year-old gull can fly as high, attack a school of fish and bear or father baby chicks as well as a one-year-old gull. Its pituitary hormone levels don’t fall until just before its death.

In humans, the aging process starts early and by age 40, our pituitary hormones have drastically fallen over 50%. Notably, growth hormone (GH) and DHEA levels decline each year of life."

He is into preventative care rather than managed care and thinks you should live a high quality vital life up until you die - quality years. And this can be achieved with hormones and clean living and eating. He was big into fruit, vegetables, healthy fats, and even lost of lean meats and fish.

nice, i dont suppose hes in tampa florida…lol

No, NC - not too far up the Eastern Seaboard.

Thanks a lot for posting that info.

I was always curious as to why diet soda’s might be bad, I mean some do not contain caffine, I even posted a thread asking about wht diet soda is bad called ‘whats so bad about bubbles?’

Cheers Zdragon

[quote]zdragonslayer wrote:
He said that aspartame and all artificial sweeteners are poison, basically. And something about drinking more than 1 liter of diet drinks a day affects prolactin levels, which decrease test. I do not understand much about hormones yet but somehow they can make you fat and affect your health negatively. He told me to only drink water. He does so himself.

The Doctor was an interesting fellow. He is an old man (I’d say 70ish), but agile and spry - does a lot of bicycling. That is what he is into. He is kinda short and told me he used to weigh 220. Now he weighs 165 or so. He has an MD, PhD and is a noted surgeon. He usually just treats other physicians. I had written him a long letter explaining my fatigue and faxed him 12 pages of recent blood tests I had other doctros do. He called me right away and had me in his office. Gave me a 200mg injection of test right away and hande me a 10ml vial and all the pins and stuff.

He told me stories of being interested in longevity and hormones, so he went to China and Switzerland to anti-aging clinics for a few weeks or a month at a time. He said he saw old men 100 yrs old playing tennis and riding bicycles -long-distance. He was amazed at what he saw. I do not remember all the details but he does test himself and HGH. I think he is into DHEA too. He told me to exercise as much as possible - cardio and weights, give up fast foods and deserts (all refined sugar), anything low-fat, all fried foods, caffeine, cigarettes, alcohol, etc…

He walked out with me as it was the end of the day and he had an apple in his hand and a bottle of water. Very cool guy. When I go back in April he will give me HCG for 2 weeks and take all the blood tests I did not have done and the other applicable ones and maybe adjust the T to get my level to 900-1200 (rather than the 322 it was) and check the IGF-1 and see if I might need some HGH and/or other hormones (probaby DHEA).

Here is one thing on his pamphlets that is interesting:
"Interestingly, a sea gull ages all at once - the last few weeks of its life. A thirty-year-old gull can fly as high, attack a school of fish and bear or father baby chicks as well as a one-year-old gull. Its pituitary hormone levels don’t fall until just before its death.

In humans, the aging process starts early and by age 40, our pituitary hormones have drastically fallen over 50%. Notably, growth hormone (GH) and DHEA levels decline each year of life."

He is into preventative care rather than managed care and thinks you should live a high quality vital life up until you die - quality years. And this can be achieved with hormones and clean living and eating. He was big into fruit, vegetables, healthy fats, and even lost of lean meats and fish.
[/quote]

Wow, i wish to meet a doctor like him when i’m in my 50’s! Thanks