Nice Guys Finish Last

I read a post about a guy getting messed around by a girl… and although this doesnt necesarilly have to do with his particular post it has to do with women and there outlook on guys. I know it can be a little bit of a generalization but in my experiences and im sure in most guys, it holds tru. Sorry T-vixens dont beat me to hard for this…

By: Garrett Hols

It?s amazing that assholes can get girls. Actually, now that I think of it, it?s not that amazing. They are assholes at heart, but to meet girls they lavish their undying love. IT?S A CHARADE. They act nice, friendly, and they listen? until they get into what they?re after. Their prey thinks they are in love with them, however when they realize what assholes their predators really are, they pretend like the asshole is really nice inside.
The girl tries to change the asshole into a nice guy, but assholes will always be assholes. She gets upset and goes to the nice guy to complain about the asshole. But she claims to love the asshole? now this is where the theory begins. She doesn?t want to look like she is easy so she wont dump the asshole right away, instead she will stay with the asshole. Girls are idiots. They don?t realize that the nice guy has been there all along. He never had to pretend to be a good guy to get girls because he is naturally like that. 
However, girls don?t see it for some reason or another. They look at the nice guy as a friend, a trusted companion to whom they can tell their sad story to about their asshole boyfriend.  The problem is that since he is a nice guy he keeps listening. Since girls get attached to things that pay attention to them, they think of the nice guy as a friend. A FRIEND. They don?t say, ?Oh he?s hot? or ?I want to have his children? about the nice guy, they just want the emotional support. When they get the emotional support from the nice guy, they don?t need it from the asshole. The nice guy gets the shit end of the stick while the asshole gets all the action. I am starting to wonder if being a nice guy is really the route to take. 
I have been down this path for all of my post-pubescent life and it has gotten me NOWHERE? at least not in the women department. Perhaps another reason why girls fall for the asshole is because assholes ignore the girl they are with. The women wonder, ?Why isn?t he paying attention to me?? so they explore why. They poke and prod and get closer to the asshole. They start to get easier with each attempt to get closer. The asshole finally says, ?I?ve let this beauty dangle long enough, time to boat this bass?. It is then he puts on his charade and the girl feels like she has won him? even thought all she has won is an asshole. Once you have gone down the path as a nice guy or a ?listener? you can?t turn back. 
The girl will always go after the assholes because there are always nice guys there to listen. Once you realize that you are a ?listener? you cant do anything about it? just pack up and close shop. . There is and never will be a situation where the nice guy will get the girl he has a crush on. It just doesn?t work like that. The girl wont ?come to her senses? and realize what an asshole her boyfriend is like in the movies? instead she will just go after another asshole, and unless you stop being a nice guy, she will never go after you. Women complain that there are no nice guys in the world. Right. They are obviously not looking hard enough because there are nice guys EVERYWHERE!!!! Girls aren?t looking for nice guys? they say they are but they?re not. They are looking for the perfect asshole, but there is NO SUCH THING as the perfect asshole. All in all, the nice guy gets the shaft. 

To all the girls out there with boyfriends that don?t treat you with respect, that don?t listen to you, and that don?t care about you I say this; look next to you. The guy that has been standing next to you the whole time is the guy you have been looking for. He is what you want your asshole to be like. He knows more about you than you know about yourself? because he has listened to it all.

This has been discussed many times here, but the truth is, nice guys don’t finish last, door mats finish last. Don’t confuse the two. You can be a nice guy and not put up with nonsense at the same time, plain and simple. In general, people get what they choose. If you get walked over it’s because you chose to. If you make the decision that you deserve better, you will get better.

agreed 100% Magnus.

Some of my friends are carpets and they almost force their girlfriends to walk all over them!

It drives me nuts!

…and when they get dumped or screwed around (How can a girl respect/want to date a carpet?) they always cry the “nice guys finish last routine”

Fuck there are a lot of whining pussys out there. ‘I’m a nice guy and I get shat on’. Get buff, be confident, don’t take shit from anyone, and you can still be nice. Nice does not equal whining pathetic pussy.

“The guy that has been standing next to you the whole time is the guy you have been looking for. He is what you want your asshole to be like. He knows more about you than you know about yourself? because he has listened to it all”

Or maybe he’s the world’s creepiest mangina and she just doesn’t like him!

Give me a break. A spineless jelly-backed yes-man who lurks around waiting for you to get dumped so he can hop on and take you for a test drive is not a “nice guy”, he’s a bigger asshole than than the one your are with.

I just got married a week ago and I can attest to what magnus said. i used to think nice guys finished last. then I developed a lot more confidence and made some concrete goals for my life low and behold less than a year later i was engaged. same thing happened to a best friend of mine. girls want nice guys but they also want a spine.

A note on “assholes”.

I have come to the conclusion that man’s greatest fault perhaps (and at time greatest asset) is his insecurity. In an effort to save both my time and yours, I will take this as a given and could debate this at a later time if needed but moving swiftly along…

In a world of insecurity, we are always taught to see ourselves and everything else around us as less than we and they are. Some call it modesty, but that is the best and most dangerous euphimism society has invested in. When asked, “are you a good cook?” you might think “Yeah, I am pretty damn good at cooking” but in order not to come off as ‘cocky’ or an ‘asshole’, you immediately degrade yourself and say “I’m not bad I guess, nothing to write home about but I know how to make a thing or two.” Try saying that for a year and see if you don’t honestly start to believe it. Start to believe it though and you certainly can’t say it; that’d make you ‘cocky’. Instead, now “Well, I am okay, I mean I can make your basic dishes but I am not that creative.” Say that another year and see where that takes ya. You get the drift.

Now lets talk about others. Ever met someone who will tell you just how good they are when you ask them? First class asshole right? If that is how you want to think about it, but in reality, if they are telling you how good they are and no more and no less, they are simply confident in their ability. If you are asked how much you bench, you don’t lower your numbers right? Most people actually will add 5 or 15 pounds or whatever they feel necessary to be competitive, that in my opinion is rather shawdy, but for someone who only responds with his abilities, I for one can find no fault with him. So what makes him an asshole? The simple fact that just like we must lower ourselves, we must lower and raise other’s accordingly. It is no fun to think “Hmm, 99% of the world is damn insecure and only 1% are really confident in their abilities.” Instead, we do some advanced logarithms and refit the curve so that the majority of humanity is normal, the very insecure only slightly insecure, and the extremely insecure pretty insecure. What happens with the top of the curve though? It doesn’t just disappear? That guy who was only slightly insecure and not too modest is now considered very confident and a bit arrogant and the people who actually are self secure and confident, not ashamed of their abilities and talents… well those are now the real assholes of society: they think they are better than everyone else comparitively only because we think we are worse than everyone else.

Women do not go for assholes, but they sure do go for confidence. In fact, everyone does. If you ‘hate’ someone who is confident, deep down you are probably pretty damn jealous of them. Who are the real assholes then if the guy who ‘admits’ to being capable of doing things not everyoen else can do isn’t? It’s the guy at your gym who will leave 2 45s on the bar he was deadlifting with so that the unfortunate 17 year girl who is supposed to make sure the area stays clean has to put it away. He doesn’t even think about hte fac that she doesn’t work out and so lifting the 45 plate is pretty hard. Nor does he think that with it on the ground, she would have to either lift the whole end of the bar (90+ lbs) with one hand while sliding the plate off, or deadlift the bar and put it on a rack to strip it. Nope, he doesn’t think about it, and she just sits there, desperately hoping someone else will use it because she knows she cant even though its her job. It’s the guy that knows a lane is ending in 500 feet and he needs to merge over, but seeing that traffic is pretty bad, rides all the way to the end of lane and tries to get ahead of everyone else who merged when they were supposed to. Those are the real assholes in life, and women don’t go for that and neither does anyone else. The only people who do are so desperately insecure that even in today’s society they would be consider “somewhat insecure”. And that is pretty damn insecure.

Don’t blame the women because you’re a wussy.

All my friends are basically ‘nice’ guys, some get putang and some don’t. But it ain’t because they’re either nice or not nice, it’s because they’ve either got game or they don’t. ‘Nice’ guys who complain about not getting pussy are just lazy…or stupid…or lazy and stupid.

Yeah… I’ll have to agree with everybody else here. Nice guys don’t finish last. Cowards do. That nice guy “waiting in the wings” being that emotional support for the girl just needs to speak up, and then maybe the girl will see him as something other than an ear to talk to. A good saying: “Faint heart never won fair lady.”

so what do you guys suggest that a nice guy should do as a plan of action? I think I fall into this category, but I am by no means a doormat, and I am not really that shoulder chicks cry on… somebody said something about laziness, I think this is the category I fall into. What should be done!


I’ve found out, (after years of being a door mat myself) you can be an incredible sucess with women by being lazy. If somebody rags on you, beats you up, talks smack, etc., shrug it off. pay no attention to your tormentor. chicks find that to be more ballsey than beating the ever-loving shit out of him, and also proves you are more intelectual than that low-brow neanderthal. the two things girls like most are balls and brains, so flop em’ out!


  1. Find some chick you like
  2. Be funny/confident/smart/fun
  3. If #2 didn’t work, see step #1

Not exactly brain surgery. Women are not all that complicated. Just like us.

Well Nate. IMHO -and if we have read any of the other women related posts I am in… my opinion may not mean too much;)- You have to take an objective step back and ask yourself, are you really lazy, or are you forced into laziness because you don’t want to be rejected, because hey… who wants that?
I will assume for the sake of this post, that I am right. And if you were truly lazy, you probably wouldn’t lift anyways, so we are striking out the lazy factor.
The best advice I can give is to care less, about “IT ALL”. Care less about picking up a girl, care less about saying something witty, care less about looking stupid. Caring about those things makes you nervous and that just makes you perform poorly, and that is all picking up a girl truly is, a performance; you show them exactly what you think they want to see in hopes that they will be so awestruck by your rugged manliness that they will not be able to contain themselves and take you into the bathroom and make passionate love to you in a public place (or something along those lines)
Now that isn’t a bad thing, most everybody does it (the performance, not the bathroom loving). But as soon as you start thinking about it, then you have failed before you started.
Think about it this way, when you are talking to a semi-attractive girl, you are probably funny and smart and a heck of a good time, but when you get around a drop dead gorgeous girl, you start thinking about what to say, thinking about where to look, thinking about this that and the other thing, and when you finally leave this girl, you are a nervous wreck, and you probably screwed up everything you tried to so with this girl.
If you care less, about everything, you will be just like you are with the girl that is only semi-attractive, and being calm smacks of confidence.
but then again maybe you are just lazy, and if so… smarten up man.

If that made any sense at all, then you are smarter than me. And I wrote it.

[quote]lothario1132 wrote:

  1. Find some chick you like
  2. Be funny/confident/smart/fun
  3. If #2 didn’t work, see step #1

Not exactly brain surgery. Women are not all that complicated. Just like us.[/quote]

Ill second that. Ill also second about Caring less about It All.

Have you ever landed a deal you never thought you could?

Have you ever charmed a Babe you thought you had no chance?

Have you ever been surprised when you got a job even though you felt that the interview went so-so?

Arent you surprised when miracles` happen?

Until I understood that Posture was the common thread connecting all of these surprises, I couldn`t get to understand the link with Niceguys, Jerks, and Babes.

What I mean by Posture is all that non-verbal communication. How you say it. The Confidence, the Sparkle in your eyes. The Spirit of I know Ill get it`, even if you have no idea how you will AT THE MOMENT, but still believe that you can do the job far more that you cannot.

You could call it Stoicism-to-your-inner-doubts + Confidence-shining-through. Like the Duck saying: Be calm, cool, and collected on the surface, but pedal like there`s no tomorrow.

Some guy once noted that 93% of communication was non-verbal. My experience is that he was absolutely right.

People buying from you, whether love, advice, stuff, whatever, are secretly asking to be led. They wont buy from the Wuss. They do love people who appear to be successful, they want the additional peace of mind that comes from buying from the Leader, and Body Language is their main way of assessing the sellers intent or Trustworthyness.

Bottom line. It`s (almost) all in the Delivery. Words are not that important. Posture is.

(You want proof? Take this long-winded post. It would never sell. Because I explain it too much, even though its to prevent confusion. Id have far better chances of convincing you if I went at it step-by-step and targeted. That`s what Jerks do. They keep it short, simple, predictible, get the Babes all bothered, and let the Babes wonder and doubt. And the Babes come back and ask for more. No chance of that happening with a Nerd.)

    There is an old legend about a big dog who saw a little dog chasing its tail and asked, "Why are you chasing your tail?" The puppy answered, "I have mastered philosophy; I have solved the problems of the universe which no dog before me has rightly solved; I have learned that the best thing for a dog is happiness, and that happiness is my tail. Therefore I am chasing it; and when I catch it I will have happiness." The old dog said, "My son, I, too, have judged that happiness is a fine thing for a dog, and that happiness is in my tail. But I have noticed that when I chase after it, it keeps running away from me, but when I go about my business, it comes after me."

The key is to be a nice guy and an asshole.

It works great for me. Asshole is my middle name, as I’ve been told by numerous women I’ve dated over the years. But it sure seems to work, as I’ve dated many wonderful and beautiful women.

My girlfriend and I have been together for more than 2 1/2 years, and she’s always telling me what an asshole I am. :slight_smile:

Hey guys, I appreciate all the responses, I really do, it gives me something to think about, something new to try, something other than lifting weights and wondering why I cant get a girl.

Let me give you guys some history. For about 18 years of my life, I was this nice wussy guy, who freaked out when any chick talked to him. Then I started lifting weights, got a little NASTIER and tougher. ok fine good. I just recently mastered this game of like talking to a girl being funny/smart/confident/fun. I can talk to any girl now without feeling that nervousness I normally would feel. I am past that stage. I can actually flirt/ do that mean playful assholeness thing, but finally getting past that stage of nothingness where girls would have nothing to do with me, I find myself CONTINUALLY falling into the FRIEND STAGE.

No they dont cry on my shoulder, but often times I get referred to as the dreaded and proverbial “Buddy.” This is a problem. BIG PROBLEM. Sometimes I think the problem is that I am too funny. Believe me, I am really damn funny, its overrated with the girls. Almost as if you are too funny, it takes away your edge, that X-factor. Like a chick dating a comedian. Robin Williams, Mike Myers, John Lovitiz, Whoopie Goldberg, these peopel DO NOT HAVE HOT WIFES. Maybe successful marriages, but im not looking for that at this moment at time. I am sick of being “future husband material.” Takes away that whole mysterious thing.

I guess my real question is now that ive made the transition from total loser to guy who can basically talk to any chick if he really wants to, HOW CAN I GET PHYSICAL with these WOMEN. In the past 6 months Ive gotten more attention from girls in my entire life, BUT I CANT GET PHYSICAL. I can talk a girl up like I am Brad Pitt, but when it comes to physical, quite simply i am DAVID SPADE. AND THIS IS RATHER FRUSTRATING. Its almost like I havent evolved into that guy who gets girls yet. Im like in stage 2 of the process. I know how to be aggressive with words but not with the actual PHYSICALITY OF IT ALL!!! I havent devloped these tools yet… Maybe I just need to get buffer and do more pullups and dips and deadlifts.

Your thoughts would be great!

Guys who continually obsess about being “too nice” and losing the hot chicks to “assholes” are in reality either: 1. not good looking enough; 2. lack confidence; 3. have no money or a crappy job; or 4. are attracted to women WAY out of their league.

Don’t hate the “asshole.” Figure out what he’s got, and do it better.

AWESOME!!! With the Whoopi Goldberg not having a hot wife… that’s just quality.

Anyways, I am going to regurgitate some info that was given to me, being too funny all the time is like a signal of desperation, a ‘look-at-me’ sign on your back, if you will. So you just need to tone down the funny, and be serious at least some of the time.