T Nation

Newbie on TRT, Feeling Lightheaded and Foggy After Injection


#7

As long as you have the testosterone injections you can inject when you want.
My Endocrinologist told me 200 mg every two weeks. I asked if I can to weekly and he reluctantly agreed but he didn’t I was doing it anyway.
Then I did 50 two times a week and felt better. He doesn’t know I do that and it didn’t event ask since he reluctantly agreed to 1x a week.

Good bless Alex!

This will be even tougher for you going through this great stress with your hormonal imbalance.
One thing at a time.
Where do you live?


#8

Charlie - great info! We live in North Atlanta and have some great doctors and nurses for him! We hope to be done with chemo treatments in October.

I’m fairly good at “blocking things out” (for the most part) but if anything, this injection on Friday has really made me lethargic/very “cloudy” in the head. Just struggling to focus and run my business.

Are you taking anything to keep your E2 in check or don’t have any issues with E2? Have you taken HCG? Curious to know what supplements you take? I’m just taking a multi-vitamin but will be doing more and more research on this site. It’s somewhat info overload so at times, it’s overwhelming.

Where do you live? How long have you been on TRT?


#9

Am 41. Live in NYC area.
I tried HCG and did not like how I felt. Appeared to have high e2 symptoms.

I used an AI a few times and all time I crashed my e2. Some are over responders. I have not taken an ai for several weeks. My e2 is currently in the low 30s and appear to have no symptoms for high e2. But low 30s is high normal anyway. I take a zinc supplement, vit D, and a multi. Also Cialis daily (3mg) to make sure I can get it up when I want without worrying if am perfectly dialed in.
Zinc and cruciferous veggies suppose to help e2.

Everyone is different.

It would have been good to get complete labs before you started trt. Now that you introduced outside testosterone your bOdy will stop producing it on its own. So you may have a couple of weeks of not feeling right before you get better.
I started trt in December. Other guys on here have been doing it much longer and will hopefully chime in.

But keep reading when you can.


#10

thanks KSman - tons of great info that I need to read over a few times and do my research to full understand everything. I’ll definitely read the stickies. I certainly don’t want to burden the forum nor be lazy! I clearly went about this ENTIRELY the wrong way and now not 100% on what I should do. I could only see the urologist at 2:20 tomorrow - wondering if I should hold off on any lab tests until another morning?

Will try trazadone as well as 5-6 mg time release melatonin.

My mother has battled hyperactive thyroid issues so I’ll discuss this with my doctor tomorrow.

I may not be getting my dietary requirements …especially in the morning. Today I had oatmeal and some egg whites…and still haven’t eaten lunch (it’s 3:22pm…I’m an idiot).

Part of me is saying: just stop the injections for now with everything else going on in my life. I only did one injection last Friday but I don’t think this is the way to go…I’d like to get my T levels at normal levels while keeping other variables intact (E2, etc).

Curious what you would test tomorrow if you were me? And again, would it be ok to test around 2:30-3pm tomorrow?

Thanks!


#11

Injecting 70 mg every 10 days is stupid and so is your doctor, we see this kind of crap all the time. You have to know what your SHBG level is in order to design a protocol, you can’t just blindly inject testosterone.

Everyone is different, those with low SHBG inject small micro doses every other day, mid-range SHBG guys twice a week and High SHBG guys once a week. Your doctor clearly doesn’t know how that TRT game is played, most don’t.

Insurance doctors don’t have the same set of tool boxes that private practice doctors have like prescribing estrogen blockers and HCG to keep the testicles alive and functioning maintaining fertility.

Mention and estrogen blocker or HCG to your current doctor and he look at you like a confused idiot. Doctor will likely refuse to even test your estrogen, a critical component to successful treatment.

This is why most of us pay out-of-pocket for proper care, insurance doctors are too heavily restricted from doing what’s necessary, like and estrogen blocker and HCG.


#12

I went to Urologist Wednesday and had blood tests. Hope to get back early next week. Still feel light-headed/foggy, rubbery legs but definitely feel better than last weekend/early this week. I’m able to at least concentrate at work since Wednesday which I was not able to do Monday/Tuesday.

I will order the #29 insulin syringes/.5 mL syringes. I just want to make sure I order the right thing. I went to pharmacist yesterday and asked for #29 insurance needles and he was like “that’s too thin and will be difficult to push out the T”…I don’t think this guy knows what he’s talking about. He didn’t have #29 but did have #27 so i got a few needles. I’ll try WalMart later today - can someone clarify: so i need: a) #29 insulin needles, b) .5mL syringe? Do I need the thicker needle for drawing the T from the vial?

Thanks!


#13

There are a bunch of diff ways you can do it and it really comes down to personal preference based on comfort, time, etc.

FWIW here is my protocol:

  1. Draw T with 18g 1.5" luer lock needle with 3ml syringe.
  2. Switch out 18g 1.5" for 30g .5" luer lock needle for subQ injection.

Its all relatively inexpensive at Westend Medical Supplies online.

Edit: I think KSman suggests the smaller barreled syringes because they are easier to push the plunger down.


#14

The pharmacist was correct, with needles that thin it is harder to push out, but that is ok. I use #29 with a 1 ml syringe. Drawing the test into the syringe takes a minute or two with a thin needle like that, but the needle goes into the skin easily with little or no pain most of the time. With a .5 ml or 1 ml syringe, you have to press strongly to get the test out, but nothing too bad. Just don’t go with bigger syringe than 1ml…I could never get the test out unless I heated the oil when I did that.


#15

Thank you for the great tips


#16

I don’t think links are allowed here so you need to google it.
Easy Touch 27ga 1/2" 12 buck per 100. Googlr youtube for subQ injections around the naval.
Simple and no pain.
If you inject 100mg/wk or less there is a very good chance you will not need and AI

This foggyness and pain for days after makes me wonder if you are having an allergic reaction to the oil. You can buy T cyp in 3 different oils I prefer grapeseed.


#17

Great help! Took first Test cyp (150mg) last Friday morning and I haven’t felt good ever since. I would think if I was allergic, I would have hives or breakout from the allergic reaction. Strangely my brain has felt “swollen”, my body has felt super weak, still dizzy/light-headed, rubbery legs. Maybe I’m allergic and this is how I’m reacting. Some have responded that maybe the 150mg dose was too high. I plan to do 50mg sq this Monday. Surprised I don’t feel better by now. Also wondering if my body has shutdown my natural T production and my T levels are back to low a week later. I am getting my lab numbers from Wednesday’s test next week and will post here.


#18

And just to clarify, I haven’t felt pain (from the injection or really any body pains)…mainly my head/brain just feels very swollen…I would equate it to the feeling post concussion (like I got my bell rung when I played football). Monday and Tuesday was simply terrible…off and on felt a little better the last few days but not much better. I basically feel like I’ve had a bad hangover all week.

I’ve read a few posts from folks who were allergic to test cyp and it sounded like their reactions were different from mine (skin rash and other reactions)


#19

I have a feeling this dosage is going to be too high for you given your Total T and Free T. One week is nothing as your pituitary is either shutting down or will within 3 weeks.

Remember everytime you change dosage or start injecting more frequently you reset the clock and it takes 6 weeks for blood levels to stabilize. This is when you start to feel good consistently unless your levels are high/Low.

Keep making changes every week and your suffering will never come to an end as you’ll never reach a stable state.

If you were having an allergic reaction it would be at the injection site.


#20

SystemLord: I agree with you. The doc prescribed .7 mL (200 mg/mL test cyp) every 10 days and I injected . .75 mL (150mg) and it’s like it’s fried my brain.

I plan to do 50mg twice a week and will talk to doc about getting hcg and Arimidex. Do u think this is too much test cyp?

Lab results should be back next week and will post.


#21

Most guys will get to high normal testosterone on 50mg twice weekly unless you hyper metabolize your testosterone. Guys who insist on 1200+ run into problems as controlling estrogen becomes a challenge.

I believe with your current dosage that’s where you’ll end up.


#22

Just picked up the lab results from last Wednesday (5/16/18). These results were after the 1st T injection on 5/10/18 where I injected IM 150 mg Test Cyp 200 mg/mL. Here are the results - please let me know if anything looks out of whack:

The response I described last week after the first injection slowly got better over the course of last week. I still have felt light-headed with shortness of breath at times…even yesterday. I would describe it as the same feeling if you’re trying to blow up lots of balloons. I was talking to a lady at the pool yesterday and it was hard to talk and breath at the same time. I wonder if most of last week, my body/brain were reacting to this shock to the system with 150mg of test cyp for the first time and then by day 9 or 10, my body was withdrawing from it?

I did inject my 2nd T shot (50 mg of Test Cyp 200 mg/ml) in my stomach with #31g .5mL syringe (thanks KSman for tip on that…I didn’t feel a thing). I feel much better today - don’t feel anxiety as I was feeling.

Based on lots of reading, I would think we need to closely monitor my E2 levels and get on AI if E2 levels get out of bounds as well as get on HCG so that my nads don’t turn into nothing. I’m 49 and don’t want more children but I do want to keep my nads at normal size. Would you recommend I go ahead and get on HCG now?

KSman, I owe you the temp readings and will buy a oral therm today unless you think it’s unnecessary to do this.

I did add Vit D3 (5000 IU) and Kelp with Iodine to my other supplements (Multi Vit with no iron due to my hemocromatosis, Fish Oil/Omega3, Magnesium).

Thanks,

Todd


#23

One thing to add to my post this morning : my Lipid Panel numbers from last Sept were not ideal, especially my triglyceride count. Here they are:

LDL 89 mg/dL
HDL 63 mg/dL
Triglyceride 194 mg/dL
Cholesterol 191 mg/dL
Total Chol/HDL Ratio 3.0 Ratio

My diet is good…could be better. Don’t eat fast food but could be more disciplined. Starting to eat egg whites/oatmeal in the morning. Usually have a high protein smoothie with fruit (strawberries, blueberries, banana, raspberries, chia seeds) each day. Usually have a salad with grilled chicken, lean meat or tuna for lunch. I want to kick my diet into high gear as I’m getting back in the gym (just started OrangeTheory twice a week as well).


#24

Your doctor is not only missing important tests, he’s order the wrong E2 labs designed for premenopausal women and children. You need the LS/MS/MS method designed for males. No Free T3 which is the only active thyroid hormone, this is where the rubber meets the road and all other hormones can appear good while Free T3 is low. It’s like not testing free T together with Total T.

This doctor needs to evolve or he will remain ignorant, doctors are like computers, they need to get updated from time to time to remain relevant.


#25

Systemlord : I’m fairly sure we ran the right E2 test because I took notes from this site and then handed them to him. We ran the Estradiol sensitive. What tells you that this test was for women and children? Happy to go back and ensure we’ve run the right test.

Did you see these numbers from results I posted above:

TSH 1.610 (.450-4.5)
T4 7.3 (4.5-12.0)
T3 Uptake 30 % (24-39)
Free Thyroxine Index 2.2 (1.2-4.9)
T3 116 (71-180)

I took a printout of everything I was asked to get done - as you can imagine, it’s a little frustrating to go through this exercise and then have you respond with “not only missing important tests, he’s order the wrong E2 labs”.


#26

Negative, the Roche ECLIA methodology test is for females. The LC/MS/MS and Ultrasensitive was designed for males. T3 Uptake, Free Thyroxine Index, sorry man your doctors a little behind the times. An experience doctor runs Free T3, Free T4, Reverse T3 and antibodies.

He tested only bound hormones (T4/T3), not free hormones. The downstream Free T3 is at the end of the line which acts upon your T3 receptors in the same way free T acts upon androgen receptors. Most doctors fail at thyroid and TRT, their understanding is surprisingly limited.

This estradiol assay is designed for the investigation of fertility of women of reproductive age and for the support of in vitro fertilization.