T Nation

New Guy, Low T, First Blood Work. Looking for Advice


#1

First test on my T, it’s 175.

Well guys I am new here.
Due to several reasons I just got my T tested along with some other blood work. Family history of thyroid problems led me to want to get it checked among other things.

I can post my full blood work but the hormone tests were limited. Doctor said he wants me to stop taking supplements and come back in a month for a retest. I’m currently stacking Primeval Labs Super Osta (three weeks)(20mg) and Super Cardarine(4 weeks).
(20mg)
Also supplementing with fish oil, creatine, A-AKG, L-Carnitine, glutamine, multivitamin, and NO explode. Current daily intake is about 2000 kcal. 200g protein, 100g carbs, 90g fat. I weight 230@27% body fat, down from about 250 and 32% body fat 2 and a half months ago.
Primary lifting focus is compound lifts to increase strength. Cardio 2x a week. Typical weight session is about 20-25 sets, a 1.5-2 hour workout.

Never used prohormones, anabolics, nothing…just these SARMS for the last few weeks.

I have researched a bit on why my liver values are high and have read that it could be my creatine, the Ostarine, the higher protein diet that I’m not used to, or even just the heavy resistance training. I do go very heavy during my sessions.

39 years old. Depressed, lethargic, poor work performance. Pecker works well still but morning woods and libido seem decreased for a while now. (Long before starting the Ostarine or anything) Erection duration isn’t as long as it should be. Luckily she does good, but I feel like she has to work harder than she needs to sometimes.

But here are the bad parts of my blood work.
I’ve stopped everything but occasional whey, l-Carnidine, and the Super Cardarine. I have been doing great at becoming less obese and much stronger. My clothes fit a lot different just in two months, so I am hesitant to make further changes at this time. But I don’t want a destroyed liver either. I would like to start TRT if my T is low. Or at least figure a different option until we have our kids.
Doc said he wants me to stop supps for a month and get retested. I suspect my problems are from the Ostarine or NO-Xplode. Blood proteins look good, creatinine levels are ok. But I don’t really get how all this stuff works together and get confused easily trying to figure it out. Doctor wasn’t any help other than telling me to get off the whey, aminos and creatine.

The bad values:
Total test: 174ng/dL --range 332-896
Anion gap:13.7 calc --range 6-13
ALT: 115 --range 17-63
BUN: 23 – range 8-20
ESR: 18 --range 0-10

Others that were high:
AST: 44 --range 10-45

Everything else came back in the normal reference range.
TSH was 2.720, range .45-5.1
FT4 was .9, range .7-1.5

I have other values but don’t know what any of this crap really means. If I can offer more info let me know. I didn’t get any other hormones tested for this since it was just an exploratory test.
I am under direction to see another doctor for a potential sleep study to investigate what sounds like sleep apnea. Pretty sure I have it.
I was planning on cutting back my protein intake and taking 3-5 days off before going back in in about 3 weeks for more blood work.
I’m trying to figure out exactly what other blood work I need to push for when I go back in.
So if anybody could help point me in the right direction and offer your thoughts on my current lab info it would be greatly appreciated.


KSman is Here
#2

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erythrocyte_sedimentation_rate
Anything suggested there?

AST/ALT can be easily elevated by sore or injured muscles. You need to stop intense training and have muscles fully recovered for next lab work. Need to remove confounding factors.

Thyroid:
TSH should be nearer to 1.0, 2.7 is way to high. Disregard the lab ranges.
FT4 is low. fT3, fT4, T3, T4 should be mid range or a bit higher.
This can be from an iodine deficiency.
What is your long term history of using iodized salt? And history in family?

"Everything else came back in the normal reference range. "
Things look good.
Except Sodium and Cloride are lowish.
Do you avoid salt?

Need these labs, fill in the blanks:
TT
FT
E2
LH/FSH
TSH
fT3
fT4
AST/ALT
prolactin
AM cortisol - at 8AM please
DHEA-S

Please follow these links in the 2nd post of 1st topic in forum:

  • advice for new guys
  • things that damage your hormones
    - thyroid basics explained
    — please check and report oral body temperatures as suggested

#3

KSMan, thanks for chiming in here.
I did find the thyroid/iodine info last night and checked temps.
Last night before bed…97.8
This morning…95.2

I hardly ever use salt on anything. Most foods always seem salty enough for me. Been along time since I just salted food and when I do, we only have sea salt in the house as far as I know. Only thing I ever regularly salt is my morning eggs. Only other salt we have is canning salt. My sodium was even lower about 15 months ago when I saw a doctor for an ankle issue. I think at some point the doctors have tested me for inflammation or arthritis. Family history of thyroid problems with my mom, sister cousin and grandmother, all under active. Aunt has Graves’ disease.

As far as the ESR, I was really curious about that as well. I do not see anything on that wiki that has been a known issue before. Although I did read it is an inflammation marker, so hopefully it’s elevated due to the heavy training. I don’t have a good answer there.
I’ll post the labs from last winter, but keep in mind I was not exercising or watching my food intake at all back then. I had been suffering from really bad ankle/joint pain in my ankles. Which I still struggle with from time to time depending how much I am on my feet. They seem to lock up and have impingement, but not nearly as much as they used to.


#4

Here’s the only other labs I have. (Removed these poor pictures and reposted below)
Should I just wait 3 more weeks and get everything with the suggested additions checked at that time? Doctor said he wanted me off all supps for a month and then to retest. Or should I call back and push him to do some more tests? He did order a lipid profile but I haven’t fasted to get in there and do it.


#5

You have iodine deficiency. Everyone in house is affected.

You do not get iodine from:

  • sea salt
  • canning salt
  • prepared foods
  • most restaurant foods

Because you do not care for salt, you need to get iodine from:

  • multi vitamin that lists iodine+selenium
  • kelp or stronger supplements

Read that thyroid sticky.

Is your thyroid enlarged, sore, lumpy or asymmetrical?
Outer eyebrows sparse?
General hair thinning?

Prolonged iodine deficiency can have a progression from hypothyroidism to hyperthyroidism with nodules and cancer risks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graves’_disease

Do others in your family avoid iodized salt or salt in general?


#6

cannot read those labs


#7

None of the listed side effects for iodine deficiency. No hair thinning or loss, no sparse eyebrows. Doc just palpitated my thyroid when I went in and didn’t indicate anything was an issue. Feels fine to me.
It’s been almost 20 years since I lived with my mom and my sister, so I can’t really speak at all about their iodine intake.
I was taking the Kirkland Active multivitamin with 150mcg of iodine and 55mcg of selenium. But I seriously felt nauseous for two whole weeks on it and couldn’t stomach it, so I switched to Flyte Vitamix and feel much better on it. But I don’t know how much iodine or selenium it has. I put in a call to the company and had to leave a message. So I’m gonna keep watching my temps for a few days still and see if I can fine an iodine supplement locally today.
Have you heard of any results from an iodine skin patch test, or is that an inconsistent testing method?
Current body temp is at 97.3

One thing to mention regarding the TSH. My blood was drawn about 30 minutes after the doctor palpitated my thyroid two weeks ago


#8

Well I found some high dose iodine. Man this stuff is hard to find damn!
This is what I picked up:
www.terrynaturallyvitamins.com/tri-iodine

So for the next two weeks my only supplements will be that and some milk thistle to try to help clear out my ALT.


#9

I see a few patterns - seems that you’re trying to make improvements; improvements aren’t being made. Supplements? Drop them. I’m merely assuming you’re 6’, average build and at the bodyweight mentioned - the body fat is your worst enemy and it gets harder and harder to loose once “the snowball effect” begins… (research: body fat & cortisol)

Focus on isometrics, plyometrics and moderate-intensity training. Keep your diet alkaline and low glycemic. Stay away from processed foods, packaged foods and anything manufactured (for a while)… weight loss should come quickly, you should feel like a different person in a couple of months.

TRT:
You mentioned having kids. TRT could potentially hit the pause button on that goal.

TRT is not a replacement for the supplements you’ve been taking. You likely won’t start on the dose you’ll end up needing. I say this because people with low-to-no testosterone respond incrementally to therapy with happy results. They had little to ‘shut down’ to begin with; so it’s all icing on the cake.

TRT for people who are moderately low with/without lifestyle factors start on a “starting dose” like anybody else; and quite often end up feeling like life is a crisis. Often don’t have a full or even partial understanding of lifestyle and health – and often not experienced with doctors and the health care system. WHY? They end up taking just enough to shut themselves down; most doctors are hesitant to shock-load your body with the amount you actually need – so you spend weeks (if not months) adjusting your dose while you feel worse than you did before starting therapy.

Lots of great science/chemistry and advice in these forums, and, for most? It’s not even something to look at yet; although most are usually past-due the proper time to start reading and learning about this stuff.

Sometimes recovery in any department in life takes time. Symptoms might feel worse for a bit if you commit to the appropriate lifestyle changes. Once things turn around though, drastic measures won’t feel so necessary or tempting. If you’re not feeling good about things, perhaps there are treatments that can manage your symptoms short term. Wellbutrin worked for me; took it for four months and quit smoking, lost 20lbs, cleaned up my diet and lowered my blood pressure. It gave me enough “mojo” to make initial efforts and I had no side effects when I stopped. THIS may not apply for everyone, however, it was my turning point and my commitment to turn my life around, for the 10th time, lol.

Best of luck, stay motivated, make changes where/how you can and keep involved – simply making time in the forums shows a foot in the right direction & I think KSman hits the nail on the head with reason that books could be written about.


#10

search: https://www.google.com/search?q=optimax+iodine&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8#q=optimox+iodine

ALT will sort it self out easily if you avoid training, if muscle related.

Please post those two lab sheet, flattened out and right side up.


#11

I’m happy with the progressive made. I’m at 230 now and was almost 255 three months ago. According to body company tests I’ve only lost a couple pounds of muscle but strength has steadily increased. But the damn lethargy makes it hard to stay motivated, especially now that I’m not doing high caffeine dose pre-workout supps.
But that’s alright, I’ll fight it and get there no matter what. Big thing for me is that now I track macros and meal plan, and I never did that before.
I did buy that iodine last night so I could start today. Waited to check my morning temp and it was 96.4 today, so I’ll start iodine supplementation tonight.
I’ll retake pictures of old labs when I get home tonight.
I do appreciate the help guys. I don’t care what the problem is but I do need to get better. I haven’t been able to perform well at work or even maintain good employment for over two years now. I just want my life back again. At almost 40 years old life should not be so uncomfortable ya know. Outside stresses aside, life should be much better than this!
Really hoping I feel benefits from iodine quickly like others have.


#12

Here is the labs from last year. Probably not very helpful but that’s all I got so far.


#13

Well damn. I hadn’t ever noticed until last night but I do have sparse outer eyebrows don’t I?
Additional info I have obtained regarding family and my medical history:
Under active thyroid function in family; mom, sister, grandpa, younger cousin. Mom is on 150mg of Levoxil and has nodules, sister takes 50mg. Others unknown
And my aunt has Graves’ disease.
And a side note regarding my sleeping…when I was little I had tubes in my ears and adenoids. I guess my tonsils weren’t the problem so they didn’t remove them but they did remove my adenoids. Maybe they have grown back and may be contributing to my snoring/sleep apnea issues. Something else to discuss with sleep doctor I guess. I still think I have sleep apnea or something weird with my sleep going on.


#14

Well just a quick update. This mornings temp after 2.5 days of IR: 96.6. Was the same yesterday. I have notice an increase in morning wood and had a raging nocturnal erection the night before last.
I took the following Doses on IR to increase slowly and hope to avoid the icky bromine feeling.
Day 1: 12.5mg
Day 2: 25 mg
Day 3: 37.5 mg
Today: 50mg

Hope to maintain 50 mg for a while but will cut back as needed.
I miss a few of the supplements I was on that s for sure.
Carb cravings are crazy now and I think I’m gonna have to go back to the higher protein intake rather than wait till after my next blood test.