T Nation

New Guy - A Few Questions

I apologize for the wall of text but I’m trying to include all pertinent info. I’m 26, 6’5 and 250. Fatigue, irritability, and low sex drive were symptoms.These are my initial tests prior to starting TRT.

They prescribed me 100mg test c weekly with a re-test one week after my 6th injection. About 3-4 weeks in I start feeling the aching and notice the slight atrophy of my boys. On my follow-up visit I was able to convince her to prescribe HCG. I wanted this to decrease the near constant ache and increase my now noticeable atrophying. Fertility isn’t really much of a concern at the moment.

They only tested total T on the follow-up which came back as a trough of 248. Due to me not noticing much of a difference, she doubled my dose to 200mg weekly. I’ve taken this dose for 2 weeks with my 3rd shot due on Friday.

I received my HCG prescription yesterday, which was surprisingly premixed at 1000 units/ml, with a dose of 500 units EOD. I feel this is excessive starting out but I’m new to this. I only took 250 units last night. I had to send her articles on HCG to convince her to prescribe it.

I plan on splitting up my T into 2 weekly shots on Monday and Friday of 100mg. What is an ideal dose for the HCG? Should I split it with the T shots or go EOD?

Since they only tested total T, I was thinking of ordering online lab work but am not sure the ideal time during my dosing periods to get the tests done? Should I wait a could weeks after starting HCG before testing?

I have been reading around on the forum but I still have hours left to read. Thanks for any and all help!

Without knowing your SHBG level, you would be better served injecting two doses per week (50mgx2), a once weekly protocol works for a select few men because they don’t feel the levels swinging between injections.

I’m going to take an educated guess and say your SHBG level is around 20 which is is fine, some low SHBG guys like myself (22) do much better injecting smaller doses every other day.

The 200mg once weekly is a terrible protocol for almost everyone. 50mg twice weekly will get the majority of men slightly above mid-range to high normal levels.

HCG will likely increase estrogen, some men don’t tolerate HCG well at all, common symptoms are excess acne, excessive sweating and mood changes. If fertility is no concern, dropping the HCG can make dialing in your TRT protocol less complicated.

Your HCG dosage is excessive and will cause problems, HCG protocols are 250 EOD or 400-500 2-3 times per week unless you want to be swimming in estrogen.

My advice is ‘dont take advice’ on protocols… not this early on. Def seek advice re possible issues via your own passive reading… but the above guys reponse is woefully self referential to his experience and you may find none of it works or doesnt for you.
I say this because Ive just posted re a difficult situation and his reply was ignorant and arrogant.

No one really has any idea what they are talking about because Endocrinology is so complicated and varies between people wildly, so until you have experienced YOUR bodies reaction n hence can guide the advice given to you or refute it.

Ive been on TRT for 3 years and tried everything I can think of and definately gained alot from reading anaecdotal experience… but so much of whats written here is dudes self massaging their egos around knowledge and creating dichotomies and sending you down a path because the opposing is ‘wrong’ FOR THEM or ‘wrong’ in a study they have cherry picked.

Best of luck dude, it gets better! Wayyyy better… but it never ends, you have good periods and then something changes and you have to adapt.
Check my sole post i wrote 5 days ago as an insight into where you may be, itll motivate you… and also note the same guys.response to me and see what I mean

:slight_smile:

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First off, hang in there. Good points above from @jackttrt. This can be frustrating, especially at first. Keep in mind that everyone is different and responds to TRT (and AAS/PEDs from back in the day) differently.

So now I am going to give you advice on protocols………………

The fact that you came back so low is troubling. You have some options. One is to double your dose, which she did. Most guys do fine with weekly injections. So what, you are you. Another is to split it up. Of course, you have other options as well. I tend to prefer fewer injections until proven that it will not work.

As an example, I know someone taking 400mg every other week. Felt good for 3-4 days. Told him to get blood tested at day seven, after a 400mg injection, his total test was in the 300s on day seven! His SHBG was 5. He stayed with 400mg every two weeks, but split it to four 100mg injections, twice a week dosing. At trough his total test came back in the 800s, and he feels great. All the time.

You may be fine with 50mg twice a week. I’m guessing no, but not unreasonable to try it. On the other hand 200mg once a week may be the answer. Not unreasonable to try that either.

Regarding hCG, 250IU three times a week will suffice.

Last, think it through, do some of your own research, listen to others but question everything, even me. I could be wrong. Work with your doctor.

You need to bring your Vit D up too dude. That in and of itself could make you feel better.

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Alright, I’ve got an update. I am taking a vitamin D supp when I remember in the mornings. These are the numbers on a Friday morning and my last injection was the previous Monday night. Still at 200mg per week with 2 doses of 100mg or .5ml on Monday and Fridays. I am also taking 250 units of HCG EOD.

Wow your body is eating through that T. 200mg a week and TT of 700 and a free T of 20? Damn.

How do you feel?

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I really dont feel too much better. I’m getting good physical/muscular changes and am growing stronger in the gym but libido is still low and have noticed easy mood swings. Im guessing that has to do with my high E2 and low free T.

The HCG greatly helped with the testicular atrophy and constant aching.

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How many weeks in now and are you taking an AI?

I started TRT on October 19th at the 100mg/week dose with no HCG. I’m not on an AI right now.

Can you increase your dose a bit? I mean the proof is in how you are feeling and backed up by the numbers.

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I was thinking the next step would be an AI to lower E2 and increase free T. I am going to send my doctor my results tomorrow. She said I should be feeling like conquering the world at my age, which is definitely not the case for me.

I like this suggestion. I take 200mg/week and get total test levels to 880-920ng/dl and free test to 200-220pg/ml.

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How frustrating bro. I know Many folks removed hcg and it worked for them.

Maybe my experience can help. I have the same problem. But I don’t think it’s e2. Consider my last bloods 5 weeks in. I had 1300 t and 27.5 free t. Above normal. But my e2 was below 30. Unless labs were inaccurate…keep in mind that they used to say “keep e2 wishing 20-30
For optimal effects of t. I didn’t feel any different… ok maybe a tiny bit but it was not proportional.

Anyways I lowered my dose and the hcg gone. It’s beem 2 or 3 weeks. I’m still having ups and downs but I’m feeling better more consistently.

Jsut food for thought. Hope it helps. I know how you feel. Super excited I found the answer, but it takes forever to work. Talk about patience.

And for hcg jay cambell the tot revolution guy told me that he took 100iu when trying to conceive and it worked. Others said they were able to maintain aesthetics with 100iu to 200iu twice a week.

Bro think about when he took his test it was 5 days after his last shot. Meaning he’d probably above normal or at the top a day or two after his shot. Maybe try eod or micro dosing … same with e2 maybe? If it’s 40s 5 days after, then it could be even higher day after.

Given the half life Id think it would be higher at 200mg.

Were you fasted for this last blood draw? Or are you diabetic?

I had about 1/2 of a smoothie 15 mins prior to this draw. I’ve never been diagnosed as diabetic.

So some of those numbers are moot then. You need to be fasted for a full 12 hours with nothing but water for lipids etc. Thats why your triglycerides are so high.