T Nation

New Fat Fast Support Group #2

OK, time to restart the FFSG again 'cos the other one was getting a bit long. Well, it’s day 13 for me, and I’m getting some way bad cravings. I think I’ll stay strong, actually I know I’ll stay strong. It’s bloody hard without the ECA stack of Pepsi Max (caffeine), but I’m starting to drop the weight. There’s definitely fat gone, but I think the muscle is starting to get dragged along with it. I made the mistake of staying out ‘till 2am last night too with friends, just dancin’ and stuff. Also made the mistake of not eating through the day for a period of about 5 hours. Not good! Anyway, I’m battling on. Anyone else seeing success?

Mark, don’t sweat over little things such as not eating for 5 hours and staying out and having a good time. You’re doing everything else right - so just live your life and then worry about the fat. Only recently I learnt that letting my body take priority over my life in general was a huge, huge mistake. However, keep up the good work and keep striving for perfection. Contradiction I know, but you should know what I mean, maybe? :wink:

For those of you interested, the prior “New Fat Fast Support Group” thread can be found here - http://www.t-mag.com/forum/thread_1953825297.html

Well the last thread inspired me to have a go at the ff, however I only have a limited window before I will need some carbs to get me thru 2 weeks of study and exams! I decided to try for 10 days and see what happens. I’m half way, day 5 and I have lost 5 lbs! Probably water. From 194 to 189. I’m 5’11. I have also been doing meltdown training for the last 5 weeks.I’m on 1300 cals per day and I have got 20g carbs from post workout shake. So I’m not a purist as such. I am taking HMB (hopefully protect lean mass!) and Metalene (metabolic support).

My wife surprised me on Saturday with 6 cubic metres of gravel arriving so I moved 5 by shovel and wheelbarrow on Saturday! Thought I was on a different planet before lunch but landed safely after a meal and felt good the rest of the day. I did take the cals up an extra 500 because I deserved it, Sunday was pretty much shagged but seemed OK this am before the meltdown session.

I have been using ketostix to monitor when I’m in ketosis which seems to be all the time ranging from trace to moderate. I’m being very scientific today and will monitor this every 2 hours and see how it changes over the day after exercise and eating, taking a slash has never been more exciting!

I had been doing the don't diet, diet and so far have found the transition not too bad, so I plan to go back onto that on Saturday AM and hopefully maintain weightloss.

Look forward to others progress reports.

Mark - go psycho on the refresh button. Works for me when that problem happens.

Good call BB. Cheers. Starting Don’t Diet today, sorta, I’m on lower calories than JB recommends, and lower carbs (about 15%). I’ll let you know how things turn out. Anyone else still FFing???

Hey any of you on Methoxy-7, I believe that is totally keeping my muscle on, because everyone else is saying how it’s getting ripped away from them. But Methoxy is the only thing I am taking right now that could be considered anabolic. I am doing GVT2K and my lifts went up if not stayed the same from last week. I am on day 7 of the Fast and unless I get my MD6 I want to devour a buffet or cry, damn seratonin levels. Oh well, good luck to everyone that is still on it.

After reading a SH!TLOAD on the effects on metabolism caused by dieting and thermogenic drugs (ECA), I’ve decided to go get my thyroid levels checked. The Doc told me the low end of normal for body temperature was about 36.5 celcius - even with an ECA stack in me I was at 35.9! For those in Australia that are interested, you can get a TSH (Thyroid Stimulating Hormone) test for free on Medicare, but the T3/T4 will cost you $22 unless there’s a problem with TSH (out of limits). Just pondering the possible use of supplemental thyroid to get me back into the normal range (DON’T LECTURE ME!!!) Pity there’s no T2 readily available in Australia… and the Doc nearly shit when I asked him to prescribe some straight ephedrine to use in a thermogenic stack… LMAO He didn’t do it. And in case you Aussies haven’t realised yet, Docs CAN now prescribe it, they couldn’t a little while ago. It’s day 16, fat is still coming off, and I’ve upped carb intake to 15% of total calories. And the arms are starting to look f#cking great!!!

Just a bit of info about ketostix. Both John M. Berardi and Brock Strasser have denounced ketostix for low fat dieters. They I think it was Brock who said that if you’ve been on a low carb diet (they gave a number of grams per day, but I can’t remember it) for, I think, thee days, you are DEFINITELY in ketosis. The problem is that there is no good way to correlate readings to the depth of ketosis, i.e. absence of a ketosis reading is NOT evidence that one is not in ketosis. Hope that helps. Sorry I can’t remember where I read that, but I’m pretty sure it was here on the Forum.

I’m getting no bites yet so I’ll try fishing in a different spot.I’m thinking about trying the fat fast but I’d rather not use androsol for reasons I choose to keep to myself. Would M or vitex provide enough anabolic type support to prevent muscle loss or should I use something a bit more powerful? Methoxy 7 maybe?I only want to lose 15 lb. prior to my next bulking cycle but I’m hoping to make sure it’s all fat (duh!). Thanks in advance.

I’m on day two of the Fat Fast diet. Yes, Renegades, I got off to a quick start. I figure this way I’ll be able to answer any problems that may arise with our readers. Day one absolutley sucked but day two seems to be going much better. Check out the Renegade Nutrition website for regular updates (and be sure to subscribe to our mailing list).

Glad to hear that all you guys are still at it. hope that the results are good and that you can still stand to eat the “food” that fat fast allows. Man am I glad to be done!

I don’t see how some of you guys are doing the fat fast with metltdown training. That’s gotta suck! Are energy levels shot?

Oh…anyone ever try using 5 HTP to control carb cravings? I’ve used the EC stack for energy, muscle retention, and appetite suppression during a standard keto diet but I haven’t tried the 5 HTP yet. Anyone else have experience with that?

Dave - well energy levels are pretty terrible while actually exercising. Sometimes even stairs are a chore. But the stimulants help of course. And to be honest I’d prefer Meltdown Training over endless cardio. I mean, I’m only doing 6 minutes of cardio 4 days out of 7. The fat is still coming off, and I’m keeping a decent amount of muscle. Time will tell.

Ahhh, that will explain why the ketostix don’t seem to work but fat is coming off from time to time. I think they are a good psychological toy, cause when they change color you think that it’s worth eating all that stuff.

I just started a modified version of the fat fast/anbolic/t-dawg diet on Sunday. After 2 days I have lost 8.5 lbs. This is the most I’ve ever lost that fast and I have been only at about 25% below maintenance. I know most of it is water, as I can’t stop peeing. I also stopped taking creatine so I am sure some of the weight lost is from that as well. The first week is essentially the normal anabolic diet with 5 1/2 days on and 36 hours to carb up. The reason I did this was to ease myself into ketosis first, before I suddenly drop calories as well. As I think it would be a big shock to the system and make me very tired. The next three weeks shall be a fat fast kind of diet with mostly real food. The calories shall simply be 50-60% of maintenance. I will also add one scoop of Surge both before/during and after the workout. I may go as high as 100 grams of carbs a day on workout days and probably around 30-55 on non workout days. I will still be following the 5 1/2 day on 36 hour off plan with the fat fast as well. The fifth week will be a higher calorie anabolic type diet again. This time the carbs will be higher as I did in the fat fast portion and I will not go much below 15-25% under maintenance calories. I’m doing this to get my body used to higher calories again before reintrouding carbs. The sixth and final week of my diet shall be a gradual reintroduction of carbs and eating at roughly maintenance level. I will be using Androsol at 50 sprays 2X a day for the full 6 weeks. I am taking old md6 throughout as well, and the first four weeks I will be taking the old T2. I will then follow up with T2pro the last 2 weeks to get my thyroid function back up to par. I may add some ephedrine and caffeine to the the md6 later on if I need to speed things up. I came up with this diet plan by eperimenting for many years with the anabolic diet. I gradually started to add carbs, partly inspired by the t-dawg diet. Next I did my modified fat fast of 5 1/2 days on 36 hours off before and I lost fat like crazy. I also noticed that while dieting either fat fast or anabolic, and if I used androsol, I would gain more weight (weight which did not seem to be the usual water weight) on the weekends than I would when I did not use it. I think it does give a slight anabolic boost on the carb up days. One final thing I should note: I have learned over time that being in ketosis doesn’t matter as long as I keep the carbs relatively low I have great success with losing fat and retaining muscle. I have even sometimes gained a bit of muscle while using androsol in conjunction with this kind of diet. Anyway I’ll keep you guys posted on my results of this diet.

I just started the fat fast myself aswell. I changed a little bit though, I take in some carbs in the form of dextrose in the postworkout shake. Day one was not bad at all, I had already been dieting and only had two whole food meals a day though my cals were still in the 3000-4000 range things are not too bad on day two, hopefully i won’t be a space cadet since i have exams in school the next few weeks. I am using 35sprays of asol and nsol first in the morn, vitex(solaray), MD6, may throw in some t2 in a week or two if i need it, and also a glutamine BCAA mix before and durring my workout. I am using Advanced Protein and problend for the proteins, the problend seems to be a little lighter on the cals. What is everyone else using and how is it going Chris on day three.
Good luck everyone and stay strong with the diet.

Day Three is almost over and I’m still alive. Chucking a TON of supps into me in an effort to preserve muscle mass. Feel like crap - same as I did after a month or so of dieting for competition. Pizza does sound good.

Well, after my first week of dieting (5 days, technically 5 1/2 but I weigh myself first thing in the morning) I have lost 11.25 pounds. This is the most I’ve ever lost in a week. I think I lost 9 once before the first week as well another time I dieted. Keep in mind that I haven’t even started doing the fat fast type of diet yet, as that won’t start till next week. I look much leaner. I know almost all of that weight is water weight. Some of it is fat, obviously, and a little bit is LBM. Though I think the LBM lost is due to the fact that I lost both glycogen and creatine from muscles, as I was taking in barely any carbs and I just started to cycle off of creatine at the same time I started dieting. That’s all for now I’ll keep you guys posted.