T Nation

New Blood Results, Dialing in Estrogen Still

If you donate more than twice a year add ferritin to your TRT blood tests. It is easy to crash your ferritin with frequent donations. Google the side efffects of very low ferritin it will scare the crap out of you. Unless your doc insists I would not donate until you go over 52%

@hrdlvn,

What are these low ferritin effects and are they well established? Because my doc LOVES low ferritin and said he’d be perfectly fine with a zero ferritin score. When I started with him I was something like 115 ng/ml and currently I’m at 16, and he loves that. For myself, I don’t feel any different and it hasn’t affected athletic performance or endurance that I can tell.

Another approach to erythrocytosis:

Nothing, I looked at the wrong number.

Anemia. Low iron is called anemia. Ferritin is a measure of iron in the system, but not all of it, there is no good way to know exactly how much iron is stored in your system. Ask any woman you meet and they will explain anemia to you.

You need to find a new doctor.
Low levels of ferritin lead to iron-deficiency anemia. This means you have too few red blood cells. Iron deficiency can come from a poor diet or blood loss.

What are the side effects of low ferritin levels?
Your doctor may order a ferritin test if you have some of the following symptoms associated with low ferritin levels:

unexplained fatigue.
dizziness.
chronic headaches.
unexplained weakness.
ringing in your ears.
irritability.
leg pains.
shortness of breath.

Iron -deficiency anemia may cause you to look pale and feel tired, or you may not have any symptoms at first. But if your anemia goes untreated, it can cause serious complications. When you don’t have enough red blood cells, your heart has to work harder to get enough oxygen to your organs.

Can a person die from anemia?

When you’re anemic your heart must pump more blood to compensate for the lack of oxygen in the blood. This can lead to an enlarged heart or heart failure. Death.

@hrdlvn,

On the same recent lab (though I don’t have an RBC count), it shows my hemoglobin at 16 g/dl (13.7 - 17.5)…and hemoglobin is contained inside RCB correct? Maybe the reason he isn’t concerned is because of this? I will ask him about it (I have an appointment in a week)…I’ve always taken his word despite having seen the online symptoms, because he specializes in TRT and life extension and is a Yale grad with honors. We’ll see what he says about it, I’m super curious.

My doctor was so upset at my ferritin from too many blood donations too close together he wanted to pull my T script until I got it up. Some of use really get thick blood with T injections. Some it does not effect at all. I asked him to let me try to get my ferritin up but not go off T and I would buy extra blood tests to prove my progress.
Over the years I have done a ton of testing of different lvls and how I respond so I know my body pretty well. My normal T dose is 150mg/wk I know I can stay above 500 with as little as 80mg/wk
So I dropped my dose to 80 started taking supplements and in 3 months got my 16 ferritin to 45 30 is the bottom of the scale at my lab. My HCT now controls how much T I can take.

Everybody has something that will go wackie if you take too much T for too long and whatever that is is what determines how much you can take.

Yeah it’s my HCT that drives my needs for phlebotomies, and that’s what crashes my ferritin. I would love to not have to do phlebotomies. However, I’ve just recently become aware that I have a heavy snoring/sleep apnea problem. I have a feeling the reason TRT drives up my HCT is because of the apnea. So I’m setting up appointments now to get me a CPAP machine, or whatever it takes to control all that. So hopefully all that will result in far fewer phlebotomies (if any) and a more reasonable ferritin number…though I’m a huge red meat eater…it’s hard for me to comprehend ever being low on iron or RBC, lol

ps;

The reason my doc likes low ferrtin is this:

He said that everyone with ferritin 1000 and above has cancer. Everyone with ferritin 100 and above, is at risk of cancer (higher number, higher risk). But no one with ferritin 100 and below gets cancer.

Today was shot day, took .75, plan on trying .75, 2x a week. Will see the results hopefully this puts me in the low 30s range, really would hate to be taking 2mg a week.

I see the ideal estrogen range being quite wide on this board, somewhere between 20 and 30 is considered ideal correct? What if im in the low 30s would that be acceptable?

That’s retarded. VERY high ferritin is a symptom of cancer so therefore you want it as low as possible. Your doc is an idiot.

Okay I saw my doc today, and he said that the only problems that can stem from low ferritn is low iron, but that my iron is perfect (hemoglobin 16 g/dl).

He also said that there were three independent papers that were published about the topic two and a half years ago, coincidentally all in February, confirming this.

He said he wished his ferritin were as low as mine.

I stand by my earlier response.

I’m eternally curious and always open to all information. Is there any other reasons besides low iron/anemia to be worried about with low ferritin?

Imo trt you want to keep t and free t within range. Maybe top of the range.

This is long-term Life long treatment. I already see you are donating blood and taking ai. Running higher levels means taking other meds to mitigate it’s affects.

Estradiol in 30s is good for me. You are running a pretty high t level so a higher e2 may be fine. But I see you had gyno early in life so am not sure how that changes the equation. Also I’ve seen in This board guys running e2 in 40s and 50s but they have high free t and total t with no ai

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From the Mayo Clinic:
Feb 10, 2017 - Ferritin is a blood cell protein that contains iron . A ferritin test helps your doctor understand how much iron your body is storing. If a ferritin test reveals that your blood ferritin level is lower than normal, it indicates your body’s iron stores are low and you have iron deficiency.

The serum blood test for iron is BTW, essentially useless. The ferritin test is considered a better indicator of actual iron levels in your body, but that is a relative better. Intentionally driving towards anemia in the misguided confusion of cause versus symptom your doctor can really jack you up. Anyone that stupid does not deserve a medical license.

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So then the question is, is it possible to have both great hemoglobin numbers yet low iron levels? Can hemoglobin be manufactured and circulated without iron? I’m still trying to get my head around ferritin as an “indicator”.

You can have iron deficiency without anemia and normal hemoglobin numbers.

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Iron, like all minerals, is stored in various places in your body, so actual levels are basically impossible to know. Ferritin is an indicator in that it can be used to infer to an extent what your real iron level is. High TIBC means you are not actually using much iron ATM, and probably means that you are deficient. Low ferritin means that you are not taking in much right now, or that you are using it up quickly and not keeping up with requirements.