T Nation

New Beginning - Low Test - 32 Male


#1

I have been suspect with having low testosterone for a while now. Not to get in to too much detail but when I was in 8th grade I got hit and had one of my boys removed. I remember the surgery and the pain like it was yesterday. I was embarrassed with this for a long time but once I hit about 21 or 22 I didn't care any more. I have noticed in teh last 3 or 4 years. Every time I would sit down to study for school or work I would get so tired.

I went in to my GP and mentioned my concern and she checked my test for me. It came back at 399 this time and she said it was low but still within normal. I waited a couple months but still felt that maybe this shouldn't be the end all and I started researching it. I spoke someone on facebook and really just realized that 399 is unacceptable since the norms are based on an unreliable group aging from 18 - 80 and me being on the low end.

I originally going to go to Dr Serrano who is in town by me and i called the office. They do not take insurance and it is a 250 dollar visit. That pretty much ruled me out as I don't have that kind of money and have really good insurance. I found a urologist and went in and chatted with him. I gave him my back story and he said that he agreed the normal range is skewed and not reliable. He asked that I have it checked again so we can see where I am and if it was a fluke.

I had my blood done Tuesday and called today and my total test came back at 300 and available was 7.3 and she said it was low. I am going to make a follow up with the urologist. He also said that he didn't want to put me on test yet since my wife is pregnant and using it could pretty much eliminate me from having another kid. I am going to see what my options are when I go back in.

Right now I don't really have any questions, just starting to post as I am sure they will come up. I do not have a copy of the most recent lab report so I am not sure what all the numbers are.

-age 32
-height 6'5"
-waist 44 (at belly button)
-weight 280
-describe body and facial hair - I carry fat currently in my midsection and that is about it. Since I had my testicle removed in 8th grade my body hair has always been blonde and not thick at all. I can grow a beard on my face but it is def not as full as a lot of other guys.

-describe where you carry fat and how changed - I have always carried fat in my midsection for as long as I could remember.

-health conditions, symptoms [history] - most of my symptoms are a low libido and being tired. I am married with 2 kids, wife is pregnant and working on a second Masters so some of it could be from my lifestyle.

-Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever - I currently take Atenelol for High Blood Pressure. It is not officially high but in the pre-hypertensive stages.

-- real dangers! see this http://propeciahelp.com/overvi...
-lab results with ranges - Total Test 300, Free 7.3

-describe diet [some create substantial damage with starvation diets] - Right now i am on a macro diet 300g protein, 500g carbs, 50g fats

-describe training [some ruin there hormones by over training] - I currently train strongman and during the week I run Sheiko. I just finished a 4 week cycle with strongman training on Saturday.

-testes ache, ever, with a fever? - no, the doctor said the one I have left is larger as it picked up the slack from having my left one removed.

-how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed - no erections and everything are fine. I just have a hard time getting in the mood sometimes.


#2

I didn't see a question on your post?

Read the stickies at the top of the forum. They have a little yellow notepad next to them. Focus on the "advice for new guys" and "lab work" stickies. Need to post all lab work. Did you get your values for LH and FSH? These MUST be done before you start TRT. They are useless afterwards. T levels are low and need to know if you're primary or secondary hypogonadism.

Secondary can sometimes be fixed, and could also indicate problems elsewhere. Primary is pretty straightforward and TRT is the only option, but we need to know this first. Low testosterone is a symptom of a problem and throwing testosterone at the symptom doesn't fix the problem.


#3

And, you want to find any causes of your problems and low T may not be the total cause. We need more info, lots more. See the advice for new guys sticky. We see guys and docs with T tunnel vision overlooking major issues all of the time. Be open minded and start reading.


#4

I updated my thread. At this point I have only had my initial visit. I just want to make sure that I keep track here and know what to ask and look for when I go in.


#5

I have been on Test for about a year now. I am on test cypionate and initially it felt really good but now it seems to be hard to make it two weeks before my next shot. I am just on testosterone at this point and not on anything else. I am just curious to see how I approach trying to get my doctor to go weekly and possibly get the dosage increased. Right now I am on about 300mg every 2 weeks so about 600mg a month. Is there anything else I can take to help increase my test and possibly improve strength and size? I honestly can’t remember my free test level but I know my initial test range was about 230 and was around 500 the last time it was checked.


#6

Anyone have any tips?


#7

If you read the stickies at the top, particularily this one: http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_trt/trt_protocol_for_injections

you’ll find that splitting your injection into twice a week shots is a lot better. Injecting weekly or bi-weekly creates spikes and then you drop off feeling like crap.

Split it into 75mg twice a week and you’ll feel a lot better.


#8

[quote]Trebin wrote:
Anyone have any tips?[/quote]

It’s going to be impossible for you to be successful on your current protocol. As I’m sure you’ve read on the forums here, injecting every 2 weeks is no good.

Splitting your dose into weekly injections should be your priority for now. Twice weekly injections would be ideal, but it sounds like your doctor likely wouldn’t be on board for that. If he is, that would be great.

Explain to him that you feel sluggish by the second week after your injection, and ask if you can split your total dose to more frequent injections. Are you injecting at home?


#9

[quote]AlwaysUp wrote:

[quote]Trebin wrote:
Anyone have any tips?[/quote]

It’s going to be impossible for you to be successful on your current protocol. As I’m sure you’ve read on the forums here, injecting every 2 weeks is no good.

Splitting your dose into weekly injections should be your priority for now. Twice weekly injections would be ideal, but it sounds like your doctor likely wouldn’t be on board for that. If he is, that would be great.

Explain to him that you feel sluggish by the second week after your injection, and ask if you can split your total dose to more frequent injections. Are you injecting at home?

[/quote]

No, I actually have the nurse on base doing my injections. Saved me from having to get the needles etc. I would really like to try and see if I can do the 200mg a week as that would make me feel a ton better. If he isn’t on board I may have to switch doctors, by the end of the two weeks I am trashed and miserable.


#10

If the supplies are the only thing holding you back from injecting yourself, I can assure you that they are very inexpensive.

200mg/wk is a hefty dose. There are some guys who do require that much to keep their testosterone levels on the upper end of the reference range, but most don’t need nearly that much. Most guys reach optimal levels on doses of 100-150mg/wk. Higher doses also increase the likelihood that side effects will occur.

I’d suggest focussing on getting your injection frequency squared away before you start asking for a higher dose. Splitting your current dose into smaller but more frequent injections will likely fix your problems.


#11

Thanks, I will have them call me in a script for some needles and just work on doing it at home. I just hate this crash every two weeks.


#12

Do you think if I just split it in to weekly injections without the doc it would matter? To at least try it out, my appt isn’t for another couple of months. I really dont think it would be any different if I just went that route. Is it harder on the liver?


#13

[quote]Trebin wrote:
Do you think if I just split it in to weekly injections without the doc it would matter? To at least try it out, my appt isn’t for another couple of months. I really dont think it would be any different if I just went that route. Is it harder on the liver?[/quote]

It’s such a tried and true method that you should be fine. It will probably fix your issue by smoothing out your levels.


#14

[quote]Trebin wrote:
Do you think if I just split it in to weekly injections without the doc it would matter? To at least try it out, my appt isn’t for another couple of months. I really dont think it would be any different if I just went that route. Is it harder on the liver?[/quote]

It’s hard for me to recommend doing something without clearing it with your doctor first, but you’d certainly feel better if you split your dose into weekly injections. Twice weekly would be ideal, but it doesn’t seem like that’s an option for you right now.

I’d imagine that splitting your dose would actually be easier on your liver as well.


#15

In most USA/CDN jurisdictions you can get insulin syringes without a Rx.

T is 200mg/ml?

Inject with 0.5ml 1/2" #29 insulin syringes, around $14 per 100 at Walmart.
Do not use 1.0ml, lowers pressure and increases injection time.
You can inject SC or IM on top of legs.
See these stickies:

  • advice for new guys
  • protocol for injections

As long as you inject the prescribed amount per week, its really up to you to find out how doing that is best for you.

Steadier levels are not going to be liver adverse!

When injecting every two weeks, even one week, your levels change a lot and your lab work is mostly an artifact of when you do the labs. Please inject twice a week and try to always to labs 1/2 way between injections.

Weight gain can also be from low thyroid function. See the thyroid basics sticky. You need iodine, check body temperatures.

Labs:
TT
FT
E2
CBC
TSH
fasting glucose


#16

I am still doing it weekly and I really dont think it is helping. It is better then every 2 weeks but I am still really struggling. A friend of mine went and his test was under 200 and was put on test hcg, amridex and DHEA. My doc told me that all of that is not researched and that I just need to take test. I am just concerned I am not getting hte right treatment and wondering if I should go find another doctor.