T Nation

Need TRT Advice


I did a saliva test almost 10 years ago and it came with low Testosterone. I forget the exact number but it seems like it was 50. I had no insurance nor could I afford a doctor so I let it go.

I went to my GP in November 2008 because I have had a low sex drive for years. The blood test came back with my Testosterone at 299.5.

He said that he could see it was really low so he gave me shots of DEPO-TESTOSTERONE 200MG once every other week x 2 months.

My testosterone was tested again and it was 965.71. Of course this was a few days after my last shot which made it all seem higher since Depo Test has a half life of 7 days.

I did feel better during that time but not great. The sex drive improved some but not much.

Due to a lay off at work I was unable to go back until last week. Its been 7 months since I had any testosterone shots.

This time after reading some articles on the net (I hadnt found forums like this yet) I asked if he would also test my Estradiol, LH, and FSH, TSH along with testosterone.

Here was the results from last week:

Testosterone 288.58
Estradiol 42.6
LH 7.2
FSH 11.7
TSH 1.748

I see that my LH, FSH, and TSH are ok.

My Testosterone is low and my Estradiol is high.

I spent the better part of this weekend reading these forums but my head is sorta spinning with all the info.

Any suggestions as to what I should suggest to my GP when I go back and why?

Any help is appreciated very much. I would LOVE to get my head out of this FOG because I really feel like crap.


Self inject test cyp/eth 100mg/wk, best as 50mg twice a week. Self injected T is cheap, you do not want to be paying a doctor by the shot! Best prices for test cyp are at Sam’s Club with a business membership or at Costco. You can inject T with .5" .5ml #29 insulin syringes, $12.60 per 100 at Sam’s or Walmart. You do not need to use 1.5" needles in your butt.

You are estrogen dominant. You need Arimidex/anastrozole [AI] now and when on TRT. Expensive at a pharmacy, cheap as a RC.

Use hCG to maintain the health of your testes. 250iu SC EOD self injected.

T+AI+hCG [AI - aromatase inhibitor]

Cholesterol levels?
Fasting serum glucose? If elevated, could be syndrome X aka metabolic disorder
Waist size?
Where do you carry your fat?
Any signs of gyno?
Some Rx and OTC drugs* can increase E and lower T
Some drugs increase prolactin which does the above.
Some liver problems can do the same.

*Including recreational drugs and alcohol.

Your testes are not very responsive. Any pain or ache there?


I know of an MD that is willing to help any one by looking into why are your levels low and possible other issues not addressed in traditional medicine.
If you are willing to travel to PA he would be willing to help. Also they take many major PPO carriers. If interested feel free to PM me with info.


5 to 10 g of Androgel per day. Done.


You mention “cyp/eth 100mg/wk”. Which one are you recommending I talk to my GP about? Or Is there a mix of the two you mentioned? I have heard of

Sustaplex that is a mix of several types of test also. What about that one?

Do the .5" .5ml #29 syringes also go IM in the Butt? If so that would be a relief. Man the needle was HUGE!! and normally it was sore for a week.

As far as what I piad last Fall for shots at my GP.
Total: 100.82

Insurance covered all but 30.95. That’s still quit a bit for one shot!

If my doc will write me a script and then I join Costco It appears a whole 10ml bottle won’t be much more than that.

You mention Arimidex RC “research chemical”. I read where people said to Google it and look for sources. I think my GP would be fine RX it for me, especially since

my Estradiol is high. Since money is a major problem (I build parts for GM) I would prefer buying it as a RC. Any sources that are trust worthy to order from?

I will also mention the hCG to him. Hopefully I can see him by next week (crossing fingers). I can’t wait to HOPEFULLY feel normal.

Age? (38)

Cholesterol levels? Total: (188) HDL: (42) LDL: (126) Triglyceride: (142)

Fasting serum glucose? (81) I can’t remember if it was fasting or not. My wife is Type 2 Diabetic and the few times she has tested me two hours after a meal it was

always in the 80’s

Weight? 185

Waist size? 32

Where do you carry your fat? ONLY around my waist and stomach area. I’m 6’3" (tall slim and slightly muscular) and no matter what I have done I’ve never been able to budge my mid section. I bet if I lost down to 10 pounds I would be nothing more than my waist area lying on the floor.

Any signs of gyno? None

Some Rx and OTC drugs* can increase E and lower T.
Knee pain- Glucosamine 1.5 g and MSM 1.5 g
Multivitamin- Brand varies. I’m using equate brand right now due to money problems. I was using Orange Triad with Glucosamine this past Spring.
Allergies- One of the three: Chlorpheniramine Maleate 4mg, or Loratadine 10mg, or diphenamine HCI 25mg. Normally my allergies only bother me in November and


Recreational drugs and alcohol. I drunk a little as a teenager. I have never smoked or did any recreational drugs. As close as I got was going on a drug deal

with my cousin. You would think the strange car, shady looking character and the exchange of money and a bag would have clued me in… but It didn’t register until he was pulling the drugs out of the bag at home. Thanks Cuz!

Your testes are not very responsive. Any pain or ache there? maybe 2-3 times this past year there was a slight pain of what I would describe feeling similar to a

muscle cramp that lasted 30 sec to a min.

I also found my old saliva test. It was from 2001 from ZRT labs. My Testosterone was 32 pg/ml. The reference range was 50-200


Androgel does sound like something easy to use. A lot better than sticking yourself. But a small syringe like KSman mentions is virtually painless.

I just want what will make me feel the best. If Injections work the best I want that. If the Gel then I want that. If one is cheaper than the other, then I will weigh out the pros and cons etc… I have only priced the injections KSman mentioned and the prices are really not bad at all. I can push myself at work because I know it needs done. I also push myself at home cutting the grass etc… because I know it needs done. But I feel so wore down no matter how much sleep I get. I feel very foggy headed and I have little sex drive. What ever will fix that. I wants IT!

I appreciate the mention of a doc in PA but I really don’t have the cash to be traveling that far. My GP seems pretty good as far as wanting to figure this out. He did ask me if I wanted to go see an endo. I told him I was fine working with him and he said that he would try and solve it. I’m going to mention the T+AI+hCG combo when I see him next and see what he says.


Gels are very expensive!

I get 10ml Watson’s test cyp, 200mg/ml at Sam’s for $42. Will cost $100 at regular pharmacies.

Test cyp and test eth are functionally equivalent, not not implying a blend.

Your metabolism and body shape seem to be in great shape.

After some research from Canada showed that SC T injections worked better than IM, some docs have started doing that, but most docs have no idea. With frequent injections of small volumes, IM injections do not need to be deep. If legs are lean, .5" needles are long enough for IM into the vastus lateralis. The insulin syringes are slow to load, but injection rates are reasonable. Do not get larger than .5ml or injection pressures go down. Myself and some others are injecting EOD at the same time as their hCG EOD injections. Anastrozole is best dosed EOD and all three can be done at once as a routine.