T Nation

Need Some Help With Routine

monday_ chest
bench press 5x5
incline bench press 5x5
2 sets of flys 10 to 12 reps

tuesday_ back and bis and traps
chin ups (until failure)
Deads 5x5
Bentover rows 5x5
3 sets of bicep curls 6 8 reps
2 sets of preacher curls 10_12 reps
3 sets of shrugs 10
12 reps

wednesday_ rest

thursday _shoulders and tris
5x5 seated shoulder press
3 sets of seated dumbell laterial raises 10_12 reps
5x5 BB close grip bench press
2 sets of cable pushdowns at 12 to 15 reps ( is this to much to add?)

friday_ legs
squats 5x5
leg press 5 sets at 12 to 15 reps
should i add 2 sets of stiff leged deadlifts at say 12 to 15 reps

i would train 3 times a week but i realy do not like training shoulders or tris after chest it just is a killer i cant perform properly or is 3 days a week a neccessity when on 5x5

is this to much volume and is there enough back work? also is there any specific rest time in between sets for 5x5, i normaly rest between 2 and 3 minutes, finally for my chest day should i cut out my 5x5 for incline as there it will be to much work and train in the 10 to 12 rep range for 3 sets or is it okay to carry on?

thanks

Why the 5x5?

Why are you posting this again?
You made absolutely no changes from the advice given to you before.

[quote]Nikki9591 wrote:
Why are you posting this again?
You made absolutely no changes from the advice given to you before.[/quote]

Lol, owned!

oh sory i cound not find my thread befoe i searched the forum where i posted it up but it just like dissapeared so i posted it up again and saved this page directly onto my favourites so icould look it up easily sory again

erm i have heard very good things about 5x5 and it has been recomended by lots of people, so i jsu wanted to get your guys views on my routine?

[quote]blue21 wrote:
oh sory i cound not find my thread befoe i searched the forum where i posted it up but it just like dissapeared so i posted it up again and saved this page directly onto my favourites so icould look it up easily sory again

erm i have heard very good things about 5x5 and it has been recomended by lots of people, so i jsu wanted to get your guys views on my routine?

[/quote]

What you’ve been hearing is most likely a reference to Bill Starr’s 5x5 which is based off a linear periodization. It doesn’t look like you followed it at all. Do you have any idea how to progress week to week?

well i havent started it yet, iread up into it but i came out with some conflicting ideas, one being squatting hard twice a week which to me sounds like overtraining, not to sure i was just planning to progressviely overload? would this and the routine abovenot work?

[quote]blue21 wrote:
well i havent started it yet, iread up into it but i came out with some conflicting ideas, one being squatting hard twice a week which to me sounds like overtraining, not to sure i was just planning to progressviely overload? would this and the routine abovenot work?[/quote]

you seem very confused. start with a program that someone way more experienced than you has set up and then tweak it once you get a better sense of whats going on.

and from what i understand it is based around doing 5x5 on compound movements, so then i want to add a few isolation exersices to complete the routine, but bench presses bentover rows and deadlifts wnt build big tris, bis, and shoulders so i added a few isolation exersises for them

monday_ chest
bench press 5x5
incline bench press 5x5
2 sets of flys 10 to 12 reps

tuesday_ back and bis and traps
as many chin ups as i can
Deads 5x5
Bentover rows 5x5
3 sets of bicep curls 6 8 reps
2 sets of preacher curls 10_12 reps
3 sets of shrugs 10
12 reps

wednesday_ rest

thursday _shoulders and tris
5x5 on seated shoulder press
3 sets of seated dumbell laterial raises 10_12 reps
5x5 BB close grip bench press
2 sets of cable pushdowns at 12 to 15 reps ( is this to much to add? i would like to add these last two sets to help me gain a good pump)

friday_ legs
squats 5x5
leg press 3 sets at 12 to 15 reps
2 sets of stiff leged deadlifts 12 to 15 reps
2 sets of leg extensions 12 to 15 reps

would the above routine work?

Did you really just say that bench, rows and deadlifts won’t build big tris/shoulders/bis? Stop messing with shit until you actually know what you’re doing (for the record, you don’t based on the fact that you have no clue what deadlifts/bench/rows can do for you).

Again the 5x5 routine by bill star is based on linear periodization. Just doing 5 sets of 5 for major compound movements doesn’t mean your doing it right or doing what anyone has referred you to.

Squatting twice a week can be done, especially someone as new to training as you.

Rule of thumb, don’t mess with shit that people smarter, more experienced, and stronger then you made. They made it that way for a reason…

i know for a fact that benching deadlifting bentover rows wnt build big arms well it didnt for me when i first started training i used all the compound major movements no isolation got growth with my chest back and legs legs, very poor growth with bis tris and shoulders, untill i based my routine around compound movements along with worthwhile isolations, like BB curls tricep pushdowns, laterial raises, and i got so much better growth fair enough if it works for you but as i learnt a few added worthwhile isolations really made a difference with my major compound exersices

i have looked at the 5x5 routine and have adapted it to suite my personal needs yes its different but fom the original 5x5 but it still incorporates all the major compound movements in the 5x5 mould

so im going to ask you again wud the routine above work and what would i need to do to improve it?

Most likely, you weren’t eating enough. I (and many others) have done zero arm work for long periods of time and seen large growth in our arms because we actually put on attributable mass. Tricep pushdowns are worthwhile?

You don’t get it in regards to the 5x5. When people suggest to do 5x5, it’s more along the lines of how you progress each week/month, not the exercise selection.

AS far s your routine above working, and what you need to improve:

  1. Have a plan on how to progress, actually learn what 5x5 is about and how it progresses properly.
  2. Learn to spell, “wud” is spelled would.
  3. Why put chins in front of deadlifts?
  4. Refer to #1.
  5. Eat.
  6. Eat more.
  7. Then eat some more.

lol okay I will spell *would" the right way, tbh i was planning to progress by progressively overloading, i read up that you need to add 5 lbs each week but tbh in my experience this is near impossible for me, it would take a good couple of weeks before i could add an extra 5 lbs on to say a bench press and perform 5 reps, so i was just going to progressively overload and let my body do what it needs to grow and gain strength naturally.

your last three points mentioned is not a problem diet is nailed down and so is sleep and yh your right i shall dead before i do chinups.

other then that do you think this routine will help me get bigger provided sleep and nutrion is in place? or am i wasting my time and will not see any growth from this in your opinion
especially with my triceps with this routine, would you say the exercises listed for triceps would be okay or is it to muchm, i know im being very specific but i want to get it nailed before i start training

If it takes you a couple of weeks to add 5 pounds to your bench than from what I’ve personally experience, your diet is no where near “nailed down”. I think you really need to read some of the really informational threads around here. And trust me, there is a lot of them. Start reading.

[quote]howie424 wrote:
If it takes you a couple of weeks to add 5 pounds to your bench than from what I’ve personally experience, your diet is no where near “nailed down”. I think you really need to read some of the really informational threads around here. And trust me, there is a lot of them. Start reading.[/quote]

I can’t add 5 pounds to my bench every couple of weeks at times.

[quote]austin_bicep wrote:

[quote]howie424 wrote:
If it takes you a couple of weeks to add 5 pounds to your bench than from what I’ve personally experience, your diet is no where near “nailed down”. I think you really need to read some of the really informational threads around here. And trust me, there is a lot of them. Start reading.[/quote]

I can’t add 5 pounds to my bench every couple of weeks at times.[/quote]

but you are hyoooge. big difference between you and relative newbie gains IMO.

actually after researching more on 5x5 i have come up with a much better soloation thanks to the help of someon. its based on madcows 5x5 with some tweaks

Monday â?? Heavy Day
Front Squat - 5 sets of 5
Incline Bench â?? 5 sets of 5
Overhand Grip Barbell Row â?? 5 sets of 5
Good Mornings â?? 2 sets of 10
Cable Crunch â?? 4 sets of 12-25

Wednesday â?? Light Day
Deadlift â?? 4 sets of 5
Incline Bench or Standing Press â?? 4 sets of 5
Stiff Leg Deadlift 4 sets of 5
Walking Planks â?? 3 sets of failure

Friday â?? Medium
Front Squat â?? 4 sets of 5, 1 triple, 1 set of 8
Flat Bench â?? 4 sets of 5, 1 triple, 1 set of 8
Underhand Grip Barbell Row â?? 4 sets of 5, 1 triple, 1 set of 8 for rows
12 inch Close Grip Bench Press â?? 3 sets of 5-8
Barbell Biceps Curl â?? 1-2 sets of 5-8

i just have one question i have an overdeveloped chest and its overpowering my shoulders, would anyone know if i can sacfrifice one or two chest exercises if nessessary to incorporate a few shoulder presses, if so where and how should i include it?
thanks

[quote]blue21 wrote:
i just have one question i have an overdeveloped chest and its overpowering my shoulders, would anyone know if i can sacfrifice one or two chest exercises if nessessary to incorporate a few shoulder presses, if so where and how should i include it?
thanks[/quote]

Let me fix that for you: you have underdeveloped shoulders, and your chest overpowers them. Unless you’re rocking a massive, full, evenly developed chest, you are not overdeveloped.

[quote]Rational Gaze wrote:

[quote]blue21 wrote:
i just have one question i have an overdeveloped chest and its overpowering my shoulders, would anyone know if i can sacfrifice one or two chest exercises if nessessary to incorporate a few shoulder presses, if so where and how should i include it?
thanks[/quote]

Let me fix that for you: you have underdeveloped shoulders, and your chest overpowers them. Unless you’re rocking a massive, full, evenly developed chest, you are not overdeveloped.
[/quote]

Beat me to it.

OP, since you obviously don’t have a lot of knowledge in this, why are you so insistent upon “tweaking” things made by people who are a lot smarter then you about this? Why not do the program as is, eat a lot, and grow. If you are following madcowes 5x5, how are you progressing each week? Where are you starting in terms of weight for your last set of 5 on exercises, where should you be (by the progression bill starr came up with) in 6 weeks? If you can’t answer these then you’re still doing it wrong.

no i understand the basic principle you add 2.5% on to your major lifts on a friday when you try and hit 3 reps after the 4x5 sets and then after that you add that 2.5% back onto the 5x5 set on monday, i just have a few questions. My gym is some what limited in certain things ie they do not have a 1 pound plate but a 1.75 so it might be difficulty to get the exact poundage which is why im hoping i might be able to use the rest pause technique?

also im guessing this program is going to be taxing and i nomraly rest between 2 and 3 minutes but im guessing its perfectly fine to rest up to 5 minutes in between sets right?