T Nation

Need Help for HPTA Restart


#1

Hey everyone, hope you all are doing great and getting those gains. Well this is my problem, so last year in April i did a testosterone cycle of Sust 250 and at the end of my 3rd week i got the flu and my source who now i know is not that well experienced, advised me to get off until i got better so i got off and asked if i should hop on nolvadex to help things bounce back but he insisted there was no need since i had only done 2 pins, that my body should bounce back by itself (1 pin the first week, 2 pin the 3rd week) . I agree it was stupid for me not to do my research but i trusted he knew what he was talking about knowing that he had done many cycles in the past and came off just fine. Well of course time passes and its June and i get my blood work and my test level is at 343 and of course like every other doctor,im “depressed” and me just trying to bounce back i take the anti depressants till September and felt better but my sex drive was still gone. I went back to my source and told him everything and he kept saying i would bounce back eventually, i gave it some time where days i would feel okay and other days i wouldnt,i began my daily research and realized i shouldve began my pct after i came off no matter how much i did so i got ahold of hcg (which was hard to find) and nolvadex and began self administrating in January this year. I pinned 500iu ed for 6 days and then 500iu eod for the second week and then waited 4 days and then did nolvadex 20/20/20/20. I was feeling great during the hcg and sex drive and libido improved and then during nolva i felt like everything was working backwards but knew it was prolly the lowering of estrogen, gave it about a month and a half to see how much better i really felt and i did feel better than i did before hopping on the pct but not back to normal, got blood work and my test is down to 277 now. My doctor is very stern to only believing what he knows so wouldnt give me blood work on estrogen since thats the female hormone and shouldnt have anything to do with my problem. But now he gave me a prescription for cialis and testosterone cypionate and i asked before getting to that if i could get on a hcg therapy to see if it could help bring back my natural levels and he said thats only for women for breast cancer and does nothing to men,i was so irritated to his lack of knowledge on hcg but anyways, i wanted to ask you all for advice on any hpta restart protocols that you all would suggest would be best, im able to get ahold of hcg, nolvadex and arimadex. Im sorry for the lack of blood work i understand that plays a big part but i was only able to get my testosterone levels check,i will look for a doctor that will help me get my estrogen levels along with LH/FSH and anything else you all suggest.


#2

I would say that you have two actions you need to take. One, get a new doctor, preferably one who isn’t blindingly incompetent. Two, run a full pct as if you’ve just come off a cycle. Run the Nolva 40/40/20/20 and then see where you’re at by getting blood work done (under the supervision of your new doctor). At that point you can have an idea of what is really going on with your body. Until then you’re just kind of doing it by feel, which can work, but probably not in your particular situation.

PS I am willing to bet that you won’t need antidepressants once your test is back to normal and your e2 is under control. Just a hunch.


#3

Awesome,thanks for the feedback. What do you mean exactly by “probably not in my particular situation?” And one more thing i have hcg also,could that help maybe a regimen of 5,000 iu first week, 2 pins of 2500 monday and thursday and second week 3,000iu, 3 pins of 1000 monday,Wednesday,friday and 3rd week 1500iu, 3 pins of 500 and 4th week 500iu, 2 pins of 250 monday and thursday, then the nolvadex protocol of 40/40/20/20 during those 4 weeks at the sametime. My reason for the hcg is due to my low testosterone which continues to lower and ya im not going to my old doctor,i already found a new doctor a friend of mine goes to where he gets his bloodwork as well. And ya i stopped my antidepressants because i knew it was just due to my hormones being out of whack


#4

HCG has a lot of good applications, but 5,000iu/w is going to be more trouble than it’s worth. Keep in mind that HCG-related e2 conversion happens in the testes, which means taking an AI will not help. Until you have blood work and numbers to go off of you shouldn’t get that aggressive.


#5

Alright got it,ill just do the nolvadex and then wait about 4-6 weeks and then get bloodwork and post my results. Thanks alot for the advice,really appreciate it


#6

Hey iron_yuppie would it help to combine clomid with the nolvadex or should i just take nolvadex alone?


#7

Guys have been using them together for years and it works well. But there is not a ton of evidence that suggests that one needs both. Nolva is very effective and has a lower incidence of side effects than Clomid.


#8

Alright well then ill just stick with the nolva considering the side effects that come from clomid


#9

Do you think it would be best for me to take arimidex after nolva since it could cause estrogen rebound?


#10

If you can find some science—not broscience, actual science—that shows that estrogen rebound is real, then I’d be interested in reading it.


#11

Yepp most of its broscience, well its the last day of my first week of nolva since i started last thursday, i know its confusing but i didnt want to wait till monday i just wanted to get started on my pct already,i thought i’d update you on how its going,so far my libido hasnt really changed but once me and my gf get intimate ive noticed i do get more aroused than i would before,not a big difference but i notice it and my erection is harder as well, i dont mean to go into detail but just to make sure you understand whats really going on. Also my ejaculation is a good amount the first time but after the first time its only drops after that until the following day. I know my estrogen will really start to get blocked very soon as i go further into pct so it could change my libido during intimacy. But i do have one question, my testicles feel sensitive now, could it just be them producing more testosterone?


#12

That’s a lot more information about your wang and/or its constituent fluids than I was interested in reading about this morning.


#13

My apologies,ive seen some extremely detailed info on here before so i tried my best not to over do it haha but ya just curious to see if you think its due to the nolvadex