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Need Feedback for My Program

Hi,

i have a new fitness programm since august and i would like to hear some feedback about it. Here it goes:

Monday & Thursday:
3 x 10 Chest Dip
5 x 6 Barbell squat
5 x 6 Chin-up
Tuesday & Friday:
3 x 10 Cable Straight Back Seated Row
5 x 6 Barbell Deadlift
5 x 6 Chin-up

these are my “must”-exercises. According to my program, i can also make 2 “bonus” exercises every training day.

I would really appreciate it, if you can tell me, how good this program is, and if not, why.

Sorry for my english and thanks for responding!

Look up starting strength and get on a good program.

1 Like

[quote]TemukaG wrote:
i have a new fitness programm since august and i would like to hear some feedback about it.[/quote]
You’ve been doing this for about 6 weeks already. How much has your strength improved on these five exercises? How has your bodyweight changed?

Also, what exactly are your goals?

[quote] Monday & Thursday:
3 x 10 Chest Dip
5 x 6 Barbell squat
5 x 6 Chin-up
Tuesday & Friday:
3 x 10 Cable Straight Back Seated Row
5 x 6 Barbell Deadlift
5 x 6 Chin-up

these are my “must”-exercises. According to my program, i can also make 2 “bonus” exercises every training day.[/quote]
The program doesn’t make much sense. Programs that only use a few exercises can be fine, but I don’t like that the “program”:

  • Has heavy squats twice a week and heavy deadlifts twice a week.
  • Has heavy, low rep chin-ups four times a week.
  • Overemphasizes back training and minimizes everything else.
  • Requires the “bonus exercises” to try to transform the training day into something more productive.

Bottomline, there are much better designed and much more well-rounded programs out there. You gave this one a shot for a while, switching to something else would be a good idea.

Hi, thanks for your response. I’m increasing the weight for each exercise every week, so i’m getting stronger. I lost about 5-6 KGs in this time and the body is defining. Those are my goals - to decrease my body fat and build up the basic muscle mass. Here some stats:

Age: 22
Sex: M
Height: 182 cm

Before the program:

Weight: 85 Kg

Now:

Weight: 78 KG

Actually, i don’t get it, why is it so bad to make deadlifts/squats twice per week? From one squat/dl to another i have 2 days to rest, so i think it’s ok.

About “minimizing everything else” - the idea of the program is the full body training. Those “bonus exercises” allow me to target on “everything else”, e.g. monday’s bonus exercises: Dumbbell flys and barbell upright row, Thursday: Arm curl and leg press etc.

My last program was something like this:

Mo: 4 x Chest exercise
Tuesday: 3 x biceps 3 x shoulders
Thursday: 3 x triceps 3 x back
Friday: everything a little bit
plus Cardio 45 min each day.

Now i’m doing the new program and instead of cardio, i’m on a diet.

The new program is much more effective then the old one. I am seeing the transformation of my body and it really doesn’t look bad.

Hi, thanks for your response. I’m increasing the weight for each exercise every week, so i’m getting stronger. I lost about 5-6 KGs in this time and the body is defining. Those are my goals - to decrease my body fat and build up the basic muscle mass.

Actually, i don’t get it, why is it so bad to make deadlifts/squats twice per week? From one squat/dl to another i have 2 days to rest, so i think it’s ok.

About “minimizing everything else” - the idea of the program is the full body training. Those “bonus exercises” allow me to target on “everything else”, e.g. monday’s bonus exercises: Dumbbell flys and push presses.

My point is, that i’m really seeing my body transforming and it does look good. And i still don’t understand, why is the program so bad - is it about resting, exercises or reps ?

[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:

[quote]TemukaG wrote:
i have a new fitness programm since august and i would like to hear some feedback about it.[/quote]
You’ve been doing this for about 6 weeks already. How much has your strength improved on these five exercises? How has your bodyweight changed?

Also, what exactly are your goals?

[quote] Monday & Thursday:
3 x 10 Chest Dip
5 x 6 Barbell squat
5 x 6 Chin-up
Tuesday & Friday:
3 x 10 Cable Straight Back Seated Row
5 x 6 Barbell Deadlift
5 x 6 Chin-up

these are my “must”-exercises. According to my program, i can also make 2 “bonus” exercises every training day.[/quote]
The program doesn’t make much sense. Programs that only use a few exercises can be fine, but I don’t like that the “program”:

  • Has heavy squats twice a week and heavy deadlifts twice a week.
  • Has heavy, low rep chin-ups four times a week.
  • Overemphasizes back training and minimizes everything else.
  • Requires the “bonus exercises” to try to transform the training day into something more productive.

Bottomline, there are much better designed and much more well-rounded programs out there. You gave this one a shot for a while, switching to something else would be a good idea.[/quote]

^This. This. This. ^

Where did you get this program?

You think you are getting good gains doing this, but what you don’t realize is that you would make 2x the gains if you switched to a better structured program. There are tons of 4 day splits you can find on here that will give you serious results.

[quote]TemukaG wrote:
Hi, thanks for your response. I’m increasing the weight for each exercise every week, so i’m getting stronger. I lost about 5-6 KGs in this time and the body is defining. Those are my goals - to decrease my body fat and build up the basic muscle mass.

Actually, i don’t get it, why is it so bad to make deadlifts/squats twice per week? From one squat/dl to another i have 2 days to rest, so i think it’s ok.

About “minimizing everything else” - the idea of the program is the full body training. Those “bonus exercises” allow me to target on “everything else”, e.g. monday’s bonus exercises: Dumbbell flys and push presses.

My point is, that i’m really seeing my body transforming and it does look good. And i still don’t understand, why is the program so bad - is it about resting, exercises or reps ? [/quote]

You are going to create an unbalanced physique.

Two days between the heavy squats and deadlifts is not enough rest. You think it’s okay, but you asked what everyone else thinks. So we are telling you.

You don’t have to minimize other body parts to do full body training. Full body training should hit everything evenly.

Why are dumbell flys and push presses your bonus exercises? You hardly hit your chest and shoulders, these exercises should be more important than just “bonus exercises”

Thanks for your feedback justin.

I am going to upload some pics in next days and then we can really discuss, how bad the program is. :slight_smile:

Just looking at the body parts worked, your core exercises don’t hit the deltoids at all (except for the chest dip hitting the anterior deltoid some). If you make sure to hit them in a “bonus exercise” then the workout could be complete (I’m not really qualified to speak to recovery, reps, and splits).

But if you have to program certain “bonus exercises” to make the workout complete, then those should be part of the core exercises, right? It’s been my experience that sort of doing what feels right and hoping you get a balanced workout and good progression isn’t a good plan.

Blasting your lower back(doesnt recover fast)with two big exercises at a time and barely any rest in between is a path destinated to injuries.

[quote]
My last program was something like this:

Mo: 4 x Chest exercise
Tuesday: 3 x biceps 3 x shoulders
Thursday: 3 x triceps 3 x back
Friday: everything a little bit
plus Cardio 45 min each day.

Now i’m doing the new program and instead of cardio, i’m on a diet.

The new program is much more effective then the old one. I am seeing the transformation of my body and it really doesn’t look bad.[/quote]
Basically you saw these big changes cuz your last program only focused on Curls, benches and a few weenie isolation exercises. I know it’s hard to accept that now, but you gotta stop putting together your own “homegrown” Workouts. There are a lot of pros out there who have years of experience and know what sort of individual preferences and exercises they can add without hurting themselves.

For now you should really stick with a workout that improves your basics (the Powerlifts + Pullups). Once your technique is perfect and you can handle arround 200 pounds in your Squat, Bench Press and Deadlifts you may change to a conventional Bodybuilding routine and add exercises.
You are doing yourself a big favor :wink:

Alles Gute

[quote]TemukaG wrote:
Those are my goals - to decrease my body fat and build up the basic muscle mass.[/quote]
At your height and weight, building lean muscle will decrease relative bodyfat and make you look leaner. Your bodyweight shouldn’t keep going down because you’ll end up looking a typical tall, skinny guy with some abs.

You actually have less than one day to rest, because you’re doing one exercise and then the other the next day, and then only one rest day. Deadlifts and squats train a lot of the same muscles, being especially hard on the lower back. If you have to train both exercises several times per week, using different weights and different sets/reps would be a much better option.

That might’ve been the idea, but that isn’t how it turned out. The most basic full body workout is: Some kind of upper body press, some kind of upper body pull, and something for the lower body.

Your plan has: Upper body press-lower body-upper body pull in one workout and upper body pull-lower body/arguably upper body pull-upper body pull in the next workout.

Something like Chad Waterbury’s Total Body Training routine is another good example of properly programmed full body workouts:

Notice how the sets and reps change each training day also. That’s key, because it gives the plan an element of variety to continue progression and encourages better muscle gains and strength.

They might help, but I certainly wouldn’t choose those two exercises and think I’m covering “everything else.” Legs, chest, shoulders, and arms would be “everything else” that isn’t decently addressed with the “must” exercises.

Yes, yes, and yes.

[quote]My last program was something like this:

Mo: 4 x Chest exercise
Tuesday: 3 x biceps 3 x shoulders
Thursday: 3 x triceps 3 x back
Friday: everything a little bit
plus Cardio 45 min each day.[/quote]
So your last program had pretty much zero leg training, and your current program has barely any leg training. At least that’s an improvement, I guess.

hey chris, thanks for your response. I’m gonna check this total body program out.

One thing tho:) DB Flys and Push Presses were just two examples of bonus exercices. I mean, i can choose on every training day different two exercises, like legs, chest, shoulders, biceps etc. so pretty much what i want. I thought, this might be helpful to “fill up the lacks”.

In conclusion, i have to change my program, right? Would this Total-Body Training you wrote good for me now ?

Danke Quiet Warrior! ))

[quote]TemukaG wrote:
Thanks for your feedback justin.

I am going to upload some pics in next days and then we can really discuss, how bad the program is. :slight_smile:

[/quote]

i honestly LOL’d

just trying to help

I think the DeLorme inspired 6 week Hypertrophy Training by Pacvel would be a great choice for you!
Builds strength and mass.
You’re welcome

this program is… strange! not balanced at all BUT doing dips/chins squats/deads is just good no matter what, so you may see results. But soon or later you will see also the limits of this approach.

I would add more overhead pressing. so:

A
chins
squats
dips

  • if you need arms work

B
pullups
military press / clean and press
deads

  • neck or torso work if needed

doin this in every rep scheme (from 3x3 to 10x10) and doin this really HARD with balanced diet will get you somewhere, I’m sure. If that’s your goal.

[quote]TemukaG wrote:
One thing tho:) DB Flys and Push Presses were just two examples of bonus exercices. I mean, i can choose on every training day different two exercises, like legs, chest, shoulders, biceps etc. so pretty much what i want. I thought, this might be helpful to “fill up the lacks”.[/quote]
It’s not enough because the “must” exercises are poorly chosen in the first place.

Does Kristen Stewart need acting lessons? Does Ozzy Osbourne need a translator? Do fish pee in the ocean?

Yes. You’d absolutely benefit from following a pre-designed program to the letter, and that would a fine choice.

Hi ,

so i’ve decided to switch to the total-body training of Waterbury. I’ve choosed those exercises for first week:

  • Flat Barbell Bench Press
  • Chin-ups
  • Standard Barbell Deadlfts
  • Barbell Squats
  • Hammer Curls
  • DB shoulder press

In the second week i’m gonna change the exercises, allowing to the program.

I hope, that this time i choosed the exercises wise :))

Thanks again for your responses!

As the one how gave him this routine, I think I should explain the reasons behind the program.

First the program was inspired by the WKM-Plan. (A beginner plan that is very popular in german bb-forums)

Also here are some basic principles for this routine I told him:

  • learn the proper form /technique of every exercise
  • never go to failure, you should always be able to perform 2-3 more reps at the end of a set
  • try to do 25-30 reps per exercise total (not counting the warm-up)
  • train at least 4 times a week
  • rest between sets as long as you have to perform the next set with proper form

The standard WKM-plan looks like this:

Day 1:

  • Squat
  • Benchpress
  • Bent-over Rows

Day 2:

  • Deadlift
  • Chin-Ups
  • Military Press

The reason why we modified the day 2, is that he has a significant dysbalance between his pulling- and pushing strength in his upper body. So I gave him the advice to replace one upper body pressing movement with an additional pulling movement. So that the modified day 2 looks like this:

mod. Day 2:

  • Deadlift
  • Chin-Ups
  • some kind of Rowing-movement

You actually have less than one day to rest, because you’re doing one exercise and then the other the next day, and then only one rest day. Deadlifts and squats train a lot of the same muscles, being especially hard on the lower back. If you have to train both exercises several times per week, using different weights and different sets/reps would be a much better option.[/quote]

Thats correct if you train them with (relative) big weights. But he is in a beginner state and trying to learn the right technique, so he is not using much weight (something i told him) and therefore not taxing the CNS that much. You should also consider, that he is a young healthy college student, how gets enough sleep and eats well, so his regeneration shouldn’t be a problem.

Also I gave him the advice just to train, when he “feels right”,meaning that if he would be sore form the last training he shouldn’t train but if he felt over energized he could train 4 times in a row. All depending on his personal feeling.

So to answer why he trains squats /deadlifts 2 times a week, to really learn something you have to do it as often as you can.

The last thing I want to explain is why he writes that there are “must” and “bonus” exercises. The answer is simple, to give him some room to do “fun” stuff. Everyone who trains more than a year and strictly followed a programm for long period knows, that the motivation to train decreases over time. At the beginning you’re enthusiastic and go to the gym fully motivated, but every following week you are less and less interested in you routine.
So to vary the training, I gave him the possibility to do some exercises he WANT to do. Which, is up to him.

That he chose two chest exercises… yeah you all know that every man likes to train chest and arms => the mirror muscles :slight_smile:

It’s nothing I recommended.

regards
fischfutter