T Nation

My Professor Dissed Berardi!

I’m taking a nutrition course geared towards athletes. The professor and I are at odds a lot because she says stuff that’s, well, full of crap. She was about to go over the “proper” amount of protein a weight-training athlete needs so I figure I’d give her a copy of Protein Prejudice.
Kind of like a preemptive strike.
Anyway she begins the next class by mentioning I brought in an article and then goes on to say that, while the points he makes are good, Berardi shouldn’t be really considered a reputable soure because he has connections with a supplement company.
I don’t say anything.
I really wish I had gone through the article point by point just to make her squirm.
The good news is I also gave her the study from the Think Tank thread about leucine helping with PWO nutrition. She had never heard of any studies showing protein ingestion as well as carbs improves weight-training progress. Once she acknowledges this I’m going to trap her and get her to admit protein powders DO have a definate use because there’s no way you could down a turkey sandwich during a workout.
I aint giving up anytime soon…

Keep fighting the good fight, brother!

Your prof sounds like she doesn’t really know what she is talking about. Hard to argue consuming carbs and protein post-workout is NOT beneficial.

Nate:

When faced with this, the guys here usually give the same (and wise!) advice:

1)Don’t piss off the instructor…regurgitate her ideas on the test…get a good grade…THEN

  1. If you want the advice that will get you to your goals, then follow JB’s advice…

(Let me guess…your instructor is strong, buff and healthy looking, right?)

Just kidding…

Mufasa

Just remember she’s the one giving the grades out.

I could eat a turkey sandwich during a workout. I am sooo hungry right now.

Yeah, i’ve heard some funny shit from my professors too. These are health & sports professionals with PHDs, most of whom don’t even look barely fit.

They seem to think that your genes totally control where you’ll end up in life and totally discount the value of hard work.

The sad thing is, all my fellow students swallow it without a word.

Just chill on it bro, if you’re an undergrad you have nothing to win by starting something. Just tell them what they want to hear, keep an open mind. When you get to honours or post-grad, then you can start proving your points with research.

It’s like in martial arts, noone will even talk to you until you get a black belt, cos they don’t want to hear what you’re going to say. As far as they’re concerned you don’t even have an opinion until you’re standing on the same line as them.

Good stuff, guys.

Yeah, she’s not in good shape. In fact, after class I subtley let something along the lines of this slip: “Berardi has got solid degrees AND is in great shape.”

As far as grades go, I’d rather go down in glory than get a good grade (I aced my first test anyway). I plan on being a world-renowned fitness guru so this is probably good practice.

About the turkey sandwich, I hear you. If she says the same thing, I’ll just bring up the fast absorbtion needed during a workout with minimal digestion. Oh, and it’s not like she didn’t believe c+p were useful, she just had never heard about the protein part.

Here’s the interesting part. Don’t know if this is getting too private, but apparently she’s met Mr. Berardi. She said he applied to get his PhD here. Guess he didn’t end up wanting to go.

It’s good that you’re trying to educate her but you’re using the wrong approach.

Do it in private, to make her lose face infront of all the other students will NOT benefit you. It’s feels great but your grades might suffer, they shouldn’t but you know what human nature is like…

Point out her errors in private with a lot of research to back you up then let HER come up infront of the class with all this new research SHE have dug up. Let her take the credit, YOU know and SHE know but nobody else.

The endresult:
She feels good saving face.
You might get better grades.
The rest of the students will learn “the real deal”.

I think you also might talk to her in person because sometimes what nutrition professors teach in undergrad class really isn’t their full belief. Remember, some concepts are a bit far fetched for 1 undergrad nutrition course. I know my professor taugh straight to the food pyramid in my undergrad class but when I sat down with him in person (office hours) he tore it apart. He too spoke out against high protein ingestion yet agreed with Berardi in person. The key you have to remember is that some people can’t hear all of it because they never do hear all of it. If your professor started talking about how Surge would make everyone hyoooge then you would have people just living off Surge 7 meals a day.

if its one thing I learned is that when you disagree with your prof you shouldn’t always voice your opinion, atleast while others are looking on cause if you stump them on something while other studets are looking they’ll get you back for it when they see your name and are assigning your grade.

As a side note, is your prof. hot, cause maybe she is just one of those bookworm hotties with glasses that doesn’t get enough and thats why she is opposing this whole thing so much. And if so maybe you can do a little something something to change her view. :stuck_out_tongue: if not just ignore all that I said :smiley:

Hi There,

This is an interesting discussion.

For starters, I don’t believe I was “dissed.” Your prof brought up a valid point - although - it appears as if she never really made a rebuttal of my article or my argument.

She did a slight of hand in which she changed the focus of the debate, questioning my credibility instead of my reasoning. That’s a huge debating mistake and constitutes a logical fallacy. In other words, shame on her.

Now, I think that there’s no question my credibility is sound (and a straw poll among my colleagues will verify this). I’ve got a PhD in the area, am a successful coach of olympic, ncaa, and professional athletes, and author of 2 successful books.

Yes, I am affiliated with Surge sales - that’s something I never hid. I developed it and have been paid for it. Beyond that, I’m not tied into sales for any company. Therefore I recommend what I believe is true and what works.

HOWEVER, she’s right in one respect. You should question EVERY expert’s advice, biases, etc and examine their work based on its merit.

Too bad she didnt do that herself.

Had she done so, this is what coulda happened.

  1. If my ideas had no merit she coulda said - these points are invalid because of the following studies…x,y,z. Then she coulda said, he probably made this stuff up because he’s affiliated with a supplement company. See, she would have rebut my argument and then used the affiliation she erroneously thought I had to describe WHY I was wrong.

  2. To the contrary, if my ideas had merit she could have said these points are valid however be cautious not to believe everything he says as he’s affiliated with a supplement company.

But in the end, it appears none of this was done. She took the intellectually lazy way out and it’s a shame - the students in your class coulda learned something from the exchange.

Oh and BTW…if she’s going to use logical fallacies to debate “Mr Berardi” she’d better at least show me the proper respect I deserve in these matters and call me “Dr Berardi”

I do have my PhD now and am a faculty member at the University of Texas at Austin.

ALSO, I recently submitted TC an article in which I actually do debate a University professor (a well respected one, at that) on this topic. We went 3 rounds and it’s a really interesting discussion!

I don’t know when TC’s planning on running it so if you want to see it soon (and perhaps take it in to her) let him know!

Also, which University are you at?

Hey, Nate…

I know that you’re really full of “Spit and Fire” right now…

But early in your career and during your College studies probably is not the best time to “Go Down in Glory…”

Get a good grade…get your degree…then cut out on your own once you’re gotten that paper under your belt…

Mufasa

Moe…

Just curious…

Is that guy in your Atavar licking one of his “Moobs”?

LOL!

Mufasa

I have argued with her in front of the whole class. But there’s nothing to worry about for one simple reason:
She wins.
She may have outdated ideas, but she’s got her act together. Usually the other kids end up giggling at me. :frowning:
Unfortunately, her ideas are the same one-on-one.
Sorry, she’s old. Otherwise you’re totally right.

Wow! A testo vs. estro intellectual throwdown in the steel cage of academia! Kick some ass Dr. Berardi.

Just rip off your shirt and say ‘HERE’S MY PROOF, BITCH!’

I agree with Mufasa.

Now, this isn’t specifically for you but for all the undergrads out there. If you’re an undergrad, shut the hell up and learn what you can. THERE IS STUFF TO BE LEARNED, even if your prof doesn’t know it all.

It amazes me how students, when learning a prof doesn’t know 1 thing in a field, start to disrespect the prof for not being omnipotent and omniscient!

So my advice to students is the same as to trainees…shut up and … (lift, learn, whatever).

You know, I have students come in to my classes (not knowing what I do, thinking Im some young, knows nothing, PhD guy with no “real world” experience) and tell me Im wrong all the time.

It’s insulting for many reasons.

First, they know very little about the area so to debate someone like me means they assume they have the same level of training and or knowledge as me. For a 3rd year undergrad to assume this shows me they aren’t really students. Real students know what they know but, more importantly, what they don’t know.

Secondly, and this is the worst, they don’t know how to actually have a logical debate. Just like many of these darn internet debates that take place every day, once something like this begins, the real issues don’t get discussed. It’s all debating peripheral points, slinging mud, etc - everything but discussing the issue.

And guess what - no one learns. That’s the point of education. That’s the point of debate. That’s the point of discussion.

It’s a shame that knowledge and debate have become contests with winners and losers. Learning, academia, intellectual development should NEVER be a contest between combatants. When it becomes so you end up fighting so hard for “your side” that you never look to question whether “your side” is right or wrong.

Go read Shugart’s blog about the annoying people that stand up at conferences and spout off.

Undergrads - don’t be one of them!

I was in the same situation in a Biology class that had a huge section on health. They had a special guest TA come in and talk to us about how to gain lean muscle mass for aesthetic/athletic, etc needs. He kept reiterating on how needing a lot of protein for success was completely wrong. I really wanted to raise my hand and say “Maybe that’s why you are 6’2’’ 140 dripping wet,” but I wanted my A so just squirmed in my seat and joked about it w/ my friend.

I was standing right there after class with your article printed out in my hand. I should have flipped to the part near the end and asked her what she thought of all the benefits listed.
Oddly enough, I had to write a report choosing whether low carb or high carb diets are better for weight loss and defend my position. (Obvious choice I think.) And guess what? I use that Layman et al 2003 study you mention. Found it myself. Go pubmed.
By the way, she didn’t know you had your PhD at that point. (The article I gave her said you were still pursuing it).
Mufasa, that nipple-licking man is Peter Griffin. Stop whatever you’re doing and get the Family Guy dvds now.

I’m at Umass Amherst.