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My First Bulk- Too Much Fat?

Hey guys,

I recently ended my first bulk, and I’m not so sure it went as well as it could have. I went from 140-175 in about three months, but my waist increased from 32.5" to 36". I made some good strength gains and obviously gained a decent amount of muscle, but I know I could have done it better (i.e. with less fat gains). Have any of you found a good rule of thumb with regards to how much your waist should increase in an ideal bulk? In hindsight, I made some silly nutrtional mistakes and took the “just fucking eat” thing a bit too far. It was definitely fun, though. Eager to hear some feedback…

Stats:
21 years old, 5’8.5", 2 years training

Got any pictures? Does it matter to you?

I would think it varies from person to person. I have a gut now but i dont’t really care i am gonna carry it till next spring.

Personal opinion, and I think some would agree with me, bulking/cutting is on its way out. Its about time we all start looking good year round.

I’d suggest getting your diet straightened out, John Berardi’s got some wicked sick articles abourt clean bulking and how to stay lean. www.johnberardi.com.

I spent a week reading his articles and his systems. I went down from 21% to 14% bf while bulking and am still adding some good clean mass.

best of luck

go

Why did you stop at 175?

[quote]Arms Afire wrote:
Why did you stop at 175?[/quote]

It wasn’t as though I chose 175 to stop at, I was more concerned with the fat gain. So, I decided to slow it down and re-evaluate what I was doing/progress made. I’ll maintain for a while and go from there.

I’m not sure where yet, either keep bulking or try to drop some fat and then proceed with bulking. I know the second way isn’t the most efficient. As for right now, I’m trying to get info. on other people’s fat gains during a bulking cycle.

[quote]glenmowen wrote:
Personal opinion, and I think some would agree with me, bulking/cutting is on its way out. Its about time we all start looking good year round.

I’d suggest getting your diet straightened out, John Berardi’s got some wicked sick articles abourt clean bulking and how to stay lean. www.johnberardi.com.

I spent a week reading his articles and his systems. I went down from 21% to 14% bf while bulking and am still adding some good clean mass.

best of luck

go[/quote]

I have to agree. The “see Food” diet may be the best way to gain the most amount of muscle possible, but clean bulking can get you some serious gains and keep you/get you lean.

It may be that the lightning-fast, hummingbird metabolism people need to eat 5000 kcals a day to gain anything, but the rest of us can gain muscle and stay lean if we do it right, time our carbs, and get the right amount protein and fat. Hard training and good, nutritious, clean food do the job for me.

It’s truly amazing that guys 170 and 180 lbs think they got bulking down. IF I was going to cut I’d get to about 215, but I’m going to start a bulk in October.

To Engerland66, yes, you did bulk a little too fast. The wise thing to do is to slow down a little but keep bulking. Go for 1-2 lbs per week rather than 3-4. It takes a lot longer and is a lot harder to add muscle than to strip off the fat.

Just remember the mistake you made this time, learn from it and move on.

I don’t know how I much even like the term bulking anymore, but it’s been around forever so good enough I guess.

I started training specifically for size by design about a year ago at 198 lbs and I was fairly lean. (there is a long story I won’t get into now to go with this). Pretty visible abs, but not ripped. I started the anabolic diet at around 4000 calories a day and allowed myself to gain enough fat where I can pinch an inch and a little change on average off of my stomach.

I gradually increased daily calories as I gained until I’m at about 5000 now and can still pinch the same amount off my stomach I could 8 or 9 months ago, but I weighed 237 this morning. As far as I’m concerned that’s a good way to “bulk”. I’m not fat, but I’m not real lean either. I don’t plan on doing any serious cutting for another couple years at least.

You guys who want to look good all year round, if that means being very much leaner than I am now will be here ten years from now talking about how you can gain more size. You don’t have to get fat to make optimal gains, but if you plan on being actually “lean” while making serious gains you are kidding yourself. It won’t make any difference you’ll try it any way, so next year we’ll meet back here and see who got bigger.

This guy overdid it, but he’s young so no harm done. I agree with the guy who said to keep bulking, but slow down on the calories some. Nobody seems to understand anymore that once you have some serious size losing fat, especially when you’re young, is a triviality. The more muscle you’re carrying, which is the number one mechanism by which fat is burned, the easier it is. Go ahead and try getting big and lean at the same time, unless you are fat already, and see what happens.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I don’t know how I much even like the term bulking anymore, but it’s been around forever so good enough I guess.

I started training specifically for size by design about a year ago at 198 lbs and I was fairly lean. (there is a long story I won’t get into now to go with this). Pretty visible abs, but not ripped. I started the anabolic diet at around 4000 calories a day and allowed myself to gain enough fat where I can pinch an inch and a little change on average off of my stomach.

I gradually increased daily calories as I gained until I’m at about 5000 now and can still pinch the same amount off my stomach I could 8 or 9 months ago, but I weighed 237 this morning. As far as I’m concerned that’s a good way to “bulk”. I’m not fat, but I’m not real lean either. I don’t plan on doing any serious cutting for another couple years at least.

You guys who want to look good all year round, if that means being very much leaner than I am now will be here ten years from now talking about how you can gain more size. You don’t have to get fat to make optimal gains, but if you plan on being actually “lean” while making serious gains you are kidding yourself. It won’t make any difference you’ll try it any way, so next year we’ll meet back here and see who got bigger.

This guy overdid it, but he’s young so no harm done. I agree with the guy who said to keep bulking, but slow down on the calories some. Nobody seems to understand anymore that once you have some serious size losing fat, especially when you’re young, is a triviality. The more muscle you’re carrying, which is the number one mechanism by which fat is burned, the easier it is. Go ahead and try getting big and lean at the same time, unless you are fat already, and see what happens.[/quote]

This is good information; thanks a lot for the feedback.

[quote]Arms Afire wrote:
It’s truly amazing that guys 170 and 180 lbs think they got bulking down. IF I was going to cut I’d get to about 215, but I’m going to start a bulk in October.

To Engerland66, yes, you did bulk a little too fast. The wise thing to do is to slow down a little but keep bulking. Go for 1-2 lbs per week rather than 3-4. It takes a lot longer and is a lot harder to add muscle than to strip off the fat.

Just remember the mistake you made this time, learn from it and move on.[/quote]

Just because were not as big as you doesnt make our knowledge invaluable. Don’t be so naieve.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
You don’t have to get fat to make optimal gains, but if you plan on being actually “lean” while making serious gains you are kidding yourself. It won’t make any difference you’ll try it any way, so next year we’ll meet back here and see who got bigger.[/quote]

Exactly. Man, if some college kid wants to stay lean year 'round because he’s hooking up and wants to stay lean, cool. I won’t hate. It’s when people who have made ZERO progress over several years proclaim the virtues of “clean bulking” that my blood pressure rises.

[quote]glenmowen wrote:
Arms Afire wrote:
It’s truly amazing that guys 170 and 180 lbs think they got bulking down. IF I was going to cut I’d get to about 215, but I’m going to start a bulk in October.

To Engerland66, yes, you did bulk a little too fast. The wise thing to do is to slow down a little but keep bulking. Go for 1-2 lbs per week rather than 3-4. It takes a lot longer and is a lot harder to add muscle than to strip off the fat.

Just remember the mistake you made this time, learn from it and move on.

Just because were not as big as you doesnt make our knowledge invaluable. Don’t be so naieve.[/quote]

This all depends. If the person giveing advise is 170lbs and has put on 40lbs of muscle naturaly in the last year then Im sure everyone is willing to take his advice into consideration.

If he is 170lbs has been lifting for years and hasent dont jack shit with his time other than suck up his newbie gains and strut around in a undershirt then he can keep his advice to himself.

I respect two things, strength and a amount of muscle that cant be attained by most people no matter what. Or some one who has made a shit load of progress in a fairly short period of time. They both prove you know what your doing.

Fuck people who get all thier knowledge from books, how the hell would they know what they are saying is worth shit? How can people prescribe bo squats when they squat 300lbs how can people advise a good bulking diet when they have gained 20lbs in the last two years.

I think you did very well on your bulk probably a little under 20lbs of fat gained tho. But for 3 months that is alot of muscle.

Keep bulking cut your claories back for a few weeks so you can maintain the weight and maybe harden up a bit by burning some fat and replaceing it with muscle. Then just bulk around 1+lb a week.

Watch your waist if it gets bigger lower the calories and keep on trucken.

I gained about 3" on my waist in about 10 weeks when I first started bulking and I had only gained about 20lbs but since then my waist has been more or less the exact same size and I have gained 36lbs since then.

It works its self out when you stick to one goal. Work hard and in 8 months you will look back and be very with what you did with the year.

I’m not saying that bulking is wrong, but for some people (myself included) I think that moderate, clean bulking beats extremely high calorie bulking.

I’m not huge or anything, 180 lb isnt much but it is up from like 160 last year and not an ounce of that has been fat gain which is pretty impressive if you know how easily I have found it to gain fat over my lifetime.

[quote]abominabelsnoman wrote:
I’m not saying that bulking is wrong, but for some people (myself included) I think that moderate, clean bulking beats extremely high calorie bulking.

I’m not huge or anything, 180 lb isnt much but it is up from like 160 last year and not an ounce of that has been fat gain which is pretty impressive if you know how easily I have found it to gain fat over my lifetime.[/quote]

So hang on…20lbs in a year!!!

thats…a…tad…slow…in…my …book.

[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
You don’t have to get fat to make optimal gains, but if you plan on being actually “lean” while making serious gains you are kidding yourself. It won’t make any difference you’ll try it any way, so next year we’ll meet back here and see who got bigger.

Exactly. Man, if some college kid wants to stay lean year 'round because he’s hooking up and wants to stay lean, cool. I won’t hate. It’s when people who have made ZERO progress over several years proclaim the virtues of “clean bulking” that my blood pressure rises.[/quote]

Yeah, that’s the real point. Most guys nowadays would be happy being a Bowflex commercial and that’s even an improvement by far over the fat unhealthy masses. That can be accomplished with relative ease and as long you know going in you aren’t going to wind up very big overall then fine. Stay lean all year. You’ll live longer and be healthier while looking better doing it.

Confusing this with bodybuilding is what gets me. I want to be imposingly large. I want people to not have to guess whether I workout when they see me the first time. That will not happen in my lifetime if I’m worried about my abs every summer. In one of the recent articles the guy asked rhetorically “who wants to gain 10 pounds only to lose it cutting for the summer?” I sure don’t. I’ll take a few years and gain 50-60 pounds or even more if possible where losing a bit of it to a cut won’t matter at all.

I respect the fact that the OP actually has an above average goal. You’ll get there. Actually, even if you didn’t cut back the food very much eventually you’ll start getting leaner because there will be more of you to feed.

I started at 150. Currently 175-180. That’s all LBM gains, not fat, in 18 months of training. I want to get to 210 at 10% within 3 years, which will be a lean body mass of 190. At 5’10", that’s pretty decent in my opinion. And it’ll mean a 50lb muscle gain on my untrained physique accomplished in 5 years. That’s what Brooks Kubik (in DT) says most people can expect to achieve. (Most people never get anywhere near it though…)

From my experience, it’s better to gain at the rate of 2-3lb LBM:1lb fat per month than 1lb LBM:0lb fat every 3 months. Plus the problem with the clean bulk idea for people with fast metabolisms (like me) is that the new muscle can be lost very, very easily - it’s better to force your body to adapt to a new weight set point.

[quote]n3wb wrote:
I think you did very well on your bulk probably a little under 20lbs of fat gained tho. But for 3 months that is alot of muscle.

Keep bulking cut your claories back for a few weeks so you can maintain the weight and maybe harden up a bit by burning some fat and replaceing it with muscle. Then just bulk around 1+lb a week.

Watch your waist if it gets bigger lower the calories and keep on trucken.

I gained about 3" on my waist in about 10 weeks when I first started bulking and I had only gained about 20lbs but since then my waist has been more or less the exact same size and I have gained 36lbs since then.

It works its self out when you stick to one goal. Work hard and in 8 months you will look back and be very with what you did with the year.

[/quote]

Thanks for the info. Did you make any diet or training changes between the first 10 weeks and the 36 lb. gained afterwards? I’m asking because you said you didn’t get much fat w/ the 36 lbs…

[quote]n3wb wrote:
<<< It works its self out when you stick to one goal. >>>[/quote]

Quite so. I don’t where it got started that people think major body comp changes happen so fast that they’ll walk past a mirror one and and say HO-LEE SHIT, how did I get so fat or big or whatever the case may be. You get plenty of warning about what’s happening. If you’re blowing up like cow pull back on the food some some, if you find you’re losing strength and size eat some more.

If people would view their goals over the course of several years instead of a few weeks the issues DO work themselves out.

[quote]engerland66 wrote:
n3wb wrote:
I think you did very well on your bulk probably a little under 20lbs of fat gained tho. But for 3 months that is alot of muscle.

Keep bulking cut your claories back for a few weeks so you can maintain the weight and maybe harden up a bit by burning some fat and replaceing it with muscle. Then just bulk around 1+lb a week.

Watch your waist if it gets bigger lower the calories and keep on trucken.

I gained about 3" on my waist in about 10 weeks when I first started bulking and I had only gained about 20lbs but since then my waist has been more or less the exact same size and I have gained 36lbs since then.

It works its self out when you stick to one goal. Work hard and in 8 months you will look back and be very with what you did with the year.

Thanks for the info. Did you make any diet or training changes between the first 10 weeks and the 36 lb. gained afterwards? I’m asking because you said you didn’t get much fat w/ the 36 lbs…[/quote]

Nope nothing at all, I did start eating a little more often but thats just because I got hungry more often.

Also I actualy I lost some size off my waist and gained 36lbs. But this is due to cutting out the majority of my junk food later in the day when ever I started to gain to much fat.

Lets say you start off with a extra 1000 cals more than you usualy eat with your bulk your diet consisting of a good bit of junk food pop tarts etc mixed with whole food. You eat the same food and meals every day.

In 10 weeks you gain 2" on your waist and 20lbs and you decide you want to lose 1"off your waist so you can repeat the process without getting to fat. You move your junk food to breakfast and postworkout and push your carbs into the first half of the day and move your beef chicken etc into the later part of the day. Then over 3 weeks or so you lean out while still getting to eat the foods you love. You wouldnt lose strength or muscle infact you would probably gain some from the extra energy before your workouts… This is assumeing you lift earlier in the day.


n3wb