T Nation

My Experience: Cycle at 17 Yrs Old

Alright, this is a story I wish to share with many youngsters (as I am still one myself), but will find it extremely beneficial for them. Feel free to comment or call me stupid but I am really just seeking to help young people.

When I was 17, I went into a store that sold me prohormones. At the time, my testosterone was really high, and I had no idea what pro hormones really were. The man at the store informed me that they would not be detrimental to my hormone profile, because they encouraged your body to convert the compounds into more hormones.

Wallah, I thought I was safe. WRONG! You still get shut down! 2 months later, after crying about my breakup with a perfect lady, a low sex drive, a worsening case of gyno, I decided to get myself checked out. I went to the endocrinologist to get rid of the gyno that I had since I was 14 (always had it due to puberty, it was just slightly worse then).

The only post cycle I took after the 8 weeks was an otc 6-bromo product that the guy at the store had sold me (for estrogen control only- didn’t know I needed to worry about testosterone levels). By the way, the man at the store put me on an 8 WEEK CYCLE of Cynobol (more or less a superdrol clone- not cyanostane) and 8 weeks of oral Tren (called hgx).

I did not have any idea what these compounds were. Immediately after my bloodwork was taken, I started another cycle without knowing what my blood work would look like. Luckily, for gyno, my endo was already prescribing tamoxifen. When my bloodwork came back a week later and I was just on the 4 week cycle I just started, the feeling of complete idiocy came over me as I stared long and hard at the bloodwork.

I DID NOT KNOW EVERYTHING. This was a new thought to me, but for once I understood that I don’t know everything. I didn’t even feel like a man. My testosterone was in the high 200’s/800. CRAP. Enough said. Crap. I looked up post cycle therapy, and found out that tamoxifen was perfect. So after my cycle, I started it at 20 mg each day.

Amazingly, I saw an immediate increase in libido and used it as pct for both that cycle all the way through, and one more since I felt like I was doing it right. Finally, I got blood work done again. This was 1 1/2 months after post cycle therapy finished on my third and FINAL cycle. My testosterone was now 450/800-1100- whatever you guys wanna think it is out of. The average for a 21 year old was 610, and I was 18, so it is probably slightly less since a man actually has an average of about 650 at 29 years of age.

I was feeling fine though and having sex regularly, so I did not really care that much. The primary concern for me became finishing puberty. Well, this is what I have to share with you all: When you take hormones in puberty, you run the risk of throwing your endocrine system out of wack and closing bone growth. Getting hormones back on track is not as easy as it looks.

I have read books and books and scholarly journal upon scholarly journal and bloodwork upon bloodwork and logs upon logs (get the picture?) and I have came across several important conclusions. When you take exogenous testosterone (prohormone or not), you initially shut down your testicles. Following this can come long term damage to your HPTA (your pituitaries hormone regulation system)-regardless of any age. With no FSH for sperm production, and no LH for testosterone, you will be secondary hypogonadal. Long cycles with long pct often cause this.

Luckily, the LH/FSH typically recovers in about 3 weeks to 2 months following a standard cycle, with testosterone taking 4 months to a year. However, when one is in puberty, LH and testosterone are on a steady rise. If they only recover to the point they were at (say I was at 450 testosterone at 17) then they have yet to advance beyond this level and may not if steroids are continued.

For people who are primary hypogonadal (aren’t producing in testicles), their testicles will be smaller- typically 20 percent- measure yourself. Now comes the complicated part- fixing things. Here is also where I share what I did.

Following a cycle most people take Tamoxifen/Clomid, or a really strong AI like Anastr- or both. Many use HCG on cycle to stop the testicles from shrinking. There are problems with all of these methods (not saying they don’t have their place but really you should all know this). HCG acts as LH. As such it can be supressive to the HPTA over long duration. If used, it should be used for a very short amount of time.

Tamoxifen and Clomid on the other hand can also be harmful when used too long. When used for 3-4 weeks, testosterone levels can be raised from 0 or minimal levels. But if clomid/tamoxifen is taken for too long, the body will see no benefit and may become reliant. In other words, when you stop use (because of the mechanism it works and modifying estrogens), testosterone will probably decline 1-2 months after use.

This does not leave you at square one (a testosterone level of 0), but it leaves you at square 4 or 5/10. Therefore, a S.E.R.M. like tamoxifen or clomid definitely has their place in proper post cycle as they bring you up from zero and bring you to a sustainable (but not amazing permanently) level. The other problem for teens is that tamoxifen and clomid can cause minor hair loss.

Most people may not notice, but for a teen wishing to grow a beard this can potentially stunt things. Point is, whether HCG is used on cycle or a very short time after, keep it short. Using tamoxifen or clomid for your rats is good in the short run, but do not sustain it forever. If you must, cycle the clomid or tamoxifen (like a second pct). AI’s should not be stacked as they will make estrogen 0 and this is not good for you or your joints.

Nevertheless, AI’s are very important in destroying the enzymes that will convert testosterone to estrogen in the long run, and will help the HPTA just a little in the short run (since it isn’t getting as much negative feedback via too much estrogen). So what did I do differently while sitting at the 4-5/10 to raise my testosterone levels. From here, I tried over the counter methods and gave it time.

After my last cycle (the 3rd), I took a SERM for 3 weeks (prescribed, wasn’t for rats). I did not use hcg. Following this, I gave my body time. NOTE***- it is super important to work out super hard, sleep right, have proper nutrition, and get sexually stimulated as much as possible. I do not recommend porn, only because looking at models all day will turn you off of getting sexually stimulated by your less attractive counterparts.

So anyway, I gave it a few months to let my body do what it could to recover even after my abuse of it (prohormones were in high dose- 45-60 mg superdrol, max lmg, and Halo). So from there, I was sitting at 450 ng/dl testosterone total. I was 205 pounds of muscle and felt fine. From here I learned a few tricks in encouraging my body to produce more. I took massive amounts of vitamin D.

When steroids are used, they can often cause the blood work to go out of wack. Often (maybe because of use I couldn’t find this in my research) it seems that vitamin D stores are depleted. This may just be from being unhealthy, but if you have a vitamin D, or zinc deficiency, you can expect to never be the man you could become. Pick up vitamin D, zinc, fish oil, a multi, and wait it out.

From here, You may want to consider something that will block estrogen from where you are at and to encourage your brain to release more LH and testosterone without stimulating it via a serm or HCG (as it can be suppressive). If you can get a real doctor prescription AI, give it a try. It will take a while to see results as it only targets the enzymes and stops them from aromatizing.

Serms nd AI’s acan be found online currently for rats in liquid form in this year- but be extremely careful. Combine the AI with a testosterone booster (like d-aspartic acid or perhaps fadogia). If you are in puberty you should see some hair growth or at least more morning wood. If your libido is sky rocketing, this is good.

You should be noticing more morning wood. Taper off, and get blood levels checked. Surprisingly, they will probably be atleast 50 ng/dl higher. I ended up getting mine to 686. But be careful and heed my warning, some testosterone boosters can actually lower your testosterone (some even say tribulus terrestris has a negative effect in the long run instead of doing as it claims). Do not take them like candy mints.

Honestly, do you believe that if most adult people do indeed recover, that the guy taking 18 drugs to fix his problems will recover better than the man who lets nature do its work. Probably not. So be choosey with what you take. Doctors don’t prescribe 18 drugs for strep throat. Anyway, excess prolactin and estrogen can be a problem for your testosterone levels, so d aspartic acid may not help you out unless you have the AI for estrogen control.

This is just an example of why you need to choose wisely. Resveratrol holds a host of benefits but in high doses can cause diarrhea and stomach issues. ATD can convert to testosterone and can shut you down. 6-bromo can do the same in high doses, but can help many in low doses (I used it). PES erase will most likely not shut you down, but there is not enough bloodwork available in logs to prove it.

Triazole is a host of natural ingredients. HCGenerate too. There are many others. I hope you get my point. Finally, as a last ditch bodily effort, have sex as much as you can for a week. Following this week, don’t have sex at all for 10 days. In a chinese study, the body raised testosterone and LH a lot after 7 days of abstaining. It declined soon after. It may work for you to kickstart you but I do not recommend it immediately after cycle as you want to get sexually stimulated as much as possible (more sex can equals more testosterone unless you cause your testicles to shrink from sheer abuse).

The mechanism with which the abstaining most likely works is that your body feels like it needs to increase those hormones to get you laid. If you don’t get laid soon after, they decline from negative feedback of the excess hormones LH and testosterone (ahha! probably not a problem with someone who is struggling right).

But generally as I said, sex will be good for reproductive health and healthy testosterone levels.
How do I sum up all of my rambling?

Here goes:
1)Take a serm for 3-4 weeks following cycle. 2)If testosterone shrinkage occurs and hcg can be used, use it BEFORE the serm for short duration. 3)An AI on cycle is recommended if you are still cycling. 4)Always take a ton of vitamin D, zinc, the rest of your vitamins, and mercury free fish oil 5) get a lot of sleep 6) try both having sex a lot at first, and then abstaining for short periods 7)analyze your diet 8) try even harder in the gym, push your body to want more hormones- perhaps sprint and attempt to lift heavier and shred fat (but don’t cut fats out of your diet) 9) Try various natural/perhaps OTC solutions (perhaps even the plant resveratrol) but be smart and calculate- don’t buy into everything a guy tells you. 10) Develop a stress free attitude (perhaps take vitamin C) and avoid drugs and alcohol. Alcohol can shut you down for over a day. So can weed surprisingly. Although alcohol raises it temporarily, and then depletes zinc and crashes it. Weed just suppresses (ever see a teenager with low facial hair who smokes a lot of weed).

Wallah. If you were an idiot like me at 17, try these steps and good luck on your journey through finishing puberty. I Know it was worth it for me. Two last things. 1) Do not stress about what you have done, and if you try these methods and it isn’t working (or if you want to consult a doctor do I am no doctor {endocrinologist not urologist like many idiots online think is a hormone doctor] and he has medical advice- I don’t) give your body time to readjust. Very often your body will do a lot of the work on its own, just give it a kick. 2) Also, do not stress about the hormone reading. If you are gaining muscle, have a good sex drive, and are fairly hairy, your hormone levels may be as good a they will be. For every person above the average of 600, someone is below. And quite frankly I do not want to be the hairy guy at 1000. If you are that high, most of it is not used for muscle. That is usually free testosterone. The testosterone may convert to DHT and those people with a lot of testosterone may go bald. Do not feel deficient if you are happy with your life and can birth kids and rock your own world. If 3 years proves your hormones remain a zero, accept your life decisions, educate others, and welcome to the group of TRT/HRT.

STAY CLEAN TEENAGERS. STAY CLEAN UNTIL 25 AT LEAST. STAY CLEAN. If you don’t or do, try these methods. Time off needs to be the norm. In other words time off =time on+ PCT x4. Get my drift? Take a year off.

Bloodwork on serms are skewed don’t think you are just fine for another go. If you are over 25 and keep your cycles short and with low doses, and you keep your gains cycling perhaps once a year (obviously you aren’t competitive but with good PCT), you will be huge and have a better hormone profile than people who cycle 6 months a year.

It is a marathon, not a race. Don’t subject yourself to Broscience. Look it up and subject yourself to real science. Peace out everybody. I am always open to learning and opinions, so if you can expand upon my knowledge, feel free to share. Again I am just helping those who made poor choices. That is the point of this.

Any teenager reading this right now(hell anybody reading it) is saying

TL;DR

See i dont believe that for a teenager cofused and looking for answers… He might take a stab. I offered it as a story for those who know how damaging it can be. Ready for AAS or not. the mind doesnt know what it wants at 17. Kids need solutions not to be questioned. Everyone makes bad choices.

much too long

Read it. Thank you. Fuck TL;DR. Are people too lazy to read these days?

read it as well. my only thought was that the thread title was misleading. or vague. anyone looking for this sort of information probably wouldn’t find it simply because the thread title doesn’t indicate what the thread is about.

[quote]Gcortese wrote:
Read it. Thank you. Fuck TL;DR. Are people too lazy to read these days?[/quote]

x2 Great info. Thanks for sharing.

who is this “wallah” you keep referring to?

You can substitute wallah for “take that grandma” as you wish:

I believe he meant, Voila. I read this thread and it was very entertaining. But hey, look at how much you learned from a botched cycle of prohormones!