T Nation

My 5/3/1 Set-up


#1

I have a strange habit of over-analyzing things, always wanting to optimize everything I do so that I never feel like I am wasting my time. I've been on the WS4SB band wagon for a while now and I feel like it might be time to give ol' 5/3/1 a shot.

Here's my program set-up:

Day 1
Standing Military Press 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
DB Press:
Side Laterals:
Rear Delt Raises
Barbell Curls

Day 2
Deadlift 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
Chins
Barbell Rows
DB Rows
Power Shrugs
Abs:
Ab Rolls
Serratus Crunch

Day 3
Bench Press 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
DB Incline Press
Fly's
Dips
Triceps Extensions

Day 4
Squat 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
Leg Press
Bulgarian Split Squats
Leg Curls
Good Mornings
Abs:
Leg Raises
Russian Twists

Thought: My goal is to re-introduce some more volume into my training, and yet try to keep strength as my main goal. My set-up actually feels pretty logical, but you never really now for certain until you filter it through T-Nation's best.

What do you think about the set-up in general? The choice of exercises? The structure and muscle group pairings? Would you have done it differently? If yes, why so?

Thanks again


#2

Wow, how much time do you spend in the gym? I can only fit in 4 exercises in 1 hour (including warmup)...Are you supersetting your assistance exercises or any other measures to get things done quickly?

I'm not experienced enough to say much more.


#3

Given that you have a habit of over-analyzing (and the above setup is way over the top) why not just do the BBB assistance work? You don't need 4 assistance lifts (that are all variations on the same theme) for each main lift.


#4

Are you doing any conditioning work?

This looks like too many exercises with a lot of overlap. Deadlift day looks like back annihilation day. I'd do this:

Day 1
Standing Military Press 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
Arnold Press
Chins

Day 2
Deadlift 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
Barbell Curls
DB Rows
Power Shrugs
Ab Rolls

Day 3
Bench Press 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
DB Incline Press
Chins
Triceps Extensions

Day 4
Squat 5/3/1
Assistance Exercises:
Bulgarian Split Squats
Good Mornings
Abs:
Leg Raises

Each day looks like they have similar loads now. And every workout looks manageable.

Don't forget, you can always switch up the accessory work next cycle.


#5

Why not doing the template as written in the book...ws4sb is great for assistance, just use the 5/3/1 for the max effort movement, alternate upper and lower body and you have a good program! Its also very similar to Jim periodization template by the way!


#6

Thanks for all the ideas guys=) Crankman is this what you had in mind? I've switched all the main effort exercises with the 5/3/1 max effort set/rep set-up.

WS4SB/ Wendler 5/3/1 Combo

Upper Body
A. Bench Press 5/3/1
B. Incline Dumbbell Bench Press 4x12
C1. Bent-over Barbell Rows 4x8-12
C2. Face Pulls 4x8-12
D. Barbell Shrugs 4x8-15
E. Barbell Curl 3x15-20

Lower Body
A. Deadlift 5/3/1
B. Short/Long/Reverse Step Lunges 2-3x8-10
C. Romanian Deadlift 3x8-12
D. Wood Chops/Pallof Press/DB Side Bends/Ab Rolls/Serratus Crunch 2-3x10-20

Upper Body
A. Military Press 5/3/1
B1. Wide/Medium Pull-ups/Medium/Narrow Chin-ups 4x2-8
B2. Rear Delt Flyes 4x8-12
C. Dumbbell Shoulder Press 4x8-12
D. Dumbbell Shrugs/BB triceps extensions 3x8-15
E. Wrist Roller 3x8-15

Max-Effort Lower Body
A. Squat 5/3/1
B. Bulgarian Split Squats 3x6-12
C. Leg Curl 3x8-12
D. Sprinter-situps, V-ups, Toe Touches, Hip Thrusts, Leg Raises, Russian Twists 3x10


#7

Yes that what i have in mind,

One all the accessory stuff,its between 3 to 5 sets 6 to 15-20 reps, i like to change it, sometimes 3x8 or another one 4x12, depends on how much time i have to train on that day!!At the end this setup is very similar to the periodization template of Jim,i like to say this is the skinny bastard template!!


#8

Not offering much advice here, just saying what i do:

1.
Deads
BBB deads OR rev. hypers
Abs


  1. OHP
    BBB OHP
    DB row


  2. Squat
    BBB Front Squats
    Abs


  3. Bench
    BBB bench or dips
    rack chins or pull-ups


#9

one question that I would really, really appreciate being answered is the following:

When doing accessory work, do you always stick with the same accessories over the 4 week cycle?

FOr instance if you are doing Squats, and you choose to follow it with bulgarian split squats and then leg curls like Asoss is doing, do you always stick with those same accessories, in the same order, with the same weight, and same rep scheme?

Thanks so much for the clarification. I really would appreciate it


#10

OP- your doing may too many exercises. Do the 5/3/1 for the main exercise, then do 4-5 down sets. Pick 2-3 other exercises and that is more than enough.

My 5/3/1 plan is set up like:

squat 5/3/1
pause squat 5 sets
high pull 3-4 sets
abs
hip mobility

Bench 5/3/1
rev band press 5 sets
bent over row
rack chin
abs

Deadlift 5/3/1
deadlift 5 sets
GM 3-5 sets
abs

MP 5/3/1
close grip 5 sets
chins
rev fly

Keep the assistance the same for each 4 week cycle, if not longer. I keep the same exercises on most cycles and manipulate the sets/reps if I feel I need a change


#11

For assistance work, I usually keep the same exercises for 4 cycles or so, just build strength and muscle for the exercises I pick, thats just me. For example, Im switching dips to MP day, but adding in cgbp bbb to BP day in place of the dips. You can change assistance work every cycle if you'd like, just find what you like and what works best for you.


#12

Good point make Dave284


#13

For assistance work, I think kinda the same as Jim does, Dips vs skull crushers or push downs, dips offer more strength/work for more muscles than the previous 2 listed. Everyone might not agree, but the BIG picture is do what is necessary to build on the MAIN lift's.


#14

I agree with the other guys, you are doing a little too much. I tend to do the main lift, plus 2-3 assistance exercises, and that takes around an hour including warm up.

I do super-set some abs with my assistance exercises, if that helps you.

My assistance exercises tend to always include 3 of the following:

weighted pull-ups
weighted dips
one-armed dumbbell presses
24" vertical jumps (a personal favorite, not one that Wendler suggested)
dumbbell bench press
leg presses
push ups
shrugs
back extensions

So deadlift day might look like:

Deadlifts
5-7 sets of weighted pull-ups
leg presses
24" vertical jumps
abs

bench press
dumbbell bench press
weighted dips
abs

military press
one-armed dumbbell presses
shrugs
5-7 sets of heavy weighted pull-ups
abs

squats
lunges
24" vertical jumps
abs


#15

I'm guessing you didn't read or understand the book. If you had, you'd know that 5/3/1 is the cure for your "overanalysis paralysis," and you'd be in the gym training or in the kitchen eating instead of banging on your keyboard worrying about your precious side laterals and serratus crunches.


#16

Best advice posted yet.

Pick one of the templetes from the manual. Do it for 3 years. Than make changes.


#17

Thank you guys for all the good advices, I'll definitely try to narrow things down and make it more simple. As for Steel Nation, I actually don't have a copy of the book. Seeing that I live in Sweden makes things a tad more difficult. Especially as a student.

Everything I know about 5/3/1 comes from reading on these forums. So I don't have any finished templates to begin from.

To be honest, my first routine in the first post was taken from another forum with some minor changes.


#18

I haven't either, being a student, and not willing to ask my dad to use his credit card. Just take the Triumvirate template given in the article on T-Nation regarding the 5/3/1, and do that. At most, add only 1 more exercise (which in my case I do either prehab/strongman/core stuff).

Swap exercises for those that do the same purpose in increasing your main lifts, but don't add. Change your accessory lifts after at least a few cycles if you want for different stimuli in your training.

The key is simplicity.


#19

I fucking died laughing at this one - jesus christ this was funny.


#20

You should spend the 20 something dollars on the book. Read it. Develop your program. Then ask questions. After reading your initial post and having read the manual, I was VERY curious how you came to call what was posted 5/3/1.