muscle soreness

Hi guys, i was wondering whether you can explain the reason why i get muscle soreness everyweek since i have been training for a year now. I do a 3 on 1 off 2 on 1 off training split, training each muscle group once a week. I incorporate a lot of strip sets and supersets in my workouts. I eat about 300 grams of protein a day since i weigh 205 pounds. Most of my protein come from chicken breast and shakes.

Soreness is a very individual thing. I usually get sore after almost any workout. If the load is going up or the volume is increasing then you will likely continue to get sore. If you just keep lifting the same weights and never increase volume, then the workouts will become easy and you won’t get sore, but also you won’t grow.

you are atleast somewhat out of shape.

You have been using the same routine for a year? I can’t recall who reported it for sure, I am thinking Bumpa, that T levels plummet with maximum loads after a certain time, I seem to recall 4-6 weeks.

For you, training each muscle group once per week may be infrequent enough such that you are experiencing a detraining effect between your training sessions. This would definitely be the case if you are using similar weights, exercises, time under tension, and volume in each workout. However, if you are grossly changing the aforementioned factors in a manner such that the workouts are progressively more difficult, soreness is to be expected no matter what your training experience is.

You may also have a shitty diet high in omega 6 fats(the fat in a typical westerb diet). These fats cause inflamation and will increase soreness and slow down the recovery process.

Don’t sweat it. I’ve been lifting for 13 1/2 years and I’m sore after most workouts. I don’t even do too many “intensity-adding” techniques like supersets and drop sets. I’ve always had a slow recovery ability from weight training. The only time I’m consistently NOT sore if when I use an anabolic such as Androsol or Mag-10. Once a good dosage is in my body, it’s much more difficult to elicit soreness. Anyway, soreness is highly individual. Sure, it could be your diet (such as too many omega 6’s and not enough 3’s) but it could just be you.

I used to think soreness was necessary for growth but since I’ve started to use Surge, my soreness has been vastly reduced. IMO, soreness in an experienced trainer is due to poor recovery and I’ve found Surge to be a big help.

You’re not training often enough. Forget all this stuff of a muscle taking a week to recover. Muscles recovery rather quickly, it’s the energy supply to the muscle that takes longer to recover. Vary the stimulus and the type of training you do and try training everything twice per week.

All the articles I recall reading that have discussed deconditioning seem to mention 2 weeks as the minimum time for any significant deconditioning effect to occur and from my own experience I would have to concur that if I happen to take up to 2 weeks off, I can pretty much come back and pickup where I left off. Only if taking off more than 2 weeks do I seem to lose significant strength and it seems to occur rapidly after 2 weeks but little before 2 weeks. In fact, if only taking an occasional 1 week off, I usually come back stronger. Not that I recommend taking a lot of training breaks. Most progress comes from consistent training. And I do believe in lifting at least 3 or maybe 4 times a week. I just don’t buy into soreness coming from supposed deconditioning if lifting on even a somewhat regular basis. Many get sore from trying to impose further adaptions every trip to the gym and that is the basis behind progressive resistance. I used to gauge my efforts by the degree of soreness the following morning. But as I mentioned in previous post, I noticed Surge had a positive effect on WO soreness and finally realized that soreness is probably often caused by poor recovery due to not getting nutrients (protein/aminos + glucose) immediantly back into the muscle so that recovery can in fact occur. And that can be why some hard gainers (which is what I used to consider myself) experience slower progress - the ability of the fatigued muscle to take up nutrients quickly so that anabolism begins instead of catabolism if nutrient uptake doesn’t occur rapidly.

It seems if I take just a week off of squats I get weaker. Now If I take off 2 weeks I get a lot weaker. Do you think this has anything to do with detraining. This doesn’t happen with my upper body though.

I’m guessing in the case of squats, what you’re experiencing is neuro deconditioning as compared to muscular deconditioning which was the main focus of my previous post referencing that effect in regards to training soreness. Squats require a high degree of neuro conditioning (high degree of effort) and it’s very possible that your neuromuscular system experiences deconditioning faster than actual loss of muscular conditioning. However, where the nereomuscular system may decondition quicker, it will also recover quicker than muscular conditioning and after a short lay off, the neuro system should rebound in a few short WO’s. Often, initial gains in starting a new program come from neuromuscular conditioning where later, advanced gains come from muscular growth.

I had the same problem. From the look of things you may be over training by using strip sets and supersets too often. Try to cycle your training by taking a week off every so often and increase intensity as you near the end of your cylcle. Besides that try Surge. I never get sore almost no matter what I do when I use it. Good Luck.

The thing is that i eat 300 pounds of protein a day most coming from chicken breast and whey protein. I also have been trying that Surge for 3 weeks already now and still getting sore. I am taking about 10 grams of glutamine a day too.My weight is 208 and i am 5 10

Wow Jerry! Are you really able to eat 1.5 times your body weight in just protein alone :slight_smile: I’m kidding of course. I think that adequate recovery is governed more by adequate carbohydrate intake as compared to protein. You can eat all the protein you can, but without enough carbs, recovery is always hindered. Just something else to think about. Try increasing your carbs in the 3 hours post-workout window.

I agree with Jason 100% that it’s not just all about protein. Without sufficient carbs to raise insulin sufficiently, all that protein has difficulty entering the muscle. And recovery from training induced trauma depends as much on glycogen replenishment as it does on protein needs being met. I still believe excessive post WO soreness is due to not getting nutrients back into the traumatized muscle quick enough - especially carbs to raise insulin and replace glycogen. It’s a 2 part formula - carbs + protein = insulin to deliver the supplied nutrients to muscle. And to complicate matters, it’s been proven that a exercise induced tramuatized muscle becomes some what insulin insensitive due to the micro trauma and that makes it even more difficult to get nutrients into the fatigued muscle making it even more crucial to supply nutrients as quickly as possible to try and beat the trauma induced insulin insensitivity. I believe that is why studies have shown even greater recovery and growth from pre training nutrition than post training nutrition, though both are important. And I found the best effect from Surge by far, when I drink it during training by slowly sipping on it throughout the WO so that I would finish it near the end of WO. My energy levels would always seem more consistant this way also. I think that by drinking the Surge during WO, it starts replacing nutrients in the trained muscle quicker, before the micro trauma induce insulin insensitivity can occur as compared to waiting to drink all the surge post WO. And I believe Berardi has verified this. From my experience, by far, the most important aspect of nutrition is the 2 hours BEFORE and the 2 hours AFTER training. Those 4 hours will have a far bigger impact on recovery and growth than the other 44 hours between WO’s. (assuming you’re training the recommended every 48 hours). I eat a decent sized P+F meal about 2 1/2 hours before training and this sticks with me and fuels my WO and provides aminos in the blood during the WO. I don’t like to eat carbs in the meal before WO, as carbs digest to fast and can actually leave you hypoglycemic if spiking insulin to far in advance of WO. And besides, if eating correctly, glycogen should of been replaced long before this point. The P+F meal provides more even long term energy for the WO. Then I slowly sip the Surge DURING WO so that carbs are available to replace glycogen AS glycogen is being depleted. Then I eat a P+C meal 1 hour after WO to finish replacing glycogen and supply the post exercise insulin spike to supply nutrients to the recovering muscle. The rest of the day, I eat more moderately, eating small P+F or small P+C meals making sure that at all times other than during/post WO that carbs are low glycemic to keep insulin moderated and avoid excessive fat storage. I only want insulin spiked during WO and shortly after WO. Hope this can be of some help.

jerry - make sure you are getting plenty of water. especially on lifting days. i find that on the weekends when i am out and about and don’t get enough water i am sore as hell for days on end. get that water! kevo

Since we are talking about muscle soreness, I have another question. Sometimes when I work out I get sore that same day. I work out around 11 a.m. and in the evening I start getting sore, especially after a hard workout. I just always wondered this.

Regarding getting sore on the same day - This is not terribly uncommon. What kind of work do you do. I find that if I’m going to get sore, it comes on even worse if I’ve been sitting around all day. DOMS (delayed onset muscle soreness) peaks at 12-48 hours post exercise. We are all individuals. You might peak closer to 12, whereas my soreness always peaks at 24 hours and my friend’s always peaks at 36. Basically, DOMS is very individual. If you follow Heb and Berardi’s recommendations, you can cut down on soreness. I’ve cut down on my soreness, but I have not eliminated it. I’m not sure if I totally agree that DOMS is due to lack of proper nutrition, training, and recovery. I do agree 100% that excessive and consistent DOMS is due to the lack of above. I don’t mind not being able to walk for a few days after a new leg routine, but I sure don’t want that to be the case after every leg workout.