[quote]dhickey wrote:
catone wrote:
dhickey wrote:
catone wrote:
dhickey wrote:
This is starting to happen a bit but not enough. You can go to day clinics at the local pharmacy but they are very limited in what they are allowed to do. Just like Chiropractors are.
Chiropractors are allowed to do whatever they want within the scope of their training and speciality. So what else would you allow them to do? Surgery? Treat diabetes? Heart disease?
we are taking conceptually here, try and follow along. Who is going to decide what services me and my chiropractor can agree to legally. Who’s to say what his specialty is? If I want to have a chiropractor check my prostate I should be able to legally.[/quote] hilarious [quote] If you want to go to a proctologist for the same thing, go ahead. My objection is not with the licensing or the fucking piece of paper on the wall, it’s the fact that some arbitrary dick head is telling me where I can and can’t spend my money. [/quote] apparently you need that, otherwise you would pay your chiro to check your prostate [quote] We can argue all day which doctors should provide what services and not get anywhere real quick. That’s the point. It’s arbitrary. [/quote] it’s not fucking arbitrary, it’s based on their training [quote] Consumer and provider should be able to figure those things out on their own.
This is the game the AMA plays. They call it licensing. In other industries it would be called collusion, price fixing, or a monopoly.
They better regulate who provides health care. There is a big difference in changing your own oil or fixing a leaking faucet. Anybody could learn in a minute or so the way to do it. And, on top of that, even if you screw it up the worst it can happen is you get all dirty or wet. Whereas it takes years of studying AND practice to be a doc. Same with midlevels.
Dude, turn your brain on for just a second, we’re about to get deep. I can go to any number of websites or read any number of books by kook herbalists to diagnose an illness. I can then go to walmart to buy a bunch of herbs or drink a gallon of laundry detergent to self treat. How is this any diffent than choosing who I go see to seek treatment? Other than the legality. I can butcher up any nubmer of treatments on myself legaly but can’t pay someone else to do it. Make sense to you? I can ask you any medical quesiton I would like and then seek self treatment based on that advise. Why is it any diffent if I pay someone not certified by the AMA to do the same?
The idea of having just a clinic of nurses or midlevels for minor stuff is nice but impractical. On one hand, who decides they have the expertise to treat whatever comes their way the right way? They might miss serious stuff that might be very difficult to undo later. Or they might just send you to the local ER when they are not comfortable dealing with your problem. This would add to your cost. On the other hand, their services wouldn’t be any cheaper than in a regular office. See below.
This is very disappointing. Who’s says it’s impractical? If I say it’s practical and the provider says it’s practical why on earth would it be illegal for us to make the transaction? How on earth do you know that prices wouldn’t fall if competition was allowed to enter the market? Don’t even answer that, I don’t even want to hear you logic on this one.[/quote] dude, are you listening to yourself? the charges are not pulled out of somebody’s ass, they are calculated to include the COST, WTF are you high or what?[quote]
Also, why am I paying the same office visit charge if I don’t even see the doctor? The point would be to let others set up a business offering services they want to offer at price that they feel is competitive. I don’t need anyone outlining who I can see and at what cost. This should be between me and the person offering the service.
You are wrong when you say you pay the same as if you were seeing the doctor. You are not. But if you are, that is fraud. What one needs to understand is what goes in his office charge. Not all the money goes to the doctor. Most of it is to cover the expenses (overhead). In many instances the charge won’t even cover the costs. The price is more or less tied (read fixed) to the Medicare reimbursement for a certain diagnisis/procedure. And they pay shitty money anyway. The nurse or midlevel seeing you would still be required to charge to cover the cost of their service (granted, less than a doc) AND the overhead (which is the same as for the doc, i.e. they use same gloves, needles, sutures, gauze, light, AC, heating, paper, office etc.). I know of many offices where minor stuff is dealt with by midlevels or nurses. And their charges are lower. But you would be better off seeing a doctor for more serious stuff.
Jesus Christ, you are missing the entire point of this whole argument. Who gives a shit about office visits or specific charges. I was trying to illustrate a point. You may be dissappointed to know that I have not conducted any research of office visits and the various change that I might find. I have not approached Geraldo to do an expose either.
THE POINT - PAY ATTENTION TO THIS PART.
I don’t need some anonymous jack or joe deciding who I seek for treatment or any other services. It’s my money and I should be able to pay anyone I like for service that I seek. We are not talking about fraud or someone misrepresenting themselves. I am talking about me making the conscience decision not to give two shits about an AMA certificate or any other license when I purchase goods and services that I need. If they want to creat a certification for 12 year olds to cut grass, fine. I just say it shouldn’t be illegal to cut grass without a license or pay someone without a license. [/quote] it’s not illegal to mow the lawn without a license, your examples are poorly chosen
OK, now pull your head out of your ass and PAY ATTENTION TO THIS PART:
you are free to do whatever you want with your own body and property. Want to drink detergent and herbal shit from Walmart (one of your stupid analogies)? Go ahead, do it. Want to cut your nose? Just do it. Break your TV? Fine. These things should not be regulated as they would infringe on your liberties, if you want to do them then so be it.
But what one’s allowed to do onto himself is one and doing it onto others is something else. You look at things from your selfish perspective. You might be able to discern between the good and the bad choice. But most people won’t. Everybody would be looking for a deal and shopping around. Therefore the prices for a certain service would drop to the point where a ‘licensed’ person might not be willing to perform the said service. And this is where the ‘unlicensed’ one would come into play, accepting a price that a legit, honest professional would not accept. And, of course, cutting corners and providing a service of questionable quality. So the quality of everything around you would start to drop because nobody would be held to any standards, the only benchmark being the price for the service.
People without the proper qualifications should not be allowed to do things that might jeopardize another one’s health, property or even life by misrepresenting their abilities. And there should be an authority in that particular field of expertise to certify that the said service provider is legit and meets some minimum knowledge and requirements to perform the job one would entrust him to do.
So the law might not protect you, but definitely protects most of us. We don’t always get the quality of service we want DESPITE all the regulations. Think what would be if there were none.
You’re a funny guy. Cheers.