T Nation

Morals or Brains


#1

All right. Let's get the heck off Wideguy's birthday thread and have it out here.

If some brain-dead is applying his protein powder topicly or is doing upside-down hanging neck curls with a barbell in his teeth, anyone here would tell him there's a better way. Right?

You say, "Look Dude, what you're doing ain't all that smart, you're wasting your time and you're going to get hurt!

So then, why does a guy get flack for saying that whoring around is not that smart and is harmful to your health.

Don't get me wrong. I don't go around pooping on peoples parties. What you wanna do is your business as long as your drinking and driving doesn't hurt my friends and family, your screwing around doesn't get my sister or daughter pregnant or infected, and your inverted tooth grip neck curling ain't using my squat rack!

'cake an' me understand each other via PM's so anything by the cakester won't be taken personal.

What's your opinion?

Billy


#2

"What you wanna do is your business as long as your drinking and driving doesn't hurt my friends and family, your screwing around doesn't get my sister or daughter pregnant or infected, and your inverted tooth grip neck curling ain't using my squat rack!"

And as long as I don't have to teach your neglected spawn someday or pay for your baby's momma's wellfare.


#3

To Cupcake,

I stayed out of the Happy Birthday thread, but this seems like the place to ask questions.

I believe you have daughters, right? I have a 9 year-old girl and a 4 year-old boy. I am not the least bit religious. That being said, wouldn't you like your kids to grow up in a world that was comprised of moral people. (Please don't come back with "Whose morals?", because I know you know what I mean.)

I know it is up to us as parents to teach our morals to our own children. I'm still concerned about those people that they are going to have to interact with who haven't been taught any morals at all. There are plenty of them. Are you against people like ZEB saying, "Hey , Wideguy, maybe fucking every skank you can get your dick in isn't the best plan"? What's wrong with that? Who is hurt by it?


#4

"anyone here would tell him there's a better way. Right?"

uhh no. im not telling them anything unless they ask for my help.


#5

DOOGIE: This may be slightly off-topic, but why the need for the extreme OR (in the sense of this OR that)?

Here is my point: youre better off hanging with people who have <i>been there, done that <b>AND</b> aint doing it again (i.e. they can/do learn).

People will be people. Don`t tell them to do something and you are guaranteed that some of them will do what you tell them not to.

Personally, I would be very afraid of the too perfect environment and/or parent. That (supposedly) too perfect little saint being raised is just accumulating desires and/or curiosities and parents dont give them someleash` distance (awful term, I know) are just transfering the problem in time.

In short, your todays too strict too long <i>(put religion or moral code name here)</i> raised virgin will most probably turn out to be tomorrows whore.

On the other hand, (before you all start flaming back) the exact opposite is not better either. Trying too much stuff, too permissive parents, anything goes environment is just asking for trouble.

Like all things in life, I say you need a balance. Let`s say child wants to smoke pot. Best parental attitude I have heard so far was:

The day you want to try it, tell me and I will let you try it at home.

(The idea being, first of all, to prevent the virgin/curiosity/whore buildup. The second is safety - if its going to be tried, it will be in safe settings, both psychologically (no pressure, free choice, parent can give some pointers*) and physically (if anything happens, you have far more options at home than in that dark street corner). And the child wont run into cops either.)

  • Face it. Most people have. And they tried various types. And also have contacts. Its probably very safer to buy the stuff through your sources than letting thetester` (child) do the shopping, for the obvious reasons AND product-choice-and-quality-wise. As for the learning curve, you can always describe your experiences, so the tester can maybe think it out before really trying.

Yeah, controversial stuff. I just dont want to see tomorrows children transform into the adult equivalents of Preachers gone bad, metaphorically speaking.

(I take for granted that those who read this use obvious common-sense. I would not let a child try the hard drugs and todays rocket science wonders that hook you on the first try. Same thing for the childs sexual experimentations. Do what you want in you room, but the minute something too wild comes in, the parent will have his word to say. You get the idea.)


#6

Drugs are bad.


#7

StevenF, that's one of the dumbest things you could have said. It's mentally challenged thinking like that that we are fighting to keep supplements on the market currently.

Drugs are drugs.

I know that sounds really profound, but think about it. Most people don't think good drugs vs. bad drugs. They think legal drugs vs. illegal drugs. To say that drugs are bad is ignorant and irresponsible thinking.

As for getting laid. That's what we do. We're men. If you don't like pussy, go watch Oprah.

(This should be a fun thread)


#8

I have ZERO time right now (My three girls and my wife are going to do a little Rockwellian style outdoor skating/Marshmellow roast...No "marshies" for low-carbing Dad though...)

The point of my "woulda been" long winded, sarcastic post that makes fun of electronic Preachers would have been:

If my kids learn their "morals" from an internet fitness forum, we're fucked.

All of us.

P-Dog gets it, who else?

"No time for quotin')

~ Cup "I'll do the moralizin for my OWN kids thank you" Cake


#9

P.S

Blue Whale.

"Still no time"

~ 'Cake


#10

P-dog is right. If you give someone advice when they didn't ask for it in the first place then it isn't being helpful. It's more like preaching. Most of us are adults here and capable of making there own decisions. The girls/women I have relations with also have their own minds and can make their own decisons. I don't see how something as beautiful and enjoyable as consensual sex between two (or maybe more:-) people can be viewed as immoral. Humans are the only species I'm aware of that have the mental capacity to enage in sexual acts for reasons other than procreating. The only way I can see it is that most people have had certain bullshit ideals drilled into their heads by higher power ie. church, parents, gov. ect. Now try to relate to me for at least a minute. Imagine just being able to see a woman, a beautiful woman. Picture yourself looking strait into her eyes an not removing yourself from her gaze despite not knowing a thing about her. The typical barriers and insecurities that society has instilled on you are gone and the two of you are free. I don't want to ramble on any further but for those of you who understand me you know there is nothing "immoral" about it. For those of you who don't understand I feel sorry for you. At the same time I'd probably not like you if I met you. Most likely you're the kind of person that makes this country so fucked up in the first place. Not knowing when to shut the fuck up and keep your opinions to yourself. Teaching a history of lies. Spreading your "faith" to those in need and actually being so stupid to beleive that some book written by another HUMAN BEING no different then you or I is what one should model their lives after. Yeah, I feel sorry for you but not to sorry to tell you to fuck off.


#11

STEVEN F. Yep.

So is alcohol, prostitution, and gambling (in general).

Hasn`t stopped people from fancying themselves with these poisons in the last millenia or more.

So, watcha gonna do about it?


#12

do more drugs!


#13

As for posts here, if someone asks for opinions, they shouldn't get too offended when they receive what they asked for. However, when I'm not asked for my opinion, I tend to mind my own business.


#14

The fun has kinda been beaten outta this one for me so I will attempt one last time to make it simple, that's S-I-M-P-L-E for those who have a hard time following along.

For those that are truly stupid, I will type slowly. I do this only so that the point does not get lost, twisted or otherwise butchered by some fanatic desperate to leap out of the digital bushes and yell "Aha!, I got you, you Bastard".

Shall we?

Morals are a pretty personal thing, I think that we would agree (If you don't, then please stop reading now and head back to your pulpit to tend your flock, we obviously won't be getting along just now)

As personal and private as say, my underwear? (color, size, fit and of course sanitation)

I would say yes.

Now, if you were to meet one of your neighboors at a community function and the topic of "clothing" came up, would you fling the conversation from comfortable knits to his underwear? of course not, you could kiss borrowing his leaf blower goodbye and you could bet that nosy Ellen Parker from down the street would be all over that little quirk. I agree that if a conversation were to start about underwear (just what kind of neighboorhood do you live in anyway?), it would undoubtedly slide in to a discussion about your own preference and practice. This would be acceptable but when the coversation is beaten into submission so that you can tell the world about your new Fruit of the Looms with the new wider waistband that keeps the underwear in place and longer leg design that prevents binding, riding or shifting, and "I prefer brown then I can wear 'em twice!", well hey, I'm just gonna call "Freak" and politely excuse myself using whatever handy excuse is handy - "Oh look!, I seem to have shoved this cocktail fork in my eye, excuse me..."

Now, if you wander around from conversation to conversation queering things up with your Fruit of the Loom fixation, someone eventually is going to drag you outside.

Keep it up and that someone (Kenny Cranick from 8230 maybe?, he looks a little short fused) is going to slap you around beside the oil recycling bin and spoonfeed you this weeks batch. "Why"? you cry as a charming blend of canola and tallow slide down your throat, "I was only exercising my freedom of speech, it's not fair, it's not fair!".

I'll tell you why:

Because, Ken exercised HIS freedom of speech when he told you to shut up about your stupid fucking underwear. You then exercised your right to ignore him. Ken then took the option of exercising HIS right to slap you silly beside the "Oil Buddy".

Now, of course I don't think that most (any?) of us would have this happen to us (either as the FOTL fetish guy or "Kenny") because in "real life" there are certain things that unless you are directly asked about you reserve comment on.

Why would you behave differently here? Why does the shield of your computer screen make you feel that you can comment on MY morality when you are NOT asked too (O.k, O.k, I admit that my "I'm presently engaged to a mail order hermaphrodite but I am afraid that married life will interfere with my sexual relationship with my Goat named Elvis, what should I do?" post was just asking for it but short of that, why the unsolicited advice?

This is in no way to be construed as an endorsment of "today's" morality because quite simply we could be "better" as a race (human, not any one particular flavour) and if setting "higher" morals are part of it then great. Yes, the NEED is there, NO this is not the place nor method to fill it.

[I do have to add that this post was typed entirely without the aid of spellcheck. I also worked without a net. And pants.]

So...

In closing, all I have to say is:

Jockey Sport Boxer Brief Underwear, XL, Red.

And yes, everyday.

"Private property began the instant somebody had a mind of his own"

~ E. E. Cummings


#15

If some brain-dead is applying his protein powder topicly or is doing upside-down hanging neck curls with a barbell in his teeth

The imagery!

I laughed aloud at the first.

DI


#16

Cupcake,

I don't know how to reply to the underwear analogy.

If some guy in your neighborhood kept coming up to you and talking about the pleasure he gets from going commando, making it sound as if he was really cool to be freeballing and ignoring the dangers of the zipper and the yeast infection, would it not be alright to point out the wholesomeness of FOTLs?


#17

Knight, the protein powder topicly, although funny as hell, is not mine, I'd love to take credit for it but I saw it on the forum. As for the neck curls, thats all me. :stuck_out_tongue:

'Cake, are you inferring that people that don't whore around are stupid? I know you aren't the stereotyping kind of guy so I'll assume you're not calling me a moron. Correct me if I'm wrong.

So then, the general rule is "If not asked - shut up." In issues of lifestyle I can agree with most cases.

However, what about issues of safety? For instance a few years ago my wife was cuttting up carrots for dinner, I was doing a pretty good Bugs Bunny impression when I saw my wife's thumb alongside of the carrot directly under the knife. Had my mouth not been full of carrot I would have called out to stop, but as I could not, she chopped her thumb to the bone. Pretty nasty. Now in a case like this, intervention would have saved her from injury.

I believe that in such cases it's our duty to warn people of the danger that they may not see.

Billy


#18

'Cake, Wideguy: sniff I love you, man!

And no, I don't want your Bud Light anyway.


#19

The subject of "morals" is far different than the subject of "doing what works".

I like to consider myself a very practical man. When something does not work I discard it. This is what all of us T-Men like to think we do.
If you are doing a certain set rep shceme and it does not seem to be working then you discard it. It's as simple as that.

Why is it so simple with our training yet so difficult in our life? Lack of self discipline? Human nature perhaps?
Who knows? I refrain from beginning certain topics on this board because they will automatically start a heated debate. Doing "what works" only seems to be cool, for some, regarding training methodologies.

However, discussing someones undershorts, as the example used in the above post, is quite a bit different than discussing permiscuous sex. In the first example it matters not what color underwear that you wear. It effects no one! (unless said underwear is not washed regularly thus effecting someone who nears your proximity).

Permiscuous sex however, effects many. Including you and I! When a baby is born out of wedlock and is cared for by the state or government, you and I pick up the tab! The AIDS epidemic has infected over 40 million world wide! The President just allocated 10 billion dollars to help fight AIDS in Africa alone. The money sent is our hard earned tax dollars. Money that could have been spent elsewhere. The United States is quickly catching up relative to this horrid disease. Mr. playboys antics seem a lot less cool when you look at it this way. Unfortunately, it is the reality.

Is it my business when another adult male hops into bed with every young pretty thing that moves? No! However, it does become public knowledge, and fair game for comment, when that same adult male posts his exploits, for all to read and evalute on a message board.

If he is proud enough to post it, I will be proud enough to tell him that he could be engaging in a dangerous activity. Is this "moralizing"? Not at all. What it is, is "practicalizing". I simply want him to do what works! Certain behaviors are dangerous. They are dangerous to the person doing them, the person they are doing them to, and to society as a whole.

Any particular substance or activity that can bring us great pleasure also carrys within it the means to addict us to its use! know this, respect the facts and behave accordingly. Do it, not because of what is right or wrong. Do it for the same reason you would change a muscle building routine that did not help you progress. Do it because it works!

As some of you know, I am an advocate of free expression. I feel that this one particular freedom is what helped keep our country free for over 225 years. Therefore, I reiterate: If someone wants to brag about their permiscuous exploits on this board, I defend their right to do so. However, in some cases there may be a response that is not well tolerated by some of the self proclaimed "enlightened ones".

The enlightened ones can see the beauty in free expression of self, but totally miss the importance of free expression regarding the written word. How ironic, how detrimental.


#20

Cake -

Here here!

doogie -

I think problems lies in combining unsolicited advice with a lack of a relationship. If my brother comes up telling me about the joys of freeballing, I have enough of a relationship with him to point out the dangers. However, if someone I didn't really know started the exact same conversation with me, I would reserve my opinion unless asked for it.

Of course, if that person is doing crack or the aforementioned inverted teeth grip neck curls, perhaps I would initiate a private conversation (PM) or ask him if he would like some advice.

My opinions on many matters lie closer to the Blue Whales than many people on these boards. But trying to force my convictions on everyone else will only cause strife.

In faith,
Sam