T Nation

Milk Thistle: How Much and When

if i was taking M1T before workout lets say at 5 pm and workout at 5:30 when should i take milk thistle and how much

It probably has value in helping the liver deal with alkylated anabolic steroids. I’g guess the dose for that is probably the same as for anything else.

Other possible reasons others could have for using it are:

If having Type II diabetes and wanting to improve blood sugar somewhat, I’ve read a literature report of 200 mg 3x/day being appropriate and moderately effective.

If hoping to in the long term maybe improve health by helping maintain healthy cell division, that seems a reasonable chance.

For any of these I’d use about 600 mg/day or if a product is a bit more, that is fine.

I don’t know if dividing the doses is necessary or makes a difference. Might as well take it at the same time or shortly before the M1-T though. For example, maybe take the milk thistle 15 minutes before whatever meal or protein drink the M1-T will be taken with.

I personally always consider a maintenance dose and an acute, “Rx” dose.

I have a bottle of milk thistle caps on my desk (600 mg, 24 mg Silymarin 4%) and it recommends 3 caps, 2x daily for maintenance and 4 caps, 3x daily for ‘management.’

So, the management dose is double the maintenance dose, which is what I usually stick to: 2-3x maintenance if I’m looking to ‘treat’ something, like an acute liver condition or even a brief cleansing/detox of the liver.

I use this protocol with a lot of supplements as long as toxicity is not an issue. That, and I know my body in general responds to a higher dose than what most people take - for anything.

I am also a firm believer in cycling everything.

I should have been clear that I meant 600 mg of silymarin. My post doesn’t get that across all, and would tend to be read as amount of milk thistle since that waas the question. Oops.

Some milk thistle extracts are very high in silymarin, so there is not a large milligram difference between mg of extract and mg of silymarin. For example, the LEF product is standardized to 80% silymarin and so the mg of silymarin (720) is not radically different than the total mg of extract (900.)

That’s from one capsule.

But the product you are using obviously has a radical difference in milligrams of silymarin vs total product, 600 mg vs 24 mg, at a concentration of only 4%.

So actually their label dosage is only 144 mg silymarin per day. You are absolutely correct to be quadrupling this.

Way back in the bad old days, it was so common for supplement companies to provide absurdly low label dosages that it generally was likely (a few companies were exceptions) that one needed at least double the label dose and often more. That practice has, thankfully, become a lot less prevalent but obviously has not disappeared completely.

is there really any point to taking this product if your not on roids? I know some people say to use it if you take alot of supplements but who knows

Yes, there are also the reasons I listed above.

There’s also a possible and I think not unlikely reduction in risk of cancer.

So especially as it’s quite inexpensive – even a high quality product like the above-mentioned costs little per day – it’s worth taking for health reasons IMO. At least when getting older; when young and bulletproof there may well be no long-term or immediate benefit.

Also some use it for assisting the liver where alcohol abuse is an issue, but obviously that’s not an issue when not abusing alcohol.

im ganna be taking M1-T 10mg first week 20 2nd if no kidney pains come

I don’t know of a pharmaceutical anabolic steroid that does much worth mentioning for a man at 10 mg/day (in most cases; I have known of a couple of exceptions with Dianabol users.)

Expecting M1-T to outpeform all the pharmaceuticals, which you would be expecting if you’re expecting anything substantial, seems like it would be kind of an unlikely expectation.

I’d ask that you all stop advising this poster. He is only 17 and has no business messing with any hormonal product without consulting a Doctor.

Thanks, I did not know that.

Indeed, then the whole question is asking how to lessen consequences of doing something utterly inadvisable in this instance.

You guys should see the threads at BB.com They’re all teenagers discussing which prohormones to use and what to take afterwards (and most of the kids seem to be under 160 lbs at that). I don’t think I even touched creatine until I had been training 5 years, of course I also thought protein bars would magically make me look like Dorian Yates if I just ate enough of them -lol.

S

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
I don’t know of a pharmaceutical anabolic steroid that does much worth mentioning for a man at 10 mg/day (in most cases; I have known of a couple of exceptions with Dianabol users.)

Expecting M1-T to outpeform all the pharmaceuticals, which you would be expecting if you’re expecting anything substantial, seems like it would be kind of an unlikely expectation.[/quote]

I dont feel M1T should be used as most people believe it should.

10-20 mg/day for 2 weeks on 2 weeks off is retarded and was only recommended by supplement companies to prevent quite as harsh a shutdown, limiting the need for a more complete pct.

It also required you to buy alot of m1t to have any affect with it.

4 week cycles at a high dose of 30-40mg/day can be used with a small amount of test very effectively for very quick strength gains.

I have even seen people be very successful with long M1T only cycles of 7-8 weeks at 30-40 mg/day.

But that is risky in my opinion with an oral. One guy that I know personally developed a mild case of jaundice, indicating liver failure was coming quickly.

M1T has its place, but most people would prefer to just use Dbol.

[quote]Westclock wrote:
10-20 mg/day for 2 weeks on 2 weeks off is retarded and was only recommended by supplement companies to prevent quite as harsh a shutdown, limiting the need for a more complete pct.[/quote]

That’s because Tamoxifen and Anastrozole (and Letro etc.) are Rx only. If your going to get them illegally, then you may as well get some vials of Testosterone while you’re at it. The supplement companies can’t have that, can they?

Simply put: they want you to buy their product.