T Nation

Mid-Cycle Advice

Pharma
#1

What’s up everyone,

Looking for some advice for finishing up my cycle. Today starts my 7th week on Test C @ 500mg/week. I did an oral kick start from 1-4 with DMZ and am also using Asin 12.5 EOD. Blood work last week showed TT at 2450 so I’m thinking my TC is a little underdosed so I will be bumping up the dose slightly. E2 also came in a little high at 65 but I had zero estro sides. If anything I felt like my E2 was a little low (dry joints) so I was surprised. Will be dosing the Asin at 12.5mg ED until my next blood work.

I have had great results so far. Feeling fantastic. Strength through the roof and decent mass gains so far. Very little in terms of sides; MINOR acne on my back and oily skin. I planned on running some Epi I had left over from a cycle a couple years ago at 50mg for the last 4 weeks but my AST/ALT came back quite high after the DMZ so I have decided to forgo that.

Here’s my question; my original plan was to run the TC for 10 weeks. I have decided to run this out to 12 weeks instead and then do a taper with Test Prop from 12-14, blasting HCG from 13-14 and then beginning PCT three days after the last TP dose with Nolva @ 40/40/20/20/20/10, all while continuing the Asin @ 12.5mg ED unless labs indicate otherwise. I have read a bit on tapering with the TP in order to avoid the dreaded “crash” once the long esters clear out. My main question is on how to dose the TP. I realize that when I begin the TP I will still have plenty of TC in my system so in order to avoid a spike in blood levels would I start with a lower dose of TP and then work my way up and then back down again? Thanks in advance!

#2

This is an interesting one. I like the idea of ending with test p, mostly because you don’t see a lot of guys doing this. From a scientific perspective it’s kind of neat to see how this would go.

I don’t think you want to run aromasin ed while on pct. You could crash your e2 pretty quickly that way.

As far the dosage of test p I imagine you’d be maintaining 500mgs/w, yes? Or when you say taper so you mean taper both the ester and the dosage? Because there reason you normally don’t taper is simple: you’re already shut down. So when using a longer ester you wait that two weeks before pct because the existing ester is still gradually breaking down within your body. It’s almost like a natural taper, where the total amount in your system is depleted over time. By introducing a new ester you’d be changing the total amount of hormones in your body and changing the standard pct timing. So if you want to do that—and I don’t see any real harm in it if done right—you’ll want to calculate the dosage based on the existing amount of testosterone in your system at the time that you start the test p. You’ll have to calculate the half life of the test e, factor in the buildup over the life of the cycle, and then you’ll arrive at the proper dosage of the test p.

#3

I only mean to taper the dosage. My thoughts were to taper the test p dosage up. Originally I had planned on tapering up and then back down to achieve a more gradual decline in test levels. But thinking now I’m having a hard time seeing the point considering I’ll remain shut down as long as exogenous test remains. That’s where I’m having a hard time figuring out what to do. Let’s say I start the test p, for example, at 250mg/week (first pin being 3 days after discontinuing the test c). The following week (one week after test c d/c) would it make sense to go up to, let’s say, 350mg test p only to start PCT the following week? I guess I’m asking would it be worth it to run possibly 4 weeks of test p while tapering up and then back down at doses of let’s say 300/400/300/200. Those are not the dosages I was planning on, just trying to illustrate my thoughts using nice round numbers. I’m trying to have as smooth of a transition into PCT as I can but I’m wondering if I’m just over complicating things.

#4

I don’t think you would see a great enough benefit from that up/down tapering to warrant the potential for side effects to pop up. Once you’ve got something like test e or c going for a few weeks you probably have found your sweet spot with your AI, and you have a solid idea of how your body responds to that level of test. If you then introduce prop you’re not necessarily going to be able to have the same exact dosing protocol for your AI, because of the way the prop ester breaks down. I’m doubting it would hurt you, but is there enough upside in doing it? I’d say save the prop for another cycle and just finish out the more traditional route. That’s my 2¢.

#5

I may just hold off on the prop then. I think trying to incorporate it would definitely complicate things that would probably outweigh any benefits. I appreciate the advice!