T Nation

Medial Delts

Hi Christian,

any tips for medial delts ?

I’ve been overhead pressing for months now (5/3/1) and could not see any improvment in my medial delts (strenght is going up, of course with 5/3/1 template, but nothing from a bodybuilding pov).

I’ve tried scrape the rack…narrow grip and elbow up…wide grip and elbows out…
I’ve worked with John Meadows for 12 weeks and followed his program to the letter…

Have you any tips, someting that I could try ?

Thank you,
Mat’

Hi, I’m no CT, but maybe a few sets of lateral raises after shoulder pressing? if you bend forward slightly (or do chest supported with a steep angled bench) it will pretty much isolate the medial delt without interfering with your 5/3/1 work. -your medial delts will obviously get worked in the shoulder press, so i would say higher reps for total development 3-4 sets of 8-12 reps depending on your recovery?

alternatively try Chad Waterbury’s high frequency approach for lagging muscles -something like 100 lateral raises every day with a light weight whilst keeping your actual workouts the same… worked for me to bring up forearms, and didn’t affect anything else performance wise… Chad says to do the 100reps however you like… i think i did 5 sets of 20 throughout the day with a weight i could get 30ish reps with. -medial delts fit will with this approach because all you need is 2 light DB’s or any 2 light objects to be honest!

@Mat: Have you tried over head pressing with the dead-squat bar (supinated grip - pinkies closer together)? I’ve found that with the layer system to hit my shoulders better than anything I’ve ever done. I know this would isolate in the traditional sense but it has an amazing feel! Just an idea, I hope that helps.

Mat,

The delts are kind of a small muscle group, and seeing improvement in them takes quite a long time. I think may people expect to see these amazing results in 12 weeks time, but I really dont feel like that is a realistic time frame for intermediate to advanced trainees. Think about adding an entire inch to your bicep/tricep in a years time. It will not look like ANYTHING in 12 weeks, but if you are consistent the results add up.

Here are a couple of questions that we will need the answers to:

-What are you doing as the accessory work in your 5/3/1 template? Both on bench day and OH day

-Have you gained any significant body weight? Strength gains can be made without any weight gain, and even while losing weight, but size gains typically require body weight gain

  • Have your other body parts responded well to your current program growth wise. Meaning, if you chest/back/legs bigger, but NOT your shoulders?

[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:

-What are you doing as the accessory work in your 5/3/1 template? Both on bench day and OH day

-Have you gained any significant body weight? Strength gains can be made without any weight gain, and even while losing weight, but size gains typically require body weight gain

  • Have your other body parts responded well to your current program growth wise. Meaning, if you chest/back/legs bigger, but NOT your shoulders?

[/quote]

thanks Lonnie for your help :

-accessory work on bench day : dips 4 sets of 6-10 reps + triceps
accessory on OHP day : laterals 4 sets of 6-10 reps + triceps

-I gained 5 Lbs of BW in approx 3 months

-yes, other bodyparts responded well. That’s why I am looking for some help for my delts.

Thank you !
Mat’

Exercise selection looks appropriate. It suspect that you havent done it for long enough, and havent gained enough muscular weight.

5 pounds seems reasonable in that time frame, but remember that that is 5 pounds of TOTAL weight (muscle, fat, water, glycogen) so its not entirely muscle, and that it is 5 pounds spread across your entire body, with the majority going to your legs/back on that program. Shoulders are an inherently small muscle group, so adding noticeable size to them is going to take a while.

Also, 5/3/1 is more strength focused than hypertrophy. Of course it will increase size to a degree, but that is not the focus of the program. Trust in the 5/3/1 program 100% to achieve your strength goals, then maybe switch to a higher volume program at that point to increase the size a bit more. To blend both you might look up “5/3/1 and Body Building” and give that a shot. Again though, its going to take a while to see a lot of size gain on the medial delts.

I do not do many isolation exercises. But one that I like and use as a prep exercise for my snatches and that really hit the lateral portion of the delts are full lateal raises.

I’ve learned about that movement watching chinese olympic lifters and it has proven to be a nice addition to my routine.

Yeah… But who would want to look like THAT guy?

Thank you guys, really appreciate your help. I will try to add volume and perform full lat raises (I stopped at ears level)

Mat’

[quote]mat_angus wrote:
Thank you guys, really appreciate your help. I will try to add volume and perform full lat raises (I stopped at ears level)

Mat’
[/quote]

A tip, try to turn your hands out at the top and squeeze the deltoids in (imagine shoving the lateral head of the deltoids into your ear).

CT - would you say Lu Xiaojun (that vid you posted) epitomizes the “power look” of your system? I was just curious as his snatch (and certain snatch grip high pull) must be out of this world, yet there are guys who may be doing half the weight and develop a similar (or possibly even more jacked) look.

Is this a training, drugs (possibly?), point? Basically, if I keep increasing my snatch grip high pull ramp and cluster weights (with perfect form), do you see trap/back gains increasing even faster (fast twitch/priming) or diminishing returns? Surely Lu’s traps should be even MORE massively given the proportionate weight he’s snatching? Thank you!

^ His goal is not to get bigger.