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Massive Eating by John Berardi

Okay guys, it seems like a few of you are interested in John Berardi’s Massive Eating diet. After hearing about it at the Orlando NHB Seminar, I knew it was exactly what I needed. As I have not been taking in enough calories or protein to grow.

I don’t want to make this post too long. So I’ll give you the formulas once you guys reply. Because there are several formulas that you need to use to figure out the real amount of calories that you need to gain muscle.

Also, John said he would be publishing this diet on T-mag in the near future. So I’m sure he’ll give a lot more detail as to the how’s and why’s.

Okay, here are some basic tips: 1) Avoid high levels of blood fats and carbs at the same time. 2) Increase blood levels of carbs and protein OR Increase blood levels of protein and fats. 3) Determine best overfeeding diet: a. Try 8 weeks using 50 percent carbs, 25 percent protein, 15 percent fat. b. Try 8 weeks using 30 percent carbs, 40 percent protein, 30 percent fat (figure out which one is best for you). 4) DO NOT eat high carb meals alone 5) DO NOT eat moderate/high carb meals with high fat intake 6) DO eat protein meals in comination with moderate carbs and low fat 7) DO eat protein meals with moderate fat and low carbs

Also, John recommends that everyone use 6-10 grams of fish oils (DHA EPA), and Vitamins C and E. The best brand of fish oil is Member’s Mark. This is sold at Sam’s and other warehouse clubs. Also, they are inexpensive and sell other good supplements such as the Vitamin C and E.

Okay guys, if you want to know more just tell me, and I'll give you the formulas and some more tips. And if John Berardi would like to comment, I'm all for hearing from him! You are the man John! And I give John all the credit for this diet. I am only the messenger.

nate dogg - i need to know more, formulas, supplements any tips! cheers Field

Hi Nate Dogg,

First, thanks to your comments on my questions. That IS REALLY helpful. Thank’s a lot. I know this T-forum is different from the others.

Second, i notice that you mention that you should try 50/25/15 diet. Hey, that doesn’t add up to 100%.
If you have to try both for 8 weeks meaning 16 weeks in total. If it works it’s fine, but what happens if it doesn’t work? You waste money and time and you don’t get the body you want.
I don’t quite get what you mean at point 4,5,6,7. Can you give some examples of food combination that’s good to eat and to avoid?

Third, i have another question relating to diet.

Thank’s once again.

Field, those forumulas are coming right up! Let me answer Johnathan’s questions first. Okay, the reason to try one of those 8-week eating plans is to figure out which one you respond to best. Right now, you are already probably eating closer to one of the two examples. So that means you should use the one that is opposite to what you are eating. And this is John’s rationale for sticking with it for 8 weeks: If you’ve been training and eating for any number of years, what is 8-weeks? Do you think 8-weeks will destroy how you look? And if you are used to the same results and not accomplishing your goals, then why not try something new for 8 weeks. It could make all the difference in the world.

I made a food log and started keeping track of everything. I made my own calorie, protein, carb, fat chart of foods I eat most often. And after doing this for a few days, I figured out that I usually eat closer to the 30 carbs, 40 protein and 30 fat. In fact, my ratio was 40 carbs, 30 protein and 30 fat. So I’m tweaking it a little to get my carbs down a little and my protein up. I’ll do this for 8 weeks to see how it works. Then I will try the other diet with lower fat intake and see how it works.

Okay, to clear up tips 4,5,6 and 7. If you are going to eat a moderate-to-high carb meal with protein, then you MUST consume low fat foods. So you would want to eat things like chicken, whey, casein, turkey, egg whites, skim milk, tuna and cottage cheese for your protein. And you would want to consume apples, oranges, oatmeal, all bran cereals, vegetables, white pasta and yogurt for your carbs. These are all low fat sources.

Now, if you want to eat moderate-to-high protein with moderate-to-high fat, then you must consume very low carbs. For protein, you can eat beef, salmon, whey, casein, turkey, whole eggs and pork. For fat, consume fish oils, flaxseed oil, olive oil, canola oil and nuts…and be sure to keep your carbs ultra low.

So there are some sample foods to combine. Remember, you want to ALWAYS avoid high carbs and fat. That is the evil meal combo. So you can eat high protein and high fat with low carbs. Or you can eat high carbs and protein with low fat. Now, just think of other foods that fit these situations. Remember, that fettichini (sp) alfredo might look good, but it is one of the evil meals to avoid.

Field, I'll give you those formulas in a little bit. I swear! But I have to go cover a Hooters Golf Tournament that is benefitting United Way! I need to take some pictures for our newsletter. So I will get back and fill in more tips for you guys!

Thanks for the post Fettuccine Boy (just joshing ya Nate Dogg!). That is some very good info. I have been following the guidelines of Dr. Michel Montignac, who advocated low GI eating and he’s sold 8 million copies of his book in Europe. He mentioned french fries being the very worst because the GI=100 and all the fat…oooh a bad combo. Probably a lot worse than fettuccine, since at least fettuccine has a moderate GI. Another villain, (insert Homer Simpson’s voice here) mmmmm…donuts…Again thanks a lot for taking the time to help out your fellow T-men. Hooters Golf Tournament…you gotta love it. Is this the Hooters in Winter Park? I used to go there when I used to live in Orlando when I was going through Nuclear Power school with the Navy in 94. They used to have the best crab legs, for only 12.99, the Hooters that is, not the Navy.

The prophet Nate Dogg has come to pass on the good word of our buddy Dr. Berardi! Thanks, Nate Dogg, I–along with these other guys here–really appreciate you sharing this valuable info. I am just salivating over those formulas, big guy:-)
Just to clear up on the DO NOT tips…could you give us an idea (nutrient ratios) of what might constitue high- to moderate-carb and high-fat meals. For example, would this be something like 30%+ fat with 50%+ carb? I am personally using a 40/30/30 pro/carb/fat diet pretty much, but sometimes shift to 35-40% carb with 30-35% pro and 30% fat. I think I get the picture with your fettucini and Hyok’s donut examples, as these meals are loaded with carbs and fat and little to no protein.
Anyway, thanks a bunch, Nate Dogg. And, again, congrats on your awesome progress so far! BTW, what kind of pictures were you taking at this event that’s sponsored by the beautiful Hooter’s girls???

Hyok, the Hooters Golf Tournament was for United Way of Alachua County (Gainesville, FL). And it was all good. Forget pictures of the guys golfing, I took pics of the girls! In fact, I’ll e-mail one to T-mag and see if they will post it. I have a good pic of two girls with some nice “hooters.”

Also, the doughnut was another good example of a high fat/high carb food. Now you just have to start combining the right types of food. To answer Timbo’s question about nutrient ratios, that I do not know. I’m not sure if John covered that in his lecture. And I don’t have all my notes with me at work. So I can’t give any specifics on that.

This is what I think. If you're going to do a high protein, high carb, low-fat meal, it would be something like this: Chicken breast, 1 cup broccoli and a baked potato. That would be a typical meal. Or if you are going to go high protein and high fat, why not eat some steak (or other beef) with beans or some low-carb veggies and throw in some flaxseed oil or something like that. Timbo and field, are you ready for those formulas??? Here we go. Be sure to get out some paper.

First, you must figure out your fat free mass (ffm) in kilograms. So take your bodyweight in pounds and multiply it by the percent bodyfat you have. I'll be the example: 145lbs x .12 = 17.4. Subtract that from your original bodyweight (145 - 17.4= 127.6lbs FFM). Now, convert that to kilograms by dividing by 2.2 (I have 58kg of ffm).

Second, you must figure out your Resting Metabolic Rate (RMR). This is the amount of calories you burn just being alive. RMR = 500 + 22(FFM in kg). Example: 500 + 22(58) = 1,776.

Third, you figure out your Activity Level. I don't have the chart of all the activities with me, so we'll go with what I know. You take your RMR and multiply it by your Activity Level. My Activity Level is 1.5 because I work an office job. Activity Level: 1,776(1.5) = 2,664.

So being alive and working means I need 2,664 calories a day for maintenance. But we're not done yet.

Fourth, we have to figure out our Exercise Expenditure. Again, I don't have all the charts with me, so I'll go with what I know. Energy Expenditure is equal to Bodyweight (not FFM) in kilograms multiplied by Exercise level and time. For example: 66kg x 6 METS (this is equal to an hour of free weight training) x 1 hour = 396 calories. So I burn 396 calories in an hour's worth of weight training.

Fifth, RMR(Activity Level) + Exercise Level means I need 3,060 calories so far. Example: 1,776(1.5) + 396 = 3,060

Sixth, we have to count for the Thermic Effect of Food (TEF). So you figure that out by taking your RMR and mulitiple it by .10 if you have a moderate protein intake OR by .15 if you have a high protein intake. Example: 1,776 x .10 = 177.6

LASTLY, to figure out your Energy Balance to know how many calories you REALLY need in order to gain muscle mass, you do the following formula. RMR(Activity Level) + Exercise Level + TEF. Example: 1,776(1.5) + 396 + 177.6 = 3,238 kcal

So that is how many calories I should be eating EVERYDAY. John says you must consume this amount even on non-training days. This is so you will have an energy surplus at the end of each week. And this leads to those wonderful muscles we all work so hard for. And he suggests six meals a day. So divide your final number by six and figure out how many calories each meal should have. And yes, it is hard to eat that much! But it is what you have to do in order to gain.

Whew!!! Any questions? I have a few more tips. But this is already getting long as dog shit!

Thanks for the post, Nate Dogg. Man, that is a lot of calculations. I just threw it all on a spreadsheet and it says I need to eat about 3700 calories a day. Wow, I don’t know if I can do that. Again, thanks for taking the time to bring us up to speed.

To Nate - Young Jedi, the force is strong with you. Nice description of my formulas! Couldnt have done better myself.

Again, I will be doing an article on this shortly but to clarify the protein+fat or protein+carb point…I want everyone to understand that Im not talking about glycemic index. Im talking about nutrients and insulin. You should try to avoid high insulin, fat and carbs in the blood at the same time. Therefore most should not eat carbs+protein+fat at thier meals. It should be carbs and protein, or carbs and fat. Now, individuals differ so before someone decides that they are going to write in and rip me, I will say this…wait for the article. I will justify everything then. Until then you can curse me privately but dont do it here :slight_smile:

John, I’m going to assume you meant protein and fat (towards the middle of your reply), and not carbs and fat… Feel free to correct if I’m wrong!

WOW!!! NATE DOGG - youre going to wish you never wrote this article i’m going to drain you for every bit of info u have! thanks for sharing info, anymore on supplements and the timing of and any other tips youve picked up?

John, thanks for clearing up the meal thing. Now, my question is, can you give us more examples of meals? I think that is the hardest thing to come up with. So if you could help us, let me know! Or if we should wait for the article, then that’s what we’ll do!

I didn’t think eating was such a science! But I guess that many of us thought the same thing about training until Ian King came along! Whew! This is a lot of work. Hey John, how about a Massive Eating Guide for dummies? I’m down with that. :slight_smile:

John, I’m being a bit impatient here, but throw me a bone. It seems like the direction you are leading is opposite of the latest thoughts on getting lean via low GI carbs. Is it because insulin is so anabolic? So you want to use high insulin in conjuction with high protein to facilitate muscle growth, but you want to avoid high fat intake at times of high insulin to minimize fat storage? Is the force strong in me here?

Sounds very interesting. Do the same rules apply to a fat loss diet, or is this strictly for mass gaining. If one were following the Zone (but 40p,30c,30f, which is similar to what i’m doing, wouldn’t each meal basically be high carbs and fat. My carbs are from Yams and some broccoli, and fat from Fish, Canola and Olive Oil. Thing is i’m getting 12g fat and 25-30g carbs each meal. Would that be considered high fat and carbs in the same meal? Also, is the low fat recommended for fat loss too?

Nate, thanks for sharing all this great info. I have one comment-question though. This protin/carbs/low fat OR protein/fat/low carbs combo makes a lot of sense, but what about adding fat to an otherwise high GI meal to lower the overall glycemic rating? Such as adding Flax oil to a MRP to lower the GI? Obviously John’s theory negates that. Is that theory being thrown out? Or is it old school thinking being replaced by ‘new and improved’? Maybe John could chime in here, too. Thanks.

Yes, there are more tips! Like you should consume 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight. And insulin sesitivity is GOOD. Insulin resistance is BAD. You’ll have to ask John more about that, as it goes over my head. And there is more! But I need to go over my notes.

Flex69, John Berardi has another plan for staying lean all year called the “Don’t Diet Diet.” But that’s a whole other article. And I know John is writing that one for T-mag too. Also, Tom Incledon gave a good lecture called “Shredded” for those who want to get lean. But it’s not time to release them yet! I’m still working on the Massive Dieting one!!! :slight_smile:

But I’ll give you guys some more info soon. I need to study my notes. I’ll let you know what else I have for you! But Dark Angel is on now, so I need to go watch my girl kick the shit out of someone and look hot as apple pie doing it!

Nate or John,

First of all, is this diet meant for fat loss or bulking? or both?
I don’t understand why the newer articles that came out mostly have higher fat ratio i.e. 30% or above 20%… I thought that muscle is mainly glycogen. So, if you workout you supply your muscle with carbs as pre and post workout meal. Now, wouldn’t it true that if you have lower carb intake you will be exhausted faster when you workout?

Nate, I'll just follow the Delta1250 diet for now but you know that i have a different schedule from the ones suggested in the program. So, i'll still go with that but instead of having 5 days of hypocaloric phase, i will go with 7 days and another 7 of hypercaloric. For the exercises, i will just follow the ones that you suggested to me like alternatives for doing dips. But i have a day to go to a gym, i'll just do all the exercises that i can't do at home (max. 90 mins). Do you think this is fine? Any other suggestion?

Which programs (Diet and Workout) are you currently on right now?

Alright, everybody give my boy Nate Dogg a round of applause, a gift certificate to the Biotest store and a life-time subscription to Playboy! Great work, Nate Dogg. I know this is not all-inclusive and the be-all, end-all, but you really have done a helluva job here. Dr. Berardi should be proud of the young T-man he has inspired. Thanks for all the juicy details, Nate Diggity Dogg. Although I am still awaiting the goodies in terms of activity level and exercise expenditure. So get off your butt and study your notes! Do you wanna be a professor or a TA??? Just kidding, buddy, thanks a bunch.

Now, I’m going to try to make some sense out this whole thing and address some of the questions and points brought up. Dr. Berardi, if you’re out there and I’m totally off base, just slap me silly and call me stupid. Okay, I think it’s necessary to look at the hormones insulin and glucagon. Insulin is a very, very anabolic hormone in nature. Anabolic basically means that insulin makes things out of smaller particles. Not just in terms of making muscle though. When we eat, carbs are broken down to glucose, proteins are broken down to amino acids and fats to fatty acids. So when insulin is present–insulin is secreted by the pancreas in response to glucose present in the blood (ie. after eating carbs)–the glucose molecules are converted to glycogen, aminos to proteins…and yes, fatty acids to fats. These are then stored respectively. So you can theoretically see why it may be a bad idea to consume fats at the same time as carbs, because they will readily be stored as fats. Remember this is all theory, but I’m sure the good Doc’s got some hardcore proof and research to back this thang up. Now, glucagon. Glucagon has effects exactly opposite that of insulin. So, glycogen is broken down to glucose, proteins to aminos (gluconeogenesis) and–here’s the big one–fats to fatty acids. Now eating a high protein meal with some fat, and NO carbs, will not cause any secretion of insulin but will cause glucagon secretion. So the fat will not be readily stored, but more likely it will be used as a source of energy. This is the feeling I get from the whole plan proposed by my main man John. Now, I don’t really know the threshold for insulin activation, as far as the amount of carbs in a certain meal. I imagine they’d have to be pretty low though. I’ve never done a ketogenic diet so I don’t know the amount of carbs allowed per meal. However, I think meal timing and composition is very important with this protocol. For example, post-training would definitely be good timing for the high protein and carb meals–maybe the two or three meals following training.

Of course, Doc knows best, so I’m going to see what he says. But as far as insulin sensitivity and resistance, I think I can help here. If one is sensitive to insulin (GOOD) that means his insulin receptors–which are located on various sites in the body including muscle–readily respond to insulin and assimilate the nutrients that are transported. For example, insulin receptor sites on the muscle will readily store glycogen and proteins if one is sensitive. However, if one is insulin resistant, then the receptor sites are desensitized and the anabolic effects of insulin are disabled, for the most part. Hope all this stuff makes a little sense out of all this. It’s really pretty cool stuff.

I do not mean to steal Nate Doggs or John B.'s thunder, but to find what you need per activity level, multiply your RMR by the activity factor you fall into. “1.2-1.3=Bed Rest; 1.5-1.6=office work during the day; 1.6-1.7=some activity during the day; 1.9-2.1=labor-type work”. I cite John M. Berardi as the source of this information.

Exercis expenditure can be figured out by taking bodyweight in kg (divide lbs by 2.2) multiplied by duration (hours) METS. The MET value for various activities is as follows: high impact aerobics (7); low impact aerobics (5); high intensity cycling (12); low intensity cycling (3); high intensity walking (6.5); low intensity walking (2.5); high intensity running (18); low intensity running (7); low rest interval and circuit training (8); intense free weight lifting (6); moderate machine training (3). Again, John M. Berardi is the source.

Timbo, thanks for clearing those matters up. one question though, i’ve always assumed to be in a anabolic state you must have a steady insulin release through out the day thats why we consume a given ratio of food or eat carbs higher in fibre to substain the steady release, now a high insulin level all day wouldn’t even replinish glycogen levels as effective as a stable insulin release from carb intake so what is the role of Glucagon in the body? i know the 40:30:30 diet is geared towards a steady release of both insulin and glucagon but whats the advantage of just glucagon release such in protein and fat meal? cheers field