T Nation

Mary Cheney

Why is Team Bush whining and complaining that Kerry referred to Cheney’s lesbian daughter (in a positive way)?

When Cheney debated Edwards, Edwards mentioned Mary Cheney was a lesbian during the debate!

Cheney’s response: Thanks for your comments.

Now Team Bush is crying foul, after John Kerry mentioned Mary Cheney during the 3rd presidential debate.

Mary Cheney has a major role on her father’s re-election team… she’s part of the campaign.

Everyone knows she’s a lesbian… correction, everyone who follows politics knows she’s a lesbian.

Kerry’s comments were respectful.

So why the big whine-fest?

To me, it appears that Bush doesn’t have a record of accomplishments he can run on, or positive ideas for the future that he can talk about, so they stoop to pretending they are outraged, about something they weren’t outraged about last week.

What’s your explanation?

Lumpy,

“When Cheney debated Edwards, Edwards mentioned Mary Cheney was a lesbian during the debate! Cheney’s response: Thanks for your comments.”

You seem to forget the cold wind that followed Cheney’s comments.

“Now Team Bush is crying foul, after John Kerry mentioned Mary Cheney during the 3rd presidential debate.”

Yes. I took this up with a gay friend of mine, wanting to get his take on it. His suggestion was parallel to a lot of editorials I’ve read: he thinks Kerry and Edwards want to remind the Bush base that Cheney has a gay daughter he accepts, hoping a few votes from the anti-gay crowd would peel off.

“Mary Cheney has a major role on her father’s re-election team… she’s part of the campaign.”

Exactly. But Kerry’s comments were hamfisted and clumsy. Why reference Cheney’s daughter in the context of homosexuality being natural or not when Cheney isn’t even in the room or at the podium? It was clear Kerry wanted to get a comment about Mary Cheney in, and it didn’t look good.

“So why the big whine-fest?”

Mostly the complaints are coming from the mom and dad - it’s more personal than political. That doesn’t mean that politics don’t play into it, but parents don’t appreciate their kids being channeled for political gain in the context Kerry did it.

“To me, it appears that Bush doesn’t have a record of accomplishments he can run on, or positive ideas for the future that he can talk about, so they stoop to pretending they are outraged, about something they weren’t outraged about last week.”

This is just silly - Bush is more of a reformer than Kerry is.

Probably both Edwards and Kerry were slightly ‘playing the gay card’ in their debate comments. I agree that probably they should have left the Cheney daughter alone.

But hearing Mrs Cheney go on and on about how John Kerry isn’t a good man made me feel ill. And being married to a power and money-crazed cold conniving man like Dick Cheney, how would she know what a good man was anyway?

Hey man, don’t piss Mrs. Cheney off. That’s her baby girl, and she’s gonna go off on the guys that try to use her daughter’s personal life for political gain, however minor it may be. I understand why Mrs. Cheney did that. After all, she’s part of the machine. But I would have something to say about anybody doing that to my daughter, too.

A very clever, yet underhanded, trick by the Kerry team which backfired.

[quote]deanosumo wrote:
But hearing Mrs Cheney go on and on about how John Kerry isn’t a good man made me feel ill. And being married to a power and money-crazed cold conniving man like Dick Cheney, how would she know what a good man was anyway?[/quote]

Kerry is the one running for President - not Cheney’s daughter. Children have historically been left alone in campaigns. They were petty, cheap attempts to make an issue out of something that is none of their business.

If hearing Mrs. Cheney rail against Kerry made you feel ill, how can you stand to even look at Moneybags Heinz-Kerry without needing a stomach pump? The woman gives me the willies

“…a power and money crazed cold conniving man…”

You mean Mr. Personality, the guy who married into huge loot not once, but twice, and will say what he thinks will sell to the voter to attain the most powerful office in the world?

You lefties have a habit of stepping into it even when you are trying to sling it. Be more careful.

[quote]Lumpy wrote:
Why is Team Bush whining and complaining that Kerry referred to Cheney’s lesbian daughter (in a positive way)?

When Cheney debated Edwards, Edwards mentioned Mary Cheney was a lesbian during the debate!

Cheney’s response: Thanks for your comments.

Now Team Bush is crying foul, after John Kerry mentioned Mary Cheney during the 3rd presidential debate. [/quote]

The answer is simple- Cheney already dealt with it once. Obviously he didn’t appreciate it, but he let it go.

[quote]Kerry’s comments were respectful.

So why the big whine-fest?

What’s your explanation?[/quote]

Kerry bringing it up a 2nd time was not respectful. It was just a cheap, cowardly political manuever. He wasn’t speaking directly to Cheney. That the Bush team cried fowl is to be expected.

Another foolish move by Kerry. I’m glad he’s not going to be the President of the United States.

Lumpy.

I may not be gay, but I support your lifestyle.

Jonah Goldberg of NR puts it this way:

"But what if George W. Bush had said “divorce is a difficult issue. On one hand we all think society is healthier when marriages are healthier. On the other hand, we understand that good and decent people sometimes have irreconcilable differences. I’m sure if you asked John Kerry’s first wife, she would tell you that there are no easy answers…” Or if he had said, “I’m sure if you asked John Kerry’s lovely daughters whether it was easy for them to cope with their parents’ divorce…” Or what if Bush had said, “America is a land of great opportunity for immigrants. I’m sure John Kerry’s second wife Teresa, who was born in Africa, would agree…”

Forget homosexuality for a moment. It was the context. Bad move on Kerry’s part.

Plus, I expect the apple doesn’t fall too far from the tree, and Mary Cheney could punch Kerry’s lights out.

I agree with those who feel that this was personal…

Remember…Laura Bush “circled the Wagons” when her girls were in trouble…and told EVERY interviewer to “back off” because it was a family matter…and always reinterated how she Loved her girls unconditionally…

Mrs. Cheney is doing the same thing…as well she should…

It’s the Love of a Mother, guys…

Mufasa

The fact that you guys are defending kerry over this one shows how friggin one sided you are. When someone f’s up they f up no matter what side of the aisle they sit on. This was at best an unclassy move and at worst it wast flat out mean. I’m sure john kerry knows a thousand gay people, i’m sure he knows a hundred gay people who are more in the limelight than mary cheany. Half of his friggin hollywood buddies are gay and they would have been happy if he used them instead. It probably would have went a lot better for him as well.

The sad thing is he had a good point but he ruined it by throwing in that cheap shot.

As for bush’s response, at least the guy is honest. all he could say was I don’t know. If that is what he thinks can anyone blame him? To my knowledge Gayness hasn’t been proven to be an orientation decided at birth. I actually believe it isn’t, at least not in 90% of the gay population. I just don’t think that stuff is hard wired. It is a response to the specific social influences of that individual and how they respond to them. I also think the increasing homosexual rates of both genders has something to do with the feminization of men and defeminization of women. Peoples hormones are getting screwed up and they get aroused by the sight of the same sex, then society tells them to accept that and come out with it and then it is all over, they fall into the cycle of being gay. Not that it is a bad thing. I just don’t believe people are born that way. Not all of them at least. Right now the estimated percentage of the population who is gay is far over any of that reported percentiges in the animal kingdom. I’m sure a very small percentage are born with physical attraction for the same sex, again it’s like a hormone imbalance and obviously societal and environmental influences can effect hormones. Either way you look at it it doesn’t really friggin matter.

Gay people are still people. There are far less people who give a shit then there are gay people so I’d say they have them outnumbered and lets move on.

Vegita ~ Prince of all Sayajins

In this election – and especially in the debate – and especially from Mr. Preparation, John Kerry – I’m pretty certain that Mary Cheney wasn’t mentioned because she was the first name off the top of Kerry’s head.

This is especially true given the fact Edwards mentioned Mary Cheney in the VP debate, and because Mary Beth Cahill, in comments on Fox immediately following the debate, declared Mary Cheney’s sexuality to be “fair game.” Also, note that Kerry worked Mary Cheney’s name into his response by the 6th word of that response. This, ladies and gentlemen, was the calculated political use of personal information on the Vice President’s children.

Now, the real question is, why would Kerry/Edwards et al think they could get an advantage by mentioning Mary Cheney? Some people have advanced the notion that it was an attempt to attack what they viewed as a bigoted portion of Bush voters – likely lower-class white blue collar workers, some of the “Reagan Republicans” that had returned to the Republican camp after security again became a major concern. I don’t think this is it – mostly because I don’t think it’s likely they would reach out to this group with references in the debates – but it’s a possibility.

The more intriguing possibility, to me, is the idea that Kerry/Edwards was actually trying to shore up some support in the black and Hispanic communities – these groups tend to be conservative on social issues, and Kerry has been doing much worse among blacks than he had hoped. I think this is more likely, especially because inroads for Republicans with these groups of voters, both of which are critical to Kerry’s re-election hopes in terms of galvanizing their turn out and getting the historical 90% of that turnout that the Democrats have captured recently, tend to come on social issues.

Generally, I think Kerry’s attempt to utilize the private lives of the Cheneys for his own political purposes is “tawdry”, to quote Mrs. Cheney’s reaction. However Dick & Lynne Cheney and Mary Cheney want to deal with that issue is between them, and I think Mufasa was spot-on in his assessment of their reaction.

Plus, I think this carries into why the remark is hurting Kerry – Kerry isn’t losing points among gays or straights per se – he’s losing points with parents.