airtruth
please explain to me the first line on your post.
thanks
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
I don’t think people really lose weight until they hit the 6:30 per mile barrier. I do think your max lifts will go down but only while your doing all those miles per week. They will probably creep back up once your body acclimates. I would be careful lifting though. Not sure how much your doing but a lot of leg work combined with that much mileage can be a recipe for disaster, if your lucky it’ll just make improving your speed over distance non-existent.[/quote]
are ou saying to much leg work will make it impossible to improve your distance speeds?
[quote]spk wrote:
airtruth
please explain to me the first line on your post.
thanks[/quote]
I was a little excessive, but the average person who starts a running program and doesn’t watch their diet is not going to automatically lose weight. They would still have to watch their diet and other factors. I’ve known some to even gain because they’re hungrier on their days off. This seems to change for people who run fast. I’ve seen more people have problems gaining weight when they are running 6 minute miles and below. A 10 minute mile is what people who are in condition to run can do, a 6 minute and below is when the metabolism is really starting to shoot up.
Of course if you are watching your diet then a 10 minute mile will help you lose fat.
[quote]bignate wrote:
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
I don’t think people really lose weight until they hit the 6:30 per mile barrier. I do think your max lifts will go down but only while your doing all those miles per week. They will probably creep back up once your body acclimates. I would be careful lifting though. Not sure how much your doing but a lot of leg work combined with that much mileage can be a recipe for disaster, if your lucky it’ll just make improving your speed over distance non-existent.[/quote]
are ou saying to much leg work will make it impossible to improve your distance speeds? [/quote]
If by too much you mean heavy and volume then yes.
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]theBird wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
Run 5ks if you dont wanna be a twig. A marathon is just too long, if you want to train for it you have to run 100 miles or more a week and then you becoming skinny is a must. Its just not a good thing to do if you honestly fear being a twig. Its like saying “I wanna eat at KFC 5 times a day but I’m afraid of getting fat”. [/quote]
No.[/quote]
Do you think your funny that you provide a one work response to a statement?
Well, your not.
tweet[/quote]
I wasn’t trying to be funny, I just found that literally everything in that statement is incorrect.
-Not all marathoners are twigs. By doing a marathon, you won’t wither away unless you train to.
-An advanced marathon training plan would put you at 100 miles a week. A normal one could be as low as 30-40.
-If it’s this guy’s goal to complete a marathon, then let those who have done marathons before help him succeed at that task, rather than having those who, by their writing, seem to be lacking in experience, offer faulty advice.
Also, it’s “you’re.” Not “your.”
[/quote]
I said if you want to TRAIN for a marathon. Meaning actually prepare for it. If you run 30 miles a week you are not training for a marathon. You are merely jogging in your freetime and then will run a marathon later on. Running 30 miles a week is as much training for a marathon as doing P 90x is training for the Olympia
[quote]JFG wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]theBird wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
Run 5ks if you dont wanna be a twig. A marathon is just too long, if you want to train for it you have to run 100 miles or more a week and then you becoming skinny is a must. Its just not a good thing to do if you honestly fear being a twig. Its like saying “I wanna eat at KFC 5 times a day but I’m afraid of getting fat”. [/quote]
No.[/quote]
Do you think your funny that you provide a one work response to a statement?
Well, your not.
tweet[/quote]
I wasn’t trying to be funny, I just found that literally everything in that statement is incorrect.
-Not all marathoners are twigs. By doing a marathon, you won’t wither away unless you train to.
-An advanced marathon training plan would put you at 100 miles a week. A normal one could be as low as 30-40.
-If it’s this guy’s goal to complete a marathon, then let those who have done marathons before help him succeed at that task, rather than having those who, by their writing, seem to be lacking in experience, offer faulty advice.
Also, it’s “you’re.” Not “your.”
[/quote]
^ x2
JC’s comment is just full of fail. He can run a marathon if he wants to. If he wants to become a marathoner, then it’s a whole different ball game,
100 miles a week, yeah right.[/quote]
As i said, he wants to train for a marathon, not just run one. Training for a marathon requires 100 miles a week. Of course he can just run a marathon at a terrible time if he wants.
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
[quote]spk wrote:
airtruth
please explain to me the first line on your post.
thanks[/quote]
I was a little excessive, but the average person who starts a running program and doesn’t watch their diet is not going to automatically lose weight. They would still have to watch their diet and other factors. I’ve known some to even gain because they’re hungrier on their days off. This seems to change for people who run fast. I’ve seen more people have problems gaining weight when they are running 6 minute miles and below. A 10 minute mile is what people who are in condition to run can do, a 6 minute and below is when the metabolism is really starting to shoot up.
Of course if you are watching your diet then a 10 minute mile will help you lose fat. [/quote]
I myself understood you perfectly as that’s what happens to me when I increase my running mileage…I get hungrier.
I’ve heard that with some other Clydesdales (http://www.clydesdale.org/) BY the way that’s NOT about horses!) that this is true for them too.
I just clicked on that Clydesdale Class website and they have T shirts available, but only L size…YOU DON’T SAY!
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
[quote]JFG wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]theBird wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
Run 5ks if you dont wanna be a twig. A marathon is just too long, if you want to train for it you have to run 100 miles or more a week and then you becoming skinny is a must. Its just not a good thing to do if you honestly fear being a twig. Its like saying “I wanna eat at KFC 5 times a day but I’m afraid of getting fat”. [/quote]
No.[/quote]
Do you think your funny that you provide a one work response to a statement?
Well, your not.
tweet[/quote]
I wasn’t trying to be funny, I just found that literally everything in that statement is incorrect.
-Not all marathoners are twigs. By doing a marathon, you won’t wither away unless you train to.
-An advanced marathon training plan would put you at 100 miles a week. A normal one could be as low as 30-40.
-If it’s this guy’s goal to complete a marathon, then let those who have done marathons before help him succeed at that task, rather than having those who, by their writing, seem to be lacking in experience, offer faulty advice.
Also, it’s “you’re.” Not “your.”
[/quote]
^ x2
JC’s comment is just full of fail. He can run a marathon if he wants to. If he wants to become a marathoner, then it’s a whole different ball game,
100 miles a week, yeah right.[/quote]
As i said, he wants to train for a marathon, not just run one. Training for a marathon requires 100 miles a week. Of course he can just run a marathon at a terrible time if he wants.
[/quote]
I don’t know man. I think running is a lot like lifting. If you want to train for PL, do you HAVE to Squat 2x a week? Or just once? Do you have to Deadlift weekly? Just saying there are multiple ways to skin a cat man. I know 100 miles is an arbitrary number you’re using, but to make a ‘rule’ of what counts as ‘training for a marathon’ and what is ‘running sometimes and then running a marathon’ is pretty hard to define.
Now maybe you mean train ‘optimally’ for a marathon, but I give the same examples as lifting. ‘Optimal’ is different for everyone.
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
As i said, he wants to train for a marathon, not just run one. Training for a marathon requires 100 miles a week. Of course he can just run a marathon at a terrible time if he wants.
[/quote]
This just simply isn’t true. Many people qualify for Boston running half of that. If you have some sort of running background or are just naturally a decent runner, you can do yourself proud training 3 days/wk for a marathon. Only the very elite tend to run as much as you stated, and that’s often part of a training plan where their numbers can average 10-20 miles/wk lower than that.
If you do 6-10 twice a week and then a long of 14-20 you’ll be in fine shape to run a marathon, imo. It’ll help to play with pacing etc within one of those shorter runs, and additional easy mileage almost always helps, but the hardest part is building up to that kind of distance. It’s highly recommended that you put some time in getting used to that kind of distance. As in, 8-12 months if you aren’t much of a runner.
[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
[quote]JFG wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]theBird wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
Run 5ks if you dont wanna be a twig. A marathon is just too long, if you want to train for it you have to run 100 miles or more a week and then you becoming skinny is a must. Its just not a good thing to do if you honestly fear being a twig. Its like saying “I wanna eat at KFC 5 times a day but I’m afraid of getting fat”. [/quote]
No.[/quote]
Do you think your funny that you provide a one work response to a statement?
Well, your not.
tweet[/quote]
I wasn’t trying to be funny, I just found that literally everything in that statement is incorrect.
-Not all marathoners are twigs. By doing a marathon, you won’t wither away unless you train to.
-An advanced marathon training plan would put you at 100 miles a week. A normal one could be as low as 30-40.
-If it’s this guy’s goal to complete a marathon, then let those who have done marathons before help him succeed at that task, rather than having those who, by their writing, seem to be lacking in experience, offer faulty advice.
Also, it’s “you’re.” Not “your.”
[/quote]
^ x2
JC’s comment is just full of fail. He can run a marathon if he wants to. If he wants to become a marathoner, then it’s a whole different ball game,
100 miles a week, yeah right.[/quote]
As i said, he wants to train for a marathon, not just run one. Training for a marathon requires 100 miles a week. Of course he can just run a marathon at a terrible time if he wants.
[/quote]
I don’t know man. I think running is a lot like lifting. If you want to train for PL, do you HAVE to Squat 2x a week? Or just once? Do you have to Deadlift weekly? Just saying there are multiple ways to skin a cat man. I know 100 miles is an arbitrary number you’re using, but to make a ‘rule’ of what counts as ‘training for a marathon’ and what is ‘running sometimes and then running a marathon’ is pretty hard to define.
Now maybe you mean train ‘optimally’ for a marathon, but I give the same examples as lifting. ‘Optimal’ is different for everyone.[/quote]
Yes 100 miles isnt exactly the rule. You are right that the number is somewhat arbitrary. But no in distance running there is no different way to train for a marathon other than running an extreme amount of miles.
It isnt comparable to squatting once or twice a week. Not running over, lets be extremely conservative, 50 miles a week is like squatting your bodyweight 3 days a week to train for a powerlifting meet. Just think, the race itself is over 20 miles, running 60 miles a week is typical for a 5k runner, now think that a marathon is over 7 times that distance. There are different methods to train for a marathon, as some run 120 miles a week, while some might run 70 miles a week along with up tempo 800s, but there is not a single person doing actual marathon training that isnt running 50+ miles. It would guarantee failure. And distance running is a bit different than lifting in many ways so unless you actually know specific information about running, you are talkin out of your ass
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
[quote]JFG wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]theBird wrote:
[quote]bigquig wrote:
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
Run 5ks if you dont wanna be a twig. A marathon is just too long, if you want to train for it you have to run 100 miles or more a week and then you becoming skinny is a must. Its just not a good thing to do if you honestly fear being a twig. Its like saying “I wanna eat at KFC 5 times a day but I’m afraid of getting fat”. [/quote]
No.[/quote]
Do you think your funny that you provide a one work response to a statement?
Well, your not.
tweet[/quote]
I wasn’t trying to be funny, I just found that literally everything in that statement is incorrect.
-Not all marathoners are twigs. By doing a marathon, you won’t wither away unless you train to.
-An advanced marathon training plan would put you at 100 miles a week. A normal one could be as low as 30-40.
-If it’s this guy’s goal to complete a marathon, then let those who have done marathons before help him succeed at that task, rather than having those who, by their writing, seem to be lacking in experience, offer faulty advice.
Also, it’s “you’re.” Not “your.”
[/quote]
^ x2
JC’s comment is just full of fail. He can run a marathon if he wants to. If he wants to become a marathoner, then it’s a whole different ball game,
100 miles a week, yeah right.[/quote]
As i said, he wants to train for a marathon, not just run one. Training for a marathon requires 100 miles a week. Of course he can just run a marathon at a terrible time if he wants.
[/quote]
I don’t know man. I think running is a lot like lifting. If you want to train for PL, do you HAVE to Squat 2x a week? Or just once? Do you have to Deadlift weekly? Just saying there are multiple ways to skin a cat man. I know 100 miles is an arbitrary number you’re using, but to make a ‘rule’ of what counts as ‘training for a marathon’ and what is ‘running sometimes and then running a marathon’ is pretty hard to define.
Now maybe you mean train ‘optimally’ for a marathon, but I give the same examples as lifting. ‘Optimal’ is different for everyone.[/quote]
Yes 100 miles isnt exactly the rule. You are right that the number is somewhat arbitrary. But no in distance running there is no different way to train for a marathon other than running an extreme amount of miles.
It isnt comparable to squatting once or twice a week. Not running over, lets be extremely conservative, 50 miles a week is like squatting your bodyweight 3 days a week to train for a powerlifting meet. Just think, the race itself is over 20 miles, running 60 miles a week is typical for a 5k runner, now think that a marathon is over 7 times that distance. There are different methods to train for a marathon, as some run 120 miles a week, while some might run 70 miles a week along with up tempo 800s, but there is not a single person doing actual marathon training that isnt running 50+ miles. It would guarantee failure. And distance running is a bit different than lifting in many ways so unless you actually know specific information about running, you are talkin out of your ass[/quote]
^^ Every single thing in this post is incorrect. ^^
For what it’s worth I did a half marathon on about 10 to 12 miles a week for about 2 months before the race.
[quote]@JC_Tree_Trunks wrote:
Yes 100 miles isnt exactly the rule. You are right that the number is somewhat arbitrary. But no in distance running there is no different way to train for a marathon other than running an extreme amount of miles.
It isnt comparable to squatting once or twice a week. Not running over, lets be extremely conservative, 50 miles a week is like squatting your bodyweight 3 days a week to train for a powerlifting meet. Just think, the race itself is over 20 miles, running 60 miles a week is typical for a 5k runner, now think that a marathon is over 7 times that distance. There are different methods to train for a marathon, as some run 120 miles a week, while some might run 70 miles a week along with up tempo 800s, but there is not a single person doing actual marathon training that isnt running 50+ miles. It would guarantee failure. And distance running is a bit different than lifting in many ways so unless you actually know specific information about running, you are talkin out of your ass [/quote]
Well, I’m naturally a pretty good distance runner (sub-5 minutes a few years ago) and I’m friends with and use to run consistently with a D1 collegiate distance runner who is fighting for an Olympic spot.
And I have to ask do you know a lot about running? Because I don’t know why you think 60 miles a week is required for a 5k. To be shooting for a respectable time in a 5k, I think that would only be required for some one who is quite out of shape.
[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Well, I’m naturally a pretty good distance runner (sub-5 minutes a few years ago) and I’m friends with and use to run consistently with a D1 collegiate distance runner who is fighting for an Olympic spot.
And I have to ask do you know a lot about running? Because I don’t know why you think 60 miles a week is required for a 5k. To be shooting for a respectable time in a 5k, I think that would only be required for some one who is quite out of shape. [/quote]
I ran cross country in high school, a very long time ago, and I remember running about 21 miles a week for practice. If I remember correctly, we ran 5 miles on MWF and 3 miles on T, Th. Even with running on our own, I don’t think even our fastest guys ran anywhere near 60 miles a week. That was just in my experience, though.
not to offend anyone, but the advice given on any runnning subject on this forum over the years is pretty bad… guys run a half marathon or marathon on just a handful miles a week training seem to know it all. guys all of a sudden want to be a runner and start their first workout sprinting… terrible terrible advice given and very bad training advice on most posts…there is one guy that coaches elite runners. he knows his stuff…other than him, consult a running web site.this web site is big lifters and arnold wanna be’s giving running advice…nice they give advice, but 99% of the time, its the wrong advice…i’m nobody, a former 4:03 miler, who knows a little about training for running…enough to know most these running posts are bad!!!this stuff i read is horrible… 15 miles a week training for a half marathon… wtf!! you’re walking it basically… just surviving barley… 9-10 - 11 minute miles… getting in the way of actual runners… wanna be good at running, run… run a lot, and consult a running web page…
Yeah, but you’ve always been a bit of a jerk in this forum anyway. Usually snide and rude. Any search could show that.
You do know this is T N ation right? Many of us run (or jog and get in the way by your standards) to try something different and we’re not focusedon running.
[quote]spk wrote:
not to offend anyone, but the advice given on any runnning subject on this forum over the years is pretty bad… guys run a half marathon or marathon on just a handful miles a week training seem to know it all. guys all of a sudden want to be a runner and start their first workout sprinting… terrible terrible advice given and very bad training advice on most posts…there is one guy that coaches elite runners. he knows his stuff…other than him, consult a running web site.this web site is big lifters and arnold wanna be’s giving running advice…nice they give advice, but 99% of the time, its the wrong advice…i’m nobody, a former 4:03 miler, who knows a little about training for running…enough to know most these running posts are bad!!!this stuff i read is horrible… 15 miles a week training for a half marathon… wtf!! you’re walking it basically… just surviving barley… 9-10 - 11 minute miles… getting in the way of actual runners… wanna be good at running, run… run a lot, and consult a running web page…[/quote]
Before I write this, I’m in no way disagreeing with the bulk of your post. Yes, this is the last place I would go to get advice in running. When I first took up running I consulted running sites, found a program that fit my goals, and followed the advice there. However, many people here, the OP of this post in particular, are looking to run without losing weight. Reading his post, I assumed completion of a marathon without embarrassing himself in the process is what I interpreted as his goal. If my primary goal were to run a marathon without losing my self respect or a bunch of muscle, this is the place I would go.
Obviously lower mileage and lifting are not conducive to great running performance, but that is a compromise that a lot of people have to make. When I was in college, I put in my 70-100 mile weeks all the time, and that is how I qualified for Boston and completed 5 ultras, including one 100 miler. I did it all without losing weight, whereas my running buddy lost a ton of weight, and was also a ton faster than me. A lot of long slow distance is obviously a necessary part of a program if you want to be a genuinely good runner, but it’s something many people here can’t or won’t do.
So yes, a lot of advice here is terrible. My statement that 30 miles a week can get you a marathon is true, but it wouldn’t be pretty by any means and may also be horrible advice, so mea culpa. But I hope you have some understanding of where these posts are coming from. Nobody here is chasing a 4 minute mile or a 2:30 marathon. The goal for most is to do a race and to not lose muscle in the training process, so while I guarantee you have a lot of valuable advice regarding running, I haven’t seen it translated over to help meet the goals of the average T-Nation poster.
nards… thats the way you take my posts… fine…
bigquig… i have given advice, not that i’m a coach, but no one listens… 240# guy running a half or a marathon… stick to the 5k…gave a few pointers over the years but most dont listen…
currently, i’m a low pro cyclist, and trying to give advice on that sport is the same. people want to get into cycling, and start hammering right away… not building up cycling musclels first…
lots of people ask for advice, but in the back of their mind, are going to do what they want anyway…most not taking advice…when i stopped running and took up cycling, i asked the best coaches, riders and old bike shop owners that use to race tons of training questions,and just soaked up their knowledge…
If you don’t know how you sounded then you should ask some specialists in social skills and get only the best advice from them before you start speaking to people without doing the proper research first.