T Nation

Mag-10 and carbs


Should I stay away from high carb fruits and stick with things like potatoes, beets, squash, etc. for my carbs?

Also, I believe the recommendation was at least 500g of carbs while on Mag-10, but I'm assuming this is for the average guy. I've been fat for a while, although I've slimmed down a lot. Does this mean I gain fat easily? I had a brief gaining cycle and I didn't seem to put on tons of fat. Is it possible that despite not gaining fat easily, I was overwight just because my eating and activity habits were just piss-poor when I was younger? Weight isn't a big issue on either side of my family. So considering this, should I have my carb intake around 500g? Or is this not enough info to tell?



Ok, I hate to do this, but...



I know nothing about Mag-10. I don't care to learn because I can't take it anyway. However, I have some advice for you, and please take it to heart.

I have been on T-mag for years, I have seen tons of new people show up, get flamed to death and disappear. You don't seem to be leaving, so at least you have some tenacity. That said, you really have to start doing research before you ask question after question about things that are covered in product literature and in article after article.

I am 100% sure I could answer your question by taking 30 minutes and looking through articles, posts, and product documentation. I'm not going to do that. If you are ready to take Mag-10 you are ready to do your own research.

Please do so, because the more posts you put up that are easily answered by research the less information you will get from anyone. Much like the boy who cried wolf, eventually your questions will be ignored because people just figure you want them to do your research for you.

This is not a flame, it was not snotty, and it was not mean spirited.

Much like the new lifter who after six months of lifting wants to know what type of steriod cycle he should use - you need to lift, eat and read a LOT more before you undertake what you are planning.

You keep saying you 'have your reasons' for doing Mag-10, but I have noticed you are carefully keeping those reasons to yourself. You have asked for advice repeatedly but when you don't like the answers you get you ignore them.

T-mag can be a great resource, but most of the people here are no-nonsence and will quickly tire of helping you if you persist in this.

Unfortunatly, I have a feeling I am not the first person to tell you this.

stepping down off of soap box


You bumped after about 3 hours. You said you don't even have the Mag-10 yet. Don't you think it's time to chill a little?


I hate to do this too but...Are you totally off your rocker?


Just getting a kick out of seeing everyone blast you but you are asking for it. Stop posting and start reading and studying.

Who wants to take a shot?...gloves off


Who cares about the carbs? Eat a pound of butter per day. Problem solved.


Dan's right, a pound of butter post workout is key.
Or, you could split it up half before and half after if eating it all at once makes you feel a little bloated.

Also, as Dan mentioned in a previous post, bees are truly nature candy. Try a whole hive of killer bees as your second PWO meal. It will provide you with massive lbm gains over time, although it might leave you a little bloated


Actually, I find that eating all my butter "Warrior Style" does the best for me. I lump all of my calories together in a massive meal, right before I go to sleep.

Since all the muscle rebuilding happens while I sleep, I have plenty of fuel and protein for that to happen.


Neil, I'm going to try to break things down a bit:

(1) You're carrying too much fat to bulk. (But you're so psyched about being muscled that you want to bulk anyway and hope that Mag-10 can save you from the negative consequences.)
(2) You're 18, so going on a diet may not be the best idea. You're still growing, probably.

Your solution is to do a high volume routine 4 days per week that burns a lot of calories during training (like EDT or OVT), HIIT, and eat about 200-250 calories above maintanance on most days. You'll be gaining muscle and losing fat at the same time, if you're food sources are right. Make carbs 40-50% of your diet, protein 30% and fat 20-30% (about 1/3 your favorite, saturated). Try to separate fats and carbs.

Not as fun as bulking up, but that's the breaks, kid. You can bulk up when you hit 10%.

You won't need Mag-10 for this, but you may want to use it. The most productive route is probably to try it without Mag-10 for 2 months, then use Mag-10. Do this and you'll look a hell of a lot better on this board and win people's respect for your hard work, ego submission and maturity.


How about soaking in a bathtub of melted butter, Dan?

Would that help with the body's absorbtion?

Color me curious....


You have to remember that there is a time for muscle gain and there is a time for fat loss.
Trying to do both at the same time by cutting out the carbs during a lifting phase will only result in a half assed attempt at either gaining or losing weight*.

*Unless you are somebody like Machine who has figured out how to do both at the same time.

From what I have read on this forum in past threads, it seems that the second most important facet to gaining with Mag10 is to strictly follow the dietary rules. Remember, on Mag10 you can excericise 6 times a week, obviously you are going to need a lot of fuel from carbs.

So biet the bullion and carb up. When you're done just do EDT and Running Man to lose whatever extra fat you may have taken in.

I haven't taken mag10 but have tried other supplements and know that if you don't follow the directions on the lable you might as well not use it.

If you want to know more about how to diet for muscle mass read Massive Eating or Chanko in the FAQ.

I hope this helps...really, I do.


Michelle said, "This is not a flame, it was not snotty, and it was not mean spirited"

Well, this is a flame, I'm snotty, and I just feel a little mean spirited right now.

I'm not normally one to repost, but dammit, this just seemed to go with the flow in this thread, too.

Neil - "Hi everyone! I'm young and inexperienced and don't know a hell of a lot, and since it looks like there are tons of knowledgeable people here, can you give me some advice?

T-Forum - "Sure, Neil, what would you like to know?"

Neil - "Well, actually, it's not that I want to know or learn anything, I just want you to reaffirm my naive and ignorant views on training and nutrition."

T-Forum - "Well, Neil, that's really not the best approach. Here, let us tap our vast collective experience and see if we can encourage and help you in your training endeavors."

Neil (now enraged) - "What?! You want me to listen to someone who knows more than I, and not stroke my over-inflated ego by pacifying me like a little baby?!"

(gradually regains composure) ahem So, is anyone willing to reaffirm my naive and ignorant views on training and nutrition? Please?"

T-Forum - "Um, no. Goodbye, Neil."


ya, especially when you do your workouts in the morning Dan.
..That way you have plenty of fuel and you're ready to go.



That's an intriguing question. The subcutaneous accumulation/absorbtion of butter has rarely been studied, and when it has been studied, the researchers have been unfairly biased against saturated fats. HOWEVER! Anecdotally, I have found that soaking in a tub of melted butter (aka Ghee) increases recovery by approximately 152%. Hope this helps.

PS: One addition that might make a difference is whole, uncooked eggs. If you add these, expect that the egg protein will be absorbed faster than any other method.

PPS: Make sure to only bathe in this mixture past midnight. Otherwise, you will not maximize your hormonal balances.


Look at Machines plan, he didn't even do them both at the same time. He did micro-cycles- something Bill Roberts suggested to me a long time ago. I finished OVT two weeks ago and planned on a 4 week cut before bulking again to loose the fat I gained while eating big on OVT. I didn't have to do 4 weeks and 2 weeks was plenty. Dropped those 3 lbs fat in a snap! I'm beginning to think that regular cuts shouldn't last longer than 1-2 weeks while bulking should be 8 or even 12 weeks long. NeilG- you need to take it as Bill Roberts suggests. It's going to take a week before it even begins to really start doing its work and you have one week of saturation. You need to do some reading up on prohormones and steroids. You could even go to the steroid forums and get some suggetions. But if you ask newbie questions there those guys will really rip you a new one.


Ok, how about this guys?

Instead of two months of straight gaining starting 2.5 weeks from now, I will continue to lose fat for the next 5.5 weeks. This way I should definitely be lean enough for when I start the gaining cycle, and I should still meet my goal deadline.

How's this sound?


Dan and Patricia, if I could interject with a comment.

Butter and raw eggs that have not been organically grown in the fields of Brussels and not been blessed by 27 celestial woods fairies (dressed in sprouted panties) will horribly effect the phytochemical balance in your chi.

Please, bathe safe.



Neil - read Machine's essay in the hot-rox thread. It's based on micro-cycles, as previously stated.

Since you were fat, you still have those cells waiting to eat. You're going to have to seriously watch what you eat while bulking.

Take mag-10 as prescribed, no other way.

If you want a longer cycle, do 4-ad-ec, followed by hot-rox and tribex and methoxy and M.


only if you eat enough butter and bees post workout NeilG


NeilG-In John Berardi's fat loss version of Massive Eating he brought up the exact same point--it is better to cut before gaining than the parallax way.
So yes that was a good idea you just had, but then again it's much faster if you look around ror in answers in the FAQ and use the search (And what the hell do I know, maybe you do) instead posting questions of that type on the form you're just gonna get flamed.