[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
Rows. keep your elbows in tight, focus on pulling with the elbows, not your hands, and pull to your waist. [/quote]
This with your scapula depressed the whole time[/quote]
Why? Not disagreeing, just not following how that would affect lat recruitment.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
Rows. keep your elbows in tight, focus on pulling with the elbows, not your hands, and pull to your waist. [/quote]
This with your scapula depressed the whole time[/quote]
Why? Not disagreeing, just not following how that would affect lat recruitment.[/quote]
Focusing in which muscle and part you want contracted. Try it and see where you feel it with scapular depression neutral and elevated. It completely changes the recruitment pattern if you have a good Mmc top to bottom
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
Rows. keep your elbows in tight, focus on pulling with the elbows, not your hands, and pull to your waist. [/quote]
This with your scapula depressed the whole time[/quote]
Why? Not disagreeing, just not following how that would affect lat recruitment.[/quote]
If you let the scapula move, then the lower traps can contract and contribute to the concentric part of the lift. For a while I did barbell rows wrong and mostly got lower trap growth out of it. But, keep your low traps locked down and they never contribute to the lift, they just stabilize so the lats have to do all the work
Try pull-ups with a ROM from a dead-hang to the bar touching below the nipple line.
Thanks. I hadn’t really experimented with elevated vs neutral vs depressed myself.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
Thanks. I hadn’t really experimented with elevated vs neutral vs depressed myself.[/quote]
No problem. Another tweaks with those are also the amount of lean. Either forward or backward or straight up.
As far as I know you can’t target any particular aspect of the lats.
The best lat exercise in existence is the Nautilus pullover machine. If you don’t have access to one, the next best thing I know of is to do isometric hangs from elbow sleeves.
In terms of compound exercise, prone grip pulldowns/pull-ups.
Didnt read thread
Do any rowing movemint pulling from the pinkies. It will feel awesome and way different. have faith
Get better (stronger on weighted, more reps on bodyweight) at pull-ups. Also, get strong with a free-weight row you can use a lot of weight on while getting a good lat stretch (dumbbell, barbell, T-bar, etc). If you get a lot stronger at rows and pull-ups chancer are your “lower” lats will grow.
EDIT: before you go all-in on these two movements, really practice them and learn how to pull with your lats and use as little bis as possible. once you feel you are really using your lats to move the weight start adding weight and getting stronger at the movements.
[quote]belligerent wrote:
As far as I know you can’t target any particular aspect of the lats.
The best lat exercise in existence is the Nautilus pullover machine. If you don’t have access to one, the next best thing I know of is to do isometric hangs from elbow sleeves.
In terms of compound exercise, prone grip pulldowns/pull-ups. [/quote]
I’d have to disagree, there is no machine movement more effective than neutral or reverse grip chin-ups, especially weighted.
The idea regarding elbow sleeves is interesting though.
That John Meadows Low Row is the job.
However if you are having trouble feeling the lats work esp. the lower portion try KAYAK ROWS they’re fucking great! Do them before your main lat movement like JM Rows and see how you feel…
I alternate right to left where John is focusing on one side here. Use a light weight to begin with and try to squeeze the lats hard at the terminal point of the movement. Squeeze your arse, quads and abs hard to maintain stability, increasing the bite of the contraction at the end.
[quote]belligerent wrote:
As far as I know you can’t target any particular aspect of the lats.
[/quote]
The lats are responsible for extension, adduction, transverse extension, flexion from an extended position, and (medial) internal rotation of the shoulder joint. It also has a synergistic role in extension and lateral flexion of the lumbar spine, and assists as a muscle of both forced expiration (anterior fibers) and an accessory muscles of inspiration (posterior fibers).
So in respect to the above, a portion of the muscle can be stimulated more using a distinct movement pattern, then overloaded to induce hypertrophy, targeting those fibres that are exposed by the stresses of that movement.
Also, when considering the origins of the lats it would indicate areas of muscle that can be independently coordinated by differing exercises. Why else would you have such a broad muscle covering much of the back if not to have a variety of functions other than contracting in the same fashion each and every time you recruited it?
Origin: Spinous processes of T7 - L5 vertebrae. Iliac crest of sacrum.Thoracolumbar fascia. Inferior angle of the scapula. Lower three or four ribs.
Insertion: Floor of intertubercular (bicipital) groove of humerus.
For me the best movement for targeting my lower lats is rows on this type of chest supported seated row using 1 arm at a time. You can realy get your elbow back and squeeze and really feel it in the lower lat area. I normally do pullups first to warm up then 4 sets of 10 each side on these. My lower lats have grown since using them.
Ok, admiteddly I only skimmed a lot of this thread, but in my own experience, I was able to dramatically improve my lats from my '09 to '10 contest seasons by doing one thing.
As much as I loved doing real pullups and chinups, I found that even with abbreviated ROMs, my arms and midback were just too dominant. Going back to a seated lat pulldown, with a few conscious pieces of focus made all the difference:
1- Sit upright. any lean will shift stress more to your midback.
2- Keep your elbows in front of your torso. This matters much more than grip style IMO
3- Stop the movement when your hands are in front of your face. Anything lower than that doesn’t really contribute to your goals, and actually takes the direct stress OFF of the lats!
4- Certain hand positions (reverse grip or parallel/neutral grip) will be more effective in keeping your elbows in the needed groove.
S
Try 5-7 second negatives for your single arm rows, rows, and lat pulldowns! I did this last workout after reading an article on getting a better back workout and it REALLY seemed to help.
[quote]zraw wrote:
Didnt read thread
Do any rowing movemint pulling from the pinkies. It will feel awesome and way different. have faith[/quote]
I cant picture this.
[quote]coyotegal wrote:
[quote]zraw wrote:
Didnt read thread
Do any rowing movemint pulling from the pinkies. It will feel awesome and way different. have faith[/quote]
I cant picture this.[/quote]
experiment on cable rows and pulldowns. Its another cue to help pull through the elbow and use your hands as hooks
Here is a mental check list ive been going through when doing rows
-Tension in the elbows, not in the hands/wrists
-Arch Back
-Move weight with elbows
-Push scapula down
[quote]SLAINGE wrote:
[quote]belligerent wrote:
As far as I know you can’t target any particular aspect of the lats.
[/quote]
The lats are responsible for extension, adduction, transverse extension, flexion from an extended position, and (medial) internal rotation of the shoulder joint. It also has a synergistic role in extension and lateral flexion of the lumbar spine, and assists as a muscle of both forced expiration (anterior fibers) and an accessory muscles of inspiration (posterior fibers).
So in respect to the above, a portion of the muscle can be stimulated more using a distinct movement pattern, then overloaded to induce hypertrophy, targeting those fibres that are exposed by the stresses of that movement.
Also, when considering the origins of the lats it would indicate areas of muscle that can be independently coordinated by differing exercises. Why else would you have such a broad muscle covering much of the back if not to have a variety of functions other than contracting in the same fashion each and every time you recruited it?
Origin: Spinous processes of T7 - L5 vertebrae. Iliac crest of sacrum.Thoracolumbar fascia. Inferior angle of the scapula. Lower three or four ribs.
Insertion: Floor of intertubercular (bicipital) groove of humerus.
[/quote]
I think a lot of people confuse the teres major with these so called “upper lats” and think that there must be lower lats. But the “lower lats” are really just the lats
[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:
[quote]coyotegal wrote:
[quote]zraw wrote:
Didnt read thread
Do any rowing movemint pulling from the pinkies. It will feel awesome and way different. have faith[/quote]
I cant picture this.[/quote]
experiment on cable rows and pulldowns. Its another cue to help pull through the elbow and use your hands as hooks[/quote]
ah yes, Ok I get that 
Thanks!
