Low Test After Diet and Overtraining

With what you say about changes in DNA expression you mean that I could try to wait longer and this is reversible ?
One endo said to me, that I should only wait and everything will be normal again. Another one said that my low T is not caused by the diet.

I want to try everything before I start TRT. I read some posts were people said that tamoxifen works better than clomid. Do you know any success storys from people in my current situation or a similar who tried Tamox or Clomid, the therapy was successful and Test levels didn’t sink after they stopped the therapy ?

I will read this sticky today. Thank you for your help

With what you say about changes in DNA expression you mean that I could try to wait longer and this is reversible ?
One endo said to me, that I should only wait and everything will be normal again. Another one said that my low T is probably not caused by the diet.

KSman I found that great post from you on my search for HPTA restart:

My plan is:
Today I will go to my doc and get my T levels checked again.

  1. If they should be over 400 ng/ml I will wait and hope that my body can recover on itself.
  2. If they should be lower than 400 ng/ml I will try your HPTA restart protocol.

My pituitary sent out LH/FSH during the GNRH test. Does that means that SERMs like Nolvadex work for me ?

I think my testicles have normal size. I don’t see a big difference to the time before the Low T problems and my doc measured them and said they have normal size. Do I also need hcG ?

Thank you very much for your help. You give me so much hope and thats the most important aspect for me.

Joe

Joe, listen to your doctor and follow the protocol that plenty of others have after overtraining and overdieting to regain their levels.

  1. Now that you are back to your pre-diet level, eat at maintenance - no need to get fatter
  2. Keep a training regimen (don’t overdo the cardio, emphasize weight training but do not OVERTRAIN)
  3. No “mini-cuts” allowed, just remain at your current 15% weight (again, no need to get fatter)
  4. Minimize your stress . How? Give yourself five months and follow the above, lay off of the net researching this stuff for that time period (you are driving yourself crazy), stop checking your T level every 3 weeks, stop checking your “ejaculate volume” three times a day (lay off for a bit, will ya?).

After 5 months of doing this, check your levels again (if they are increasing) consider extending and if they are not, consider the alternatives you are now.

There is plenty of time for you to jump into a lifetime of TRT treatment. Now is the time to do the above, but your stress is sabotaging your recovery.

Last post from me on this thread.

Wish you the best, Joe.

My pituitary sent out LH/FSH during the GNRH test. Does that means that SERMs like Nolvadex work for me ?

-yes, Nolvadex and Clomid have similar actions and similar dosing. However, Clomid causes nasty side effects for some guys, so Nolvadex is preferred by me. However, there is strong literature bias and many doctors cling to Clomid and do not understand the issue with side effects for some males because this is not in the “literature”.

Do exhaust the non-TRT options first.

SixString your replies always help me to calm down and see things how they really are.
This week I thought I will get crazy. I read so much about HPTA Restart, TRT etc.
I went to my doc again at wednesday and today I got my test levels. Its at 3,4 ng/ml (3,3-8,10 ng/ml).
1 month ago same lab was 2,95 ng/ml. 7 month ago same lab it was 1,5 ng/ml.

I would say levels are definitely increasing but so slow and I don’t feel any difference.
TRT is no option for me anymore.
I will follow your protocol. It is really good and Im sure that my extreme research on TRT, Overtraining, Overdieting etc. is driving me crazy and sabotaging my recovery.

One last thing is killing me. I found a lot of guys who were successful with the HPTA restart using Tamoxifen/Nolvadex.
Should I try Nolvadex too ? I think i don’t need a “Restart” because test levels are increasing. Slowly, but they do.
Maybe then my t levels will rise to 600-700 I stop Nolvadex and they stay there and I can skip the next horrible 5 months.
Im sure my body will recover itself without any meds but when it could get faster I would be so happy. I hate my life so much because of the low t levels :frowning:
I hope you understand me and say me what to do.

Joe

That is fantastic news, Joe!

It’s great to see those numbers slowly creep up!

Just because the increase has been slow early on doesn’t mean it will continue to be this slow. Your body will react individually and you can’t compare yourself to others. You, for example, may hit 3.5 and all of a sudden your body much more quickly starts moving up after it decides that it is the proper time. No one knows, so stop worrying over it. All you can do is do your best to provide your body the best environment to recover: 1. maintenance nutrition 2. activity emphasizing weights (anabolic) and minimizing cardio (catabolic) 3. Reduced stress 4. Lay off the net, constant level checking and ejaculate thing for a bit (it leads to anxiety and more stress)

I am sorry, but I cannot advise you on your Tamoxifen/Nolvadex question. I will let others with greater knowledge, such as KSman, provide you their opinions on that. Many doctors are quick to prescribe drugs and to keep you coming back to them for help (they make money that way, after all). The endo that recommended for you not to take drugs and to try a natural path may also serve to give you an honest opinion on that question.

All I can tell you is that if you were my son and I saw that your levels were rising naturally, I would ask you for a bit more patience and to be a bit kinder to yourself. This is all a learning experience and you are recovering.

Whatever your course of action, I encourage you to eventually update your condition on this thread if you do get better naturally (if that is what you choose to do), so that other young men that may come to this board in similar, desperate circumstances can learn from your experience. I would also like to know how things eventually end up with you. Best.

You are so right. I should be happy with the current situation. Maybe my test levels don’t increase as fast as I wish, but they do.
Thats a fact ! Im in the reference range again and all docs I have seen in the last 7 months are very happy with that.

Now I know that I don’t have a tumor or any other organic problem and my test levels are a result of undereating and overtraining.

I will wait for KSman opinion on the Nolvadex question.

I will see things more positive from now on. This is the hardest time of my life. I have never felt that bad. But I will recover, no matter how many months this will take. And then I will appreciate all things and activities in my life which were self-evident before.
I will appreciate every erection and my libido. My muscles and to workout and of course Sex and to love.

I will update my condition and I hope that I can help many young men in similar circumstances.
Best.

any updates?

5 months after my last test I got my new testosterone measurements today.
My testosterone is still pretty low: 3,6ng/ml
Im not feeling much better and I still don’t have my sex drive back and I still can’t gain muscles.
I don’t think that my low test is due to the diet. That doesn’t make sense. 1 year after the diet I still have very low testosterone and its not getting better (last measurement Dec. 2014: 3,6 ng/ml)

I will start TRT as soon as possible.

Not sure if this helps or hurts but I went on an extreme diet 3 years ago and my t levels are still shot after eating at maintenance for 2 years. Not saying it is that but that is the only thing I can see that has changed in my life to lower my t levels