T Nation

Low T Symptoms After Training, Increase Dose

I have the same suspicion that exercise eats up T.

Are you by any chance a “low SHBG” person (low = less than 20 nmol/L)?

I do daily subQ of about 20mg. But for 2 days after weight training, I need to inject 30-40mg to compensate. Otherwise, I feel low T symptoms (brain fog, tiredness & no interest in work etc) immediately.

Appreciate your response.

That’s not how it works. Your levels more than likely aren’t high enough.

Yes it’s at 12 last time I checked. I take oral capsules (Jatenzo) twice daily.

SQ isn’t going to be optimal for everyone, I think SQ is overrated. I didn’t do well on SQ at all, T dropped and E2 climbed.

Thanks for the answers @systemlord … sharing some my past experiences here in the interest of finding some answers / protocols that worked for ppl like me.

6ft, 210pounds, 40yrs.

Starting params before TRT:
TT: 145 ng/dL
E2: 26 pg/mL
SHBG: 19 nmol/L
FT: didn’t do it at this time.
IGF1: 131 ng/ml
LH: 4.1 mIU/ml
TSH: 1.41 μIU/ml, Free T4: 15.4 pmol/L
Symptoms (for about 5 yrs): mild depression, no interest in work, lack of Libido.
I tried weight training - 1hr training = 4 days of soreness and at-least 3 days of outright not being able to get out of bed or go to work.
Fired from 2 jobs for not taking initiative etc.

Started TRT in 2019.

Protocol 1: Androgel for 3 months.
Massive energy and mood swings. Massive water retention. Felt worse than non-trt.

Protocol 2: Nebido 1000mg IM shots once in 2 months.
Massive mood and energy swings. By 4th week felt Low T symptoms. Discontinued after 6 months and 3 shots.

Protocol 3: Combo of T.Enanthate 110mg + T.Propionate 25mg
Started with IM shots every 5 days (135mg). + 0.5mg AI EOD. Worked much better than above 2 protocols.
Titrated, settled on 15-18mg daily subQ injections + 1mg AI (Arimidex) EOD. >> got best results in this protocol. (TT: 800 to 1000, E2: 10 - 20,SHBG: < 20 … I do labs almost every 4 to 6 weeks.).

BUT whenever I did weight training or cross fit, I was sore for 3 days and low T mood & energy for 2 days. This was like clock work. If I injected additional 15mg for 2 days after weight training, then low T and soreness were MUCH MUCH lower.

Protocol 4: T.Cyp 1+ yr (moved to a diff country and above med was not available)
T.Cyp started at 150mg weekly + 1 AI EOD = bloated and not good results.
Titrated & moved to 20mg daily subQ + 1mg AI EOD. Kind of reached a mood + energy plateau that was ok but not as good as protocol 3. (TT: 800 to 1400, E2: 10 - 20, SHBG: < 20).

Same observations wrt to weight training. On night of training day & next day, inject 15mg more to feel normal. If not soreness and low T mood & energy symptoms.

Protocol 5: T.Cyp+T.prop (80% 20% combo)
20mg SubQ + 0.75AI EoD. (TT: 800 to 1000, E2: 10 - 20, SHBG: < 20).
Feeling better than protocol 4 & equal to protocol 3.
Same observations wrt to weight training - inject 20mg more on day & next to reduce low T mood & energy.

Narrowed E2 build up, Tprop affinity, daily small injections etc to low SHBG (forum reads & consulted with Defy medical docs too).
So my observations:
Ai - must have about 1mg EoD. Without that bloat like a baloon.
Tprop seems to help better than long acting esters like Cyp.
SubQ daily injections = way better than EoD or weekly.
Weight training = inject 15-20mg more for 2 days to get relief.

Puzzle = Why do I need extra T injections when weight training. Am I excreting a lot or some other physiological processes that I don’t know?

You need to give IM a try.

Also every time you break consistency in your protocol, your hormone levels become unstable, so if you are injecting 20mg and inject 15 more just to feel good, this means your hormone levels leave the steady state. The benefit you get by injecting 15mg more when you normally inject 20mg is going to be short-lived.

Every time I change my dosage I experience benefits on and off for about 5-6 weeks, I’ll feel energy levels vary greatly, one minute I have tons of energy, then all of a sudden it feels like my body slammed on the brakes, I’ll feel mentally well that seems to come and go.

Once levels are at a stable state, I get a full time benefit.

Choose a dosage and stick with it.

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Thanks @systemlord … will try IM soon.

Curious - in non-TRT folks, is strength training not supposed to increase T production? If so, would a person on TRT not need to compensate by adding a bit more on strength training days? Your thoughts?

No, because you have shut down your natural production by being on TRT. Typically LH is 0.2 on TRT and will take decades for the HPTA to become completely shutdown LH = 0.

You can’t do this for reasons already explained to you. T-cypionate 7-8 day half-life, steady state in 4-6 weeks if you don’t alter your dosage.

I’d like to see something showing this. I’d imagine the increase is small and short lived.

However on TRT not of that natural process matters