Low T Problem - Full Lab Info Provided

Pharma / TRT Testosterone Replacement
41

Ok, my calcium levels were right in the middle of the reference range during the last blood test so I’m guessing it is due to the increase in Vitamin D. I’ll have a retest in a couple of months.

On a side note: one major cause for concern for me personally regarding iodine supplementation is the fact that the main proponent of mg doses of iodine, Dr Abraham, is a Young Earth Creationist. I’m having trouble believing the scientific value of someone who thinks the Earth is 6000 years old and who uses the Bible as a source for explaining why the human body needs iodine. Quoted from Optimox.com:

“Such high requirements for I in an environment depleted of this element, do not have a logical explanation. Unless sometimes in the distant past, the top soil of planet earth contains significant levels of I and meeting these high requirements for I sufficiency could then be achieved with any diet. The theory of evolution does not offer an intellectually satisfying answer to this paradox. However, the Biblical account of the origin of the world through creation 6000 years ago followed by the fall of man and the flood fits very well the current situation. According to the biblical narrative, the Creator declared planet earth and everything in it perfect. Therefore, the original planet earth contained a top soil rich in I, and all elements required for perfect health of Adam, Eve and their descendants. A rebelled archangel was expelled from Godâ??s Habitation for attempting a hostile takeover (Isaiah 14:12-15). His name was Lucifer before the attempt (Isaiah 14:12) and Satan after his expulsion (Luke 10:18). Satan deceived Eve into believing that she could become a goddess by disobeying her Creator (Genesis 3:4,5). A sequence of events followed, culminating in the worldwide flood 4500 years ago. Following this episode, the receding waters washed away the top soil with all its elements into oceans and seas. The new top soil became deficient in I and most likely other essential elements, whose essentialities are still unknown. Mountainous areas became the most I-deficient because the receding waters were the most rapid over the steep slopes, eroding deeper into the soil. The post-deluvian worldwide I deficiency may be a reminder to mankind of the flood, their fallen state and their need for a Redeemer.”

42

you can find quacks on the internet that will say anything and believe anything. I have never heard of this guy before I started on Iodine.

I am sure I can find some loon out there who believes aliens inhabited the earth before us and that we are contaminated with their dna, AND he also is a proponent of using casts to help fix broken bones. So just because he is loon, are you going to rethink the need for using casts to help set a broken bone?

43

[quote]PureChance wrote:
you can find quacks on the internet that will say anything and believe anything. I have never heard of this guy before I started on Iodine.

I am sure I can find some loon out there who believes aliens inhabited the earth before us and that we are contaminated with their dna, AND he also is a proponent of using casts to help fix broken bones. So just because he is loon, are you going to rethink the need for using casts to help set a broken bone?
[/quote]
I see your point, but in this case, Dr Abraham’s research seems to be the basis for a lot of other doctors, such as Brownstein, Flechas etc who promote the use of mg doses of iodine. Dr Abraham’s website, www.optimox.com, contains extensive publications on iodine supplementation which all seem well-researched. I’ve read almost all of them and thought everything looked great until I got to the epilogue of one of his studies "Orthoiodosupplementation: Iodine Sufficiency Of The Whole Human Body " where he starts talking about the Garden of Eden which had a top soil rich in iodine, which was subsequently washed away by floods 4500 years ago etc.

I’m just saying it’s hard to believe their research behind iodine supplementation given the above, which is a real shame as their results look very promising.

44

f

45

ok, then simply ignore their results and find the countless other sites that recommend iodine and that have no connection with this guy or people’s personal stories. this was the first that popped up for me:

lef.org/magazine/mag2010/mar2010_Dont-Fall-Victim-to-Frailty_01.htm
no reference to Abraham that I can find.

46

Excellent, thanks! Feels good to read about the benefits of mg supplementation of iodine from sources other than Abraham. Iodine-induced autoimmune thyroiditis is my main concern but I feel more comfortable about that now as multiple independent sources seem to point to the opposite.

47

Update 10th May: I got the results from a semen analysis. Things don’t look good at all:

Volume: 3.4 mL (1.5-6.0)
Concentration: 11 million/mL
Total count: 37 million (> 40)
Motility:
-rapid: 1%
-slow: 17%
-non-progressive: 2%
-immotility: 80%

As one can se, immotility is 80% which is terrible. My doctor has now offered me TRT but I still can’t find anyone who will actually try to find the root cause of all this. I feel it’s crazy to put a 25 year old on TRT without investigating further. Could my thyroid issues be the root cause, is it really that simple? I know I also have low cortisol (adrenal fatigue?) but I really don’t know what to do since no doctor even recognizes that it’s low.

48

chances are that it is not that simple. when one system goes it does seem to take down several others though along the way, and the only way to get fully back on your feet is to fix all of them.

most docs don’t care what the actual cause is. The quick fix, write an easy script, and get the next patient in the door is the best most can offer.

49

If I remember correctly, you suffer/suffered from adrenal fatigue, right? Did you have low cortisol? If so, have you been able to fix that somehow?

50

yes, I have that, and no it’s not fixed yet.

I was taking
6am - 7.5mg
10am - 5mg
2pm - 5mg
6pm - 2.5mg
and I still had a blood test showing cortisol at 10.6 ug/dL which is lower then my last test.

I then increased up to:
6am - 10mg
10am - 10mg
2pm - 5mg
6pm - 2.5mg
10pm - 2.5mg

but I learned/remembered that If I take more than 5mg at any given time it suppresses my system and I crash between doses, and I really don’t want to dose more frequently, and more than 10mg gives me a huge headache so I changed, and I currently follow this schedule and am doing ok.
6am - 5mg
10am - 5mg
2pm - 5mg
6pm - 5mg
10pm - 5mg

I am still trying to get my estradiol under control. If I can get my cortisol levels up, I think it would help lower my estradiol, but for now I am trying out low doses of Arimidex.

51

Ok, thanks for the info. Were you taking hydrocortisone in the table above?

52

the table above? do you mean the dosing schedule I posted earlier today? if so, then yes. That was my table showing my dosing schedule for Hydrocortisone.

53

Yes, I was unsure of what you were referring to in the dosing schedule.

Anyway, I’m going to continue with all the supplements previously mentioned. In the meantime, are there any other tests you would recommend or any other issues I should investigate?

54

What I’m seeing is this:

Early March TSH: 1.4
Then, beginning of iodine supplementation
Mid March TSH: 2.3
then, increase in iodine supplementation with Lugol
May TSH: 3.41

I think you need to investigate whether or not your iodine supplementation is necessary. Iodine deficient hypothyroidism is very rare in the developed world. Frankly, I suffer from subclinical hypothyroidism and my goal is to get my TSH down to the level you started with.

Subclinical hypothyroidism, as defined by the AACE is TSH > 5, T3 and T4 within range, and presence of goiter. Without presence of a goiter they look for TSH > 10. With treatment, the goal is to get TSH below 3 with many people feeling optimal with TSH between 1 and 2. This was your starting point…

I’ll leave you with some information I posted in another thread:

In a New England Journal study, researchers, led by Dr. Weiping Teng, of China Medical University in Shenyang, looked at the thyroid effects of giving supplemental iodine to three separate groups: people who were mildly iodine-deficient, those with adequate iodine intake, and those with excessive iodine intake. They found that giving iodine to people who had adequate or excessive iodine intake could lead to hypothyroidism autoimmune thyroiditis.

They also found that the key risk factors for new subclinical hypothyroidism in people who started with normal thyroid function included:

TSH level greater than 2
High antithyroid antibody levels
[i]A shift in iodine intake from mildly deficient to more than adequate, or excessive iodine intake[/i] (emphasis mine)

Teng, Weiping M.D., et. al. “Effect of Iodine Intake on Thyroid Diseases in China” New England Journal of Medicine, Volume 354:2783-2793, June 29, 2006, Number 26

55

And:

Also, from the AACE website:

Subclinical hypothyroidism refers to mildly increased serum TSH levels in the setting of normal free T4 and T3 estimates. Although subclinical hypothyroidism may represent early thyroid failure, it may occur in the presence or absence of symptoms. It is a common disorder, the prevalence ranging from 1 to 10% of the adult population with increasing frequency in women, in patients with advanced age, [i]and in those with greater dietary iodine intake. [/i](again, emphasis mine.)

<------------- Not an MD

56

Thanks for the input! However, a transient increase in TSH is apparently expected when supplementing with iodine and my body temp has gone up since starting so I’m not too worried about TSH. Besides, my hypothyroid symptoms were way worse a couple of months ago before starting with Lugol’s.

In fact, I’ve hit 98.6F a couple of days in a row the last week and I’m not freezing anymore (I used to always be around 97.5) There is obviously great disagreement about the interactions of iodine supplementation, but I am personally noticing positive results at the moment, and I just hope it will stay that way.

57

After browsing through my old medical records, I just realized that when I was 12, I was given topical corticosteroid treatment for eczema problems on my fingertips. The cream was called Kenacort:

Is anyone familiar with the possible interactions of corticosteroids in regards to adrenal, thyroid function etc (esp for children)? The reason I’m asking is because it was around that time that I suddenly gained weight and became very chubby. I know this is common for kids that age, but I’m wondering if the treatment affected my metabolism somehow and caused permanent damage. Just a thought…

58

Update: I just got hold of copies of my medical records from back in 2005 when I first went to the doctor and noticed my low T problem. They did an “Insulin Stress Test” test which I was told came back fine. However, now that I have the numbers to look at, I’ve discovered that my cortisol level didn’t even come close to doubling during the test! Apparently, in the ACTH stim test, cortisol values are supposed to double, but I’m not sure if that’s the case during the Insulin Stress Test. Here are the numbers:

S-Cortisol:
0 min: 14.09 mcg/dL
45 min: 18.96 mcg/dL
60 min: 20.51 mcg/dL
90 min: 17.40 mcg/dL

P-ACTH:
0 min: 42 ng/L
30 min: 180 ng/L
45 min: 190 ng/L
60 min: 110 ng/L
90 min: 48 ng/L

S-GH:
0 min: 0.1 mU/L
30 min: 3.2 mU/L
45 min: 51 mU/L
60 min: 80 mU/L
90 min: 78 mU/L

kB-Glucose:
0 min: 93.7 mg/dL
15 min: 54 mg/dL
30 min: 30.6 mg/dL
60 min: 81.1 mg/dL
90 min: 73.8 mg/dL

This seems to be indicative of adrenal insufficiency and since it was six years ago, I would imagine things are even worse now. This shit of having to constantly question every single decision and analysis made by doctors is really stressing me out. I guess I should push for another test now six years later to see how bad things are?

Edit: I’m also thinking I should probably stop taking iodine supplements to prevent further stress on the adrenals?
Edit: Corrected the name of the test from “ACTH stim test” to “Insulin Stress Test”, lab values, added P-ACTH and GH response.

59

yes doctors are pretty much idiots across the board.

yes request another ACTH test to confirm the results.

taking 12.5mg Iodine daily shouldn’t cause too much stress. More then that I can’t comment on.

60

That isn’t an ACTH test (which would indicate a test of serum levels of ACTH) but it is an ACTH stimulation test, in which they inject you with ACTH and measure your cortisol response.

Where did you get that done at? I tried to get this done at Quest and they said they couldn’t do it in my area…