T Nation

Low Carb and Weightlifting

hey guys, i have been trying a few different diets over the years in an attempt to lean out while staying in my weight class with very little success. Now i understand that most people wont get crazy lean just doing the oly lifts, but i have made almost no progress as far as fat loss/muscle gain although i have gotten stronger.

Im wondering what some of you guys eat, supplement with, carb powders, yes or no, carbs in the day, yes or no. etc…

let me know please, im kinda getting frustrated.

So you have been training since 09 and have made very little gains? You should def. take a break and read some of our articles, because you are doing something completely wrong.

You have a ton of information at your finger tips regarding nutrition, Olympic lifts, power lifting and even bodybuilding.

As far as what I’m doing for my daily nutrition I find that eating the bulk of my carbs pre and post workout has been amazing. Eating a slow digesting carb for breakfast like oatmeal. Healthy fats through out the day(almonds, avocado, evoo) . Lean meats, eggs , fish or protein at every sitting.
I haven’t jumped on the IF bandwagon, I like the traditional eating every few hours kinda thing.

When you ask about carb powders are you referring to a mix like Surge? I’m a fan, like I mentioned before carbs only around your workout.

I never eat fast food, junk food, trans fat, or any of that crap, I eat extremely clean.
Drink a gallon of water a day (atleast)
as far as supps go, I think in the first few years all you need is Whey protein, BCAA’s, Fish oils, if you want creatine or betaA. No need for Pre-workout supplements.

If you want suggestions you should also throw out some stats. Hight, weight, you a fat guy? These things help, because if you skinny the solution would be to eat and eat. If you fat ofcourse your diet would be extremely different.

Read, eat and Train man

[quote]tork94 wrote:
hey guys, i have been trying a few different diets over the years in an attempt to lean out while staying in my weight class with very little success. Now i understand that most people wont get crazy lean just doing the oly lifts, but i have made almost no progress as far as fat loss/muscle gain although i have gotten stronger.

Im wondering what some of you guys eat, supplement with, carb powders, yes or no, carbs in the day, yes or no. etc…

let me know please, im kinda getting frustrated.[/quote]

Breakfast - meat and nuts
every other meal - meat, veggies, rice or potato (i’m quite lean and a carb bitch)
during training - BCAAs and lots of water
preworkout - acetyl-l-carnitine and caffeine
postworkout - whey, carb powder, juice, vitamin c, taurine, magnesium
other supps: HCL, fishoil, magnesium, zinc, multi, and some random ones for sleep that I rotate

What I think would work for you:
breakfast: meat and nuts
every other meal: meat and veggies [cheat dinner every 5 days]
during training: BCAAs, 20g minimum
postworkout: whey, glutamine [0.1-0.3g/kg bodyweight], glycine [0.1g/kg]

other supps to look into:

l-carnitine [involved in rate-limiting step for fat loss; 3:1 fishoil:carnitine works best]
fiber [blunts insulin and glucose levels, slows production of insulin by the pancreas, provides senstation of fullness and helps eliminate xenoestrogens; shoot for 30g/day in divided doses

In my eyes, if you simply started HCL again, fishoil at 9-15g/day, carnitine at 3-5g/day and fiber at 30g/day, you’d lose bodyfat for sure.

[quote]1llusion wrote:

[quote]tork94 wrote:
hey guys, i have been trying a few different diets over the years in an attempt to lean out while staying in my weight class with very little success. Now i understand that most people wont get crazy lean just doing the oly lifts, but i have made almost no progress as far as fat loss/muscle gain although i have gotten stronger.

Im wondering what some of you guys eat, supplement with, carb powders, yes or no, carbs in the day, yes or no. etc…

let me know please, im kinda getting frustrated.[/quote]

Breakfast - meat and nuts
every other meal - meat, veggies, rice or potato (i’m quite lean and a carb bitch)
during training - BCAAs and lots of water
preworkout - acetyl-l-carnitine and caffeine
postworkout - whey, carb powder, juice, vitamin c, taurine, magnesium
other supps: HCL, fishoil, magnesium, zinc, multi, and some random ones for sleep that I rotate

What I think would work for you:
breakfast: meat and nuts
every other meal: meat and veggies [cheat dinner every 5 days]
during training: BCAAs, 20g minimum
postworkout: whey, glutamine [0.1-0.3g/kg bodyweight], glycine [0.1g/kg]

other supps to look into:

l-carnitine [involved in rate-limiting step for fat loss; 3:1 fishoil:carnitine works best]
fiber [blunts insulin and glucose levels, slows production of insulin by the pancreas, provides senstation of fullness and helps eliminate xenoestrogens; shoot for 30g/day in divided doses

In my eyes, if you simply started HCL again, fishoil at 9-15g/day, carnitine at 3-5g/day and fiber at 30g/day, you’d lose bodyfat for sure.

[/quote]

thanks for this, its pretty close to what im doing, except i am having carbs every night and have the carb powder post WO, so im gona drop the carb powder and only have carbs at dinner 1-2 times/week (probably on the days when my volume is the highest?)

as far as the l-carnatine, you say 3-5 grams, is that ALL pre-workout? or some in the morning or throughout the day? and off days? just that 3-5 grams every day is fairly expensive.

thanks a lot of this!

[quote]tork94 wrote:

[quote]1llusion wrote:

[quote]tork94 wrote:
hey guys, i have been trying a few different diets over the years in an attempt to lean out while staying in my weight class with very little success. Now i understand that most people wont get crazy lean just doing the oly lifts, but i have made almost no progress as far as fat loss/muscle gain although i have gotten stronger.

Im wondering what some of you guys eat, supplement with, carb powders, yes or no, carbs in the day, yes or no. etc…

let me know please, im kinda getting frustrated.[/quote]

Breakfast - meat and nuts
every other meal - meat, veggies, rice or potato (i’m quite lean and a carb bitch)
during training - BCAAs and lots of water
preworkout - acetyl-l-carnitine and caffeine
postworkout - whey, carb powder, juice, vitamin c, taurine, magnesium
other supps: HCL, fishoil, magnesium, zinc, multi, and some random ones for sleep that I rotate

What I think would work for you:
breakfast: meat and nuts
every other meal: meat and veggies [cheat dinner every 5 days]
during training: BCAAs, 20g minimum
postworkout: whey, glutamine [0.1-0.3g/kg bodyweight], glycine [0.1g/kg]

other supps to look into:

l-carnitine [involved in rate-limiting step for fat loss; 3:1 fishoil:carnitine works best]
fiber [blunts insulin and glucose levels, slows production of insulin by the pancreas, provides senstation of fullness and helps eliminate xenoestrogens; shoot for 30g/day in divided doses

In my eyes, if you simply started HCL again, fishoil at 9-15g/day, carnitine at 3-5g/day and fiber at 30g/day, you’d lose bodyfat for sure.

[/quote]

thanks for this, its pretty close to what im doing, except i am having carbs every night and have the carb powder post WO, so im gona drop the carb powder and only have carbs at dinner 1-2 times/week (probably on the days when my volume is the highest?)

as far as the l-carnatine, you say 3-5 grams, is that ALL pre-workout? or some in the morning or throughout the day? and off days? just that 3-5 grams every day is fairly expensive.

thanks a lot of this! [/quote]

Acetyl-l-carnitine will act more on the brain, and tends to be used preworkout. l-carnitine, typically from tartrate, will act more on fast loss, so that’s the one you want. Therefore, you would take divided doses every day until you’re at your desired bodyfat. 3-5g/day shouldn’t be that expensive.

edit – I’d probably have your carbs on whichever day has your highest volume

[quote]1llusion wrote:

[quote]tork94 wrote:

[quote]1llusion wrote:

[quote]tork94 wrote:
hey guys, i have been trying a few different diets over the years in an attempt to lean out while staying in my weight class with very little success. Now i understand that most people wont get crazy lean just doing the oly lifts, but i have made almost no progress as far as fat loss/muscle gain although i have gotten stronger.

Im wondering what some of you guys eat, supplement with, carb powders, yes or no, carbs in the day, yes or no. etc…

let me know please, im kinda getting frustrated.[/quote]

Breakfast - meat and nuts
every other meal - meat, veggies, rice or potato (i’m quite lean and a carb bitch)
during training - BCAAs and lots of water
preworkout - acetyl-l-carnitine and caffeine
postworkout - whey, carb powder, juice, vitamin c, taurine, magnesium
other supps: HCL, fishoil, magnesium, zinc, multi, and some random ones for sleep that I rotate

What I think would work for you:
breakfast: meat and nuts
every other meal: meat and veggies [cheat dinner every 5 days]
during training: BCAAs, 20g minimum
postworkout: whey, glutamine [0.1-0.3g/kg bodyweight], glycine [0.1g/kg]

other supps to look into:

l-carnitine [involved in rate-limiting step for fat loss; 3:1 fishoil:carnitine works best]
fiber [blunts insulin and glucose levels, slows production of insulin by the pancreas, provides senstation of fullness and helps eliminate xenoestrogens; shoot for 30g/day in divided doses

In my eyes, if you simply started HCL again, fishoil at 9-15g/day, carnitine at 3-5g/day and fiber at 30g/day, you’d lose bodyfat for sure.

[/quote]

thanks for this, its pretty close to what im doing, except i am having carbs every night and have the carb powder post WO, so im gona drop the carb powder and only have carbs at dinner 1-2 times/week (probably on the days when my volume is the highest?)

as far as the l-carnatine, you say 3-5 grams, is that ALL pre-workout? or some in the morning or throughout the day? and off days? just that 3-5 grams every day is fairly expensive.

thanks a lot of this! [/quote]

Acetyl-l-carnitine will act more on the brain, and tends to be used preworkout. l-carnitine, typically from tartrate, will act more on fast loss, so that’s the one you want. Therefore, you would take divided doses every day until you’re at your desired bodyfat. 3-5g/day shouldn’t be that expensive.

edit – I’d probably have your carbs on whichever day has your highest volume
[/quote]

thanks ill defiantly try that! just one last question, is the l-carnitine taken with food or does it matter?

Yes, you would take your carnitine with meals along with your HCL and fishoil.

what’s HCL and what does it do?

[quote]Summons wrote:
what’s HCL and what does it do?[/quote]

it basicly stimulates stomach acid, helps with digesting your food etc…

[quote]Summons wrote:
what’s HCL and what does it do?[/quote]

just my shorthand for betaine hcl, which mimicks stomach acid. The more you break down your food in your stomach, the more nutrients you can potentially absorb from the food.

[quote]Mike T. wrote:
So you have been training since 09 and have made very little gains? You should def. take a break and read some of our articles, because you are doing something completely wrong.

You have a ton of information at your finger tips regarding nutrition, Olympic lifts, power lifting and even bodybuilding.[/quote]

Um . . .

He didn’t say he’s been stagnant since '09 (he did say he’s gotten stronger). And while there is an absolute wealth of knowledge on this site, I have yet to see an article geared towards people training to be olympic weightlifters. Everything else is either not applicable at all, or you really need to pick through it for the odd nugget of wisdom you can apply to your own diet/training/life. If you’re looking to improve body composition while staying in the same weight class for weightlifting, it makes little sense to me to do it utilizing methods geared towards powerlifting or bodybuilding. But that’s just my two cents.

As far as my own diet and whatnot . . .
Supps are whey, dex/malto powders pre and peri workout (I just drink chocolate milk afterwards, too tasty to completely take out of my diet haha), along with creatine monohydrate, a multivitamin (from a company that rhymes with lawn), and fish oil (I like the high DHA stuff, can’t really afford Biotest’s Flameout and the stuff I was using was discontinued so playing around with this at the moment). Not too picky with my diet, generally lots of protein and fat I think, full fat milk and meat/eggs mostly. Have what I jokingly like to think of as a “carb up” meal back at my parents place probably once a week where I just eat whatever my mom cooks. Or maybe during the week too if she gives me some leftover quinoa or something . . .

I would say don’t be so damn scared of carbs man, eat as many as you can to fuel your performance in the gym but not so much that you gain unnecessary body fat for O-lifting. It takes some time to figure out how many grams/day that is for you, so just take a few weeks and tinker with it. To me it doesn’t make sense to go low-carb for 5 days and then have some cheat meal on the 5th day, because, well, you are a hard training O-lifter, aren’t you? Eat for the long-term performance man, not the short-term body comp changes you’ll see in the mirror.

I would say though, every workout have something like Surge Workout Fuel. Easily my most favorite supplement, and if you are training hard (~2-2.5 hrs per workout), 2 scoops of that will be invaluable for recovery and performance. Post-workout, always have carbs like rice or potatoes. I don’t care what your skinfold says or what your practitioner says, eat your damn carbs post-workout.

The rest of the meals you will have to tinker with to see how much it affects fat gain, but generally in the morning I’ll have 1/2 cup of oats with berries or an apple. Then I train, then pwo meal, then more protein/fat and more carbs if I feel I need them and am still hungry.

[quote]tork94 wrote:
hey guys, i have been trying a few different diets over the years in an attempt to lean out while staying in my weight class with very little success. Now i understand that most people wont get crazy lean just doing the oly lifts, but i have made almost no progress as far as fat loss/muscle gain although i have gotten stronger.

Im wondering what some of you guys eat, supplement with, carb powders, yes or no, carbs in the day, yes or no. etc…

let me know please, im kinda getting frustrated.[/quote]

Whatever you do, don’t diet down and expect strength gains at the same time. Set goals for each month. For instance, two months before you start competition training, diet down. the next month, up the calories and volume for muscle gain. the month after that, begin competition training and do not cut calories. CALORIES=POWER. Your body needs fuel to produce strength gains, so provide it with enough calories to do so, especially carbohyrates(energy) and protein(recovery).

If i got stronger and didn’t gain weight i’d be very happy.

Agreed on their be little help for oly lifters diet wise. Generally meat and veg + fruits is whats told.

For myself i follow a carb back loading approach but only loosely, im not the strictest but im doing fine.

Running out of ideas for my lunch box though.

The Poliquin-thing that you’ve been doing doesn’t work well enough?

[quote]Paperclip wrote:
The Poliquin-thing that you’ve been doing doesn’t work well enough?[/quote]

Not as well as i had expected. Im still doing the “Poliquin-thing” but im throwing some tweeks in to try and personalize it more to my needs as an Oly lifter.

Over the last week, i have added in the L-carnitine, taken out my carb powder and have made my workouts about 30% faster (same amount of work, just faster paced). So far i feel really good and seem a bit leaner considering its been less then a week.

Ill try and keep you up-dated if you like.

It’s more than reasonable to walk around lean and be an olifter. There’s three of us who train together and we all stay around 5-6% year-round (granted, we’re all fairly new to oly, the most veteran is 2 years, im just shy of a year, and the newest is only a few months).

[quote]1llusion wrote:
It’s more than reasonable to walk around lean and be an olifter. There’s three of us who train together and we all stay around 5-6% year-round (granted, we’re all fairly new to oly, the most veteran is 2 years, im just shy of a year, and the newest is only a few months).[/quote]

What weight class are the three of you in? I think it’s generally harder for the larger athletes to stay lean year-round as opposed to some of the smaller guys. But I haven’t been what I’d consider “small” in a while now so maybe I’m biased haha.

Im the lightest, currently 72kg bodyweight. The other two compete as 85’s, but walk around a kilo or two above that. I’d definitely agree that it’s easier for lighter classes, but far from impossible for heavier classes.

[quote]tork94 wrote:

Not as well as i had expected. Im still doing the “Poliquin-thing” but im throwing some tweeks in to try and personalize it more to my needs as an Oly lifter.

Over the last week, i have added in the L-carnitine, taken out my carb powder and have made my workouts about 30% faster (same amount of work, just faster paced). So far i feel really good and seem a bit leaner considering its been less then a week.

Ill try and keep you up-dated if you like.
[/quote]

Thanks but I don’t think it would be necessary because you’ve written quite a lot on the nutrition subforum, but I’d like to know how much your average daily calorie intake?