Liquifying Your Nutrition

Diet and Nutrition
42

I may have read some replies on here wrong, as it is midnight.

But, there seems to be confusion on what whole food is.
Whole food isn’t necessarily the whole piece of the food, it is more a term for foods that basically are found in nature.

So, a smoothie of berries, yogurt, spinach, protein powder, nuts would be considered mostly whole food (minus the protein powder), just because it is in liquid form doesn’t make it a bad choice.

maybe the TEF is slightly (and I mean slightly) lower for a smoothie than chewing the actual food, for the convenience factor it’s neglible at that.

again, maybe I’m off base on what I read through some replies

43

[quote]rainjack wrote:
Nick21 wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Tex Ag wrote:
Thanks, rainjack!

Don’t get me wrong - I think the V-Diet is about the stupidest fucking thing to come down the pipes since the Slim-Fast diet.

What are you basing your opinion on and do you have anything to back it up? The V-Diet has helped more people than I can count on this forum, post your reasons for such a bold statement.

(I’m on Day 7)

The V-Diet is a starvation diet. You eat no solid food, and you are severely restricted on calories.

It is the the same thing as the SlimFast diet, only you are Using Biotest products.

I think the V-Diet appeals to the lazy people because of the “fast” results, which is mainly water weight, and shrinking of the stomach.

There is no way to maintain muscle mass on this diet.

My statement isn’t that fucking bold. Other those that hang out here, who the hell has ever even heard of this diet?

I prefer Berardi’s approach to nutrition, which shuns MRP’s in favor of…get this…real food. [/quote]

The V-Diet and other very strict diets are not so bad. But I don’t agree with how they are used. I think they should be used for intermediate to advanced lifters with a solid base of muscle who are already fairly lean who want to get super shredded. Seems like every time you turn around, every soft, overfat lifter with minimal amounts of muscle is jumping on the V-diet bandwagon when they’d be better served by a solid lifting program and moderate caloric deficit.

I can’t speak for the efficacy of the V-diet itself [I also prefer real food. I agree on that] but I had great results with Get Shredded. I got VERY lean and did not lose muscle. But I had been lifting for years before I did it and was at a pretty lean starting point.

As far as the original question, it is better to get the bulk of your food from whole foods. If you are going to a very low calorie diet [or if you’re not], why not get the benefit of the thermic effect of solid food? I also think it’s silly to do diets like these without appropriate supplementation.

44

[quote]jsbrook wrote:

The V-Diet and other very strict diets are not so bad. But I don’t agree with how they are used. I think they should be used for intermediate to advanced lifters with a solid base of muscle who are already fairly lean who want to get super shredded. Seems like every time you turn around, every soft, overfat lifter with minimal amounts of muscle is jumping on the V-diet bandwagon when they’d be better served by a solid lifting program and moderate caloric deficit. [/quote]

Take a look at all the New Years Resolutioners showing up to post their V-Diet log. None of them should be on this diet. They are all too fat.

I could see its benefits if you needed to shed the last few pounds if you are already pretty low in BF - but anything over 15%, and it is a stupid diet.

I tried it, and I hated it. The V-Diet made my head hurt, made me weak, and made me extremely tired.

I love the Get Shredded Diet. It is a far more intelligent approach to fat loss.

45

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
<<< maybe the TEF is slightly (and I mean slightly) lower for a smoothie than chewing the actual food, for the convenience factor it’s neglible at that. >>>[/quote]

The TEF of protein happens during digestion and not during the act of chewing thus it making impossible for me to believe that it is not significantly higher for even whole foods that have been physically reduced in my food processor. I will say I believe that the TEF of whole foods is probably reduced some by grinding it up as it takes less biological work to do the initial breakdown.

Think about it, you’re not going to maintain that liquid whey requires the same caloric cost to digest than a steak.

46

Exactly what I said.

47

[quote]rainjack wrote:
<<< I could see its benefits if you needed to shed the last few pounds if you are already pretty low in BF - but anything over 15%, and it is a stupid diet. >>>
[/quote]

I was going to say that I could envision some uses for it for certain people as I have said in the past, but most of the wrong guys are using it. There seems to be a link between [quote]“I have to be this (insert number here) lean before going for size”[/quote] and jumping on the V-Diet.

I will reiterate my concession that for some small Percentage of folks who store adipose tissue simply by showing up at the grocery store, reaching a certain reasonable level of leanness before gaining may not be the worst idea ever. However even for them I don’t know if slingshot approaches like an all liquid diet are the way to go.

48

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
rainjack wrote:
<<< I could see its benefits if you needed to shed the last few pounds if you are already pretty low in BF - but anything over 15%, and it is a stupid diet. >>>

I was going to say that I could envision some uses for it for certain people as I have said in the past, but most of the wrong guys are using it. There seems to be a link between “I have to be this (insert number here) lean before going for size” and jumping on the v-diet.

I will reiterate my concession that for some small Percentage of folks who store adipose tissue simply by showing up at the grocery store, reaching a certain reasonable level of leanness before gaining may not be the worst idea ever. However even for them I don’t know if slingshot approaches like an all liquid diet are the way to go.[/quote]

But…but it has a cool name and promises to get me ripped by the time we have to buy the rental car for the trip to Virginia Beach! Look, some of us don’t have the time to workout several days a week…or pay attention to what we eat…or actually lift weights at all. Some of us just want to look like we do those things…but without all of that sweating.

Hey, we promise to all stop working out completely after Spring Break and won’t pick it up again until next January.

Happy?

Gawd, these bodybuilders act like everyone wants to work hard for what they get.

Hello! Some of us just log in for the sex forum!

49

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
small Percentage of folks who store adipose tissue simply by showing up at the grocery store.[/quote]

How many people are actually like this? I would have to think it isn’t many…just a whole lot of people who CLAIM they exercise regularly and watch they eat but still keep getting fatter.

I was always under the impression that these people, just like newbies who think they eat a lot, don’t keep track of exactly how much they are tossing back in a day.

50

Just wanted to throw in my two cents in regard to liquid nutrition. Monday thru Friday I get up and commute forty five minutes each day to work and back. Due to a desire to make the most of time these mornings and not really being habituated to eating a large solid food meal at 6:30 a.m. I for a long time have liquified my breakfasts and drink it while driving to work in the morning.

I use about 14 oz. of fat free milk a scoop of Metabolic Drive Complete a scoop of Metabolic Drive Low-Carb. I also add a scoop of Superfood, one chopped apple, half a cup of mixed berries, half a cup of broccoli, and one banana. After downing a good portion to coat my stomach I take my vitamin E, C, and Flameout dose.

I haven’t broken down the exact macro nutrient breakdown, but know it’s a whopping amount of calories, protein, carbs, and fat. I workout three days a week roughly an hour and half later and this shake provides ample fuel for the workout. Doing this has really helped to make morning nutrition a lot more quick an convenient and helps keep the gains in the gym going.

D

51

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
small Percentage of folks who store adipose tissue simply by showing up at the grocery store.

How many people are actually like this? I would have to think it isn’t many…just a whole lot of people who CLAIM they exercise regularly and watch they eat but still keep getting fatter.

I was always under the impression that these people, just like newbies who think they eat a lot, don’t keep track of exactly how much they are tossing back in a day.

[/quote]

There is no way anybody,s convincing me that this is not the case. People don’t like to think of themselves this way, but 90 plus percent of them, including me, fall into the average range somewhere. Genetically cursed individuals who store fat VERY easily and those who cannot gain without EXTREME eating are rare. Just as rare as people who gain significant muscle by hanging around the gym and eating power bars.

Seeing yourself as one of these people because for some reason you’d like it to be true is a serious self inflicted disservice and is even worse if you succeed in persuading other average people that they also require unconventional means to make progress.

Face it friends, there’s very likely nothing particularly wrong or right with you. You just have to follow the same simple rules as the rest of us normal folks.

52

[quote]rainjack wrote:
jsbrook wrote:

The V-Diet and other very strict diets are not so bad. But I don’t agree with how they are used. I think they should be used for intermediate to advanced lifters with a solid base of muscle who are already fairly lean who want to get super shredded. Seems like every time you turn around, every soft, overfat lifter with minimal amounts of muscle is jumping on the V-diet bandwagon when they’d be better served by a solid lifting program and moderate caloric deficit.

Take a look at all the New Years Resolutioners showing up to post their V-Diet log. None of them should be on this diet. They are all too fat.

I could see its benefits if you needed to shed the last few pounds if you are already pretty low in BF - but anything over 15%, and it is a stupid diet.

I can’t speak for the efficacy of the V-diet itself [I also prefer real food. I agree on that] but I had great results with Get Shredded. I got VERY lean and did not lose muscle. But I had been lifting for years before I did it and was at a pretty lean starting point.

I tried it, and I hated it. The V-Diet made my head hurt, made me weak, and made me extremely tired.

I love the Get Shredded Diet. It is a far more intelligent approach to fat loss.
[/quote]

We’re basically saying the same thing. I don’t know if I’d go so far as to say the V-Diet is intrinsically bad. But I definitely agree it’s misused. And I see no benefit beyond convenience to using shakes instead of solid food. I think most people would be better off, if they are going to go that route, using a variety of whole food proteins, and just sticking with those macros and calories.

53

[quote]jsbrook wrote:
We’re basically saying the same thing. I don’t know if I’d go so far as to say the V-Diet is intrinsically bad. But I definitely agree it’s misused. And I see no benefit beyond convenience to using shakes instead of solid food. I think most people would be better off, if they are going to go that route, using a variety of whole food proteins, and just sticking with those macros and calories.[/quote]

I think it is intrinsically evil for about 95% of those that have been on it. Why? All starvation diets are bad. Period. Starvation diets for fat asses? even worse.

What are we taught in the very beginning? 6 meals a day.

What are we taught to eat? Lean meat, green veggies, fruits, and chicken breasts.

Then along comes the glorious V-Diet and breaks everyone of those rules. In fact - it is even more severe than the SlimFast Diet, because on the SlimFast, at least you could eat real food once a day.

Now every fat ass that joins this site thinks that the V-Diet was designed for them, and there is not one motherfucker here telling them any different. Seems they like the pats on the back a fuckload more than exercising an ounce of responsibility.

54

[quote]rainjack wrote:
jsbrook wrote:
We’re basically saying the same thing. I don’t know if I’d go so far as to say the V-Diet is intrinsically bad. But I definitely agree it’s misused. And I see no benefit beyond convenience to using shakes instead of solid food. I think most people would be better off, if they are going to go that route, using a variety of whole food proteins, and just sticking with those macros and calories.

I think it is intrinsically evil for about 95% of those that have been on it. Why? All starvation diets are bad. Period. Starvation diets for fat asses? even worse.

What are we taught in the very beginning? 6 meals a day.

What are we taught to eat? Lean meat, green veggies, fruits, and chicken breasts.

Then along comes the glorious V-Diet and breaks everyone of those rules. In fact - it is even more severe than the SlimFast Diet, because on the SlimFast, at least you could eat real food once a day.

Now every fat ass that joins this site thinks that the V-Diet was designed for them, and there is not one motherfucker here telling them any different. Seems they like the pats on the back a fuckload more than exercising an ounce of responsibility.

[/quote]

And the church said, “A men”.

55

[quote]rainjack wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
Anything can be gotten used to. That goes for you too Rainjack.

Funny you should say that - as I just got a mouth full of braces installed, and the way the orthos have my mouth all jacked up, it is almost impossible to ea food that requires biting and excessive chewing.

I may try your shake idea, but I can promise you it will be sans liver. [/quote]

It’s true that anything can be gotten used to. But I had my jaw broken years ago playing field hockey, and it was wired shut for over a month. Everything I ate came out of a blender. As God is my witness, I will never eat liquid meals again!! Jeezus, next to sex, eating good food is one of the pleasures of living. Don’t you guys have any teeth?

56

[quote]Yo Momma wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
Anything can be gotten used to. That goes for you too Rainjack.

Funny you should say that - as I just got a mouth full of braces installed, and the way the orthos have my mouth all jacked up, it is almost impossible to ea food that requires biting and excessive chewing.

I may try your shake idea, but I can promise you it will be sans liver.

It’s true that anything can be gotten used to. But I had my jaw broken years ago playing field hockey, and it was wired shut for over a month. Everything I ate came out of a blender. As God is my witness, I will never eat liquid meals again!! Jeezus, next to sex, eating good food is one of the pleasures of living. Don’t you guys have any teeth?

[/quote]

I have most of mine, but they are wrapped in wire for the next 24-36 months.

57

That sucks.

58

[quote]Yo Momma wrote:
rainjack wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
Anything can be gotten used to. That goes for you too Rainjack.

Funny you should say that - as I just got a mouth full of braces installed, and the way the orthos have my mouth all jacked up, it is almost impossible to ea food that requires biting and excessive chewing.

I may try your shake idea, but I can promise you it will be sans liver.

It’s true that anything can be gotten used to. But I had my jaw broken years ago playing field hockey, and it was wired shut for over a month. Everything I ate came out of a blender. As God is my witness, I will never eat liquid meals again!! Jeezus, next to sex, eating good food is one of the pleasures of living. Don’t you guys have any teeth?

[/quote]

I try to save mine for important tasks like opening those pesky plastic packages.

I eat pureed food for 2 reasons. The first and most important is that’s easier to get all my ingredients quickly out of one container. The second is the happy coincidence that it digests very well. I’ll admit that I can eat just about anything which isn’t to say that I don’t love some foods. If I were to eat according to what tastes good I personally would get nowhere with my goals so as long as taste isn’t an issue may as well eat what works best.

59

[quote]rainjack wrote:
I have most of mine, but they are wrapped in wire for the next 24-36 months.
[/quote]

Be careful with Mrs. Jack.

60

I feel the need to clarify a few things being said in this thread. This is not meant to flame anyone but people read these posts and believe what is there so I think the information should at least be correct.

The V-Diet is not based around Whey but Casein protein. This makes a big difference.

There is no comparison between a sugary drink that goes thru you quickly to all the good fats and slow digesting protein in the V-Diet.

The Get Shredded Diet has you eating 2,000 cals a day. The V-Diet has you eating 1,750 cals for the same 200 pound person. I dont see how there is a huge difference to conclude the V-Diet is a starvation diet and the Get Shredded Diet as not.

Um I kept my lean mass, kept the fat off after the diet and even have gained some muscle back and lost more weight transitioning off of V-Diet. I am not normal so I guess I could be the only one�?�

Yup this is me. I dont think it is a good idea to make broad assumptions about people. I am one of the fat New Years people. The problem is the only reason I started the diet after new years is because it was the only time I could make the time. As far as being fat well yea I was and am fat. The problem is I had an injury and got pissed when I couldnt lift heavy for a while so I got VERY frustrated.

I used the diet as a start to getting my eating habits in order and it has worked. I have not cheated since 1/1/08 and I keep making progress. I know I could have and have done it without the drastic measures but it was a good way for me to get focused.

The only real proof I have that I am correct is wait another couple of months to see the results I have attained. If I am still fat you were right, if I am even further along the road to being lean you were wrong.

This post is honestly not directed to Rainjack or anyone else. I am using this tool to get what I want. I have done the same things differently but I like to try new things and to push myself to see what I can accomplish.

BTW I do believe whole foods are better when dieting. I do however drink a few shakes a day to get a steady stream of nutrients. I wouldnt be able to do that with only whole foods.

61

I had jaw surgery too. Finally getting to eat a solid meal was good…except for the fact that my jaw was sore as fuck from lack of movement.