T Nation

'Lifting for Strength is a Foolish Idea'

I generally do not start threads, I generally take a live and let live approach, especially when it comes to lifting weights, do what makes you happy, dont force your ideas on someone else unless asked and don’t shit on your counterparts who have different goals.

It must be noted that I am Respecting Mr. Walkaway’s wishes and will not chime in on the thread as other than the above mentioned and below referenced post it is an informative and devoid of shit thread.

However, PLing is something I have a passion for, yes it is a constant struggle but it is how I choose to spend alot of time and energy in my life. It is something I enjoy, soooo I have taken the below full quoted post personally:

“I believe that powerlifting/lifting for strength, are very foolish ideas. I believe that methods like 5/3/1 will result in more injuries than growth, and should be avoided… i know that will turn off many here, but this is the bodybuilding forum.”

Trying to get stronger is foolish? Powerlifting is foolish."

I take this personally, I also find it passive aggressive to not invite others who disagree with the above mentioned to refrain from posting in the thread. I understand that he did not want to turn the thread into a flame war, but he fired the first salvo.

I know some of you will say who cares, its the BBing forum, but he also insulted what many of us enjoy doing. I respect Bodybuilders and understand it is a difficult lifestyle, but why shit on the way I choose to lift weights?

Thoughts?

As someone who reads both forums I kind of agree with his statement. On this side can’t we all agree that what bodybuilders do can be foolish? Specifically, not caring about how strong they are and getting on stage in a banana hammock?

Lifting weights to get stronger is foolish? How so?

If thats the case can it be said to dieting down to unhealthy body fat levels is also foolish?

When he says foolish I am inferring dangerous.

Id like to think that both avenues of weight lifting can be foolish when done haphazardly.

Powerlifting is only foolish when technique goes to sh!t all to lift the heaviest weight, then it necessitates multiple surgeries from the injuries, and then training is continued despite doctor’s advice, and then maximal ‘genetic potential’ is perceived to have been reach so progress is continued with PED’s.

But bodybuilding or basically any activity can be taken to similar extremes. But I dunno, just seems like a lot of powerlifters end up having surgery or on the juice.

Lifting for strength is foolish? I think Rippetoe summed it up best: “Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general.”

As for 5/3/1 causing more injuries than growth… what a crock. Has he even read why Jim developed 5/3/1? If he said Smolov or Sheiko then I could see a bit of merit in it, but 5/3/1? Seriously?

Agreed, like I said poor form in any form of weightlifting is going to cause injuries…but getting stronger via weightlifting being foolish…is something that I just find boggling.

[quote]alternate wrote:
Powerlifting is only foolish when technique goes to sh!t all to lift the heaviest weight, then it necessitates multiple surgeries from the injuries, and then training is continued despite doctor’s advice, and then maximal ‘genetic potential’ is perceived to have been reach so progress is continued with PED’s.

But bodybuilding or basically any activity can be taken to similar extremes. But I dunno, just seems like a lot of powerlifters end up having surgery or on the juice.[/quote]

Cant the same be said of BBers?

[quote]238 wrote:
Lifting for strength is foolish? I think Rippetoe summed it up best: “Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general.”

As for 5/3/1 causing more injuries than growth… what a crock. Has he even read why Jim developed 5/3/1? If he said Smolov or Sheiko then I could see a bit of merit in it, but 5/3/1? Seriously?[/quote]

Agreed

Who is that guy? I never go over to that forum so I am completely ignorant as to who that is. Does this person at least have some credibility when it comes to training?

Either way, those statements don’t bother me in the slightest.

[quote]MattyXL wrote:
I generally do not start threads, I generally take a live and let live approach, especially when it comes to lifting weights, do what makes you happy, dont force your ideas on someone else unless asked and don’t shit on your counterparts who have different goals.

It must be noted that I am Respecting Mr. Walkaway’s wishes and will not chime in on the thread as other than the above mentioned and below referenced post it is an informative and devoid of shit thread.

However, PLing is something I have a passion for, yes it is a constant struggle but it is how I choose to spend alot of time and energy in my life. It is something I enjoy, soooo I have taken the below full quoted post personally:

“I believe that powerlifting/lifting for strength, are very foolish ideas. I believe that methods like 5/3/1 will result in more injuries than growth, and should be avoided… i know that will turn off many here, but this is the bodybuilding forum.”

Trying to get stronger is foolish? Powerlifting is foolish."

I take this personally, I also find it passive aggressive to not invite others who disagree with the above mentioned to refrain from posting in the thread. I understand that he did not want to turn the thread into a flame war, but he fired the first salvo.

I know some of you will say who cares, its the BBing forum, but he also insulted what many of us enjoy doing. I respect Bodybuilders and understand it is a difficult lifestyle, but why shit on the way I choose to lift weights?

Thoughts?[/quote]

you’ve got to be kidding me. I’ve been training for a long time and I’ve yet to see a jacked weak dude nor skinny guy with great absolute strength. Any bodybuilder worth his salt is strong and any good powerlifter has plenty of muscle…
Good god. C’mon, Farva! Same team! Further, the best powerlifters use some bodybuilding methodology (westside, repetition method) while the best bodybuilders take lessons from powerlifting (ronnie coleman). Oh yeah, and pre steroids THEY DID BOTH! (GRIMEK, KONO, REEVES… )
Is this dude TRYING to be an idiot, or does it just come naturally?

[quote]frankjl wrote:
Who is that guy? I never go over to that forum so I am completely ignorant as to who that is. Does this person at least have some credibility when it comes to training?

Either way, those statements don’t bother me in the slightest.[/quote]

I do venture to the forum, he likes to remain anonymous somewhat, he seems knowledgeable with regards to BBing.

Do they not bother you because he has no relevance in PLing? I dont know, it bothers me when when someone basically takes a shit on what I like to do…

[quote]cubuff2028 wrote:

you’ve got to be kidding me. I’ve been training for a long time and I’ve yet to see a jacked weak dude nor skinny guy with great absolute strength. Any bodybuilder worth his salt is strong and any good powerlifter has plenty of muscle…
Good god. C’mon, Farva! Same team! Further, the best powerlifters use some bodybuilding methodology (westside, repetition method) while the best bodybuilders take lessons from powerlifting (ronnie coleman). Oh yeah, and pre steroids THEY DID BOTH! (GRIMEK, KONO, REEVES… )
Is this dude TRYING to be an idiot, or does it just come naturally?

[/quote]

Its kinda how I feel, Im not gonna shit on a BodyBuilder, its just not for me…if I was a BBer I would want some modicum of strength, on the other hand being PLer, I want to look like a lift weights as well.

It doesn’t seem unreasonable to me that a bodybuilder would find powerlifting foolish. If he thought it was something you could appreciate, wouldn’t they be powerlifters instead of bodybuilders?

I respect what bodybuilders do, but ultimately I could also say I think it’s foolish. I have zero desire to do it.

It works both ways.

[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
It doesn’t seem unreasonable to me that a bodybuilder would find powerlifting foolish. If he thought it was something you could appreciate, wouldn’t they be powerlifters instead of bodybuilders?

I respect what bodybuilders do, but ultimately I could also say I think it’s foolish. I have zero desire to do it.

It works both ways.[/quote]

Why cant I appreciate BBers (which I do) but not train in that style and not find it foolish. Just because I have no desire to do it, it doesn’t mean I find it foolish.

LOL I just think its pretty funny he started his own “How Do you Train” thread without anyone (at least as it appears) even asking…

you really care what a guy like that thinks about your sport?

[quote]MattyXL wrote:

[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
It doesn’t seem unreasonable to me that a bodybuilder would find powerlifting foolish. If he thought it was something you could appreciate, wouldn’t they be powerlifters instead of bodybuilders?

I respect what bodybuilders do, but ultimately I could also say I think it’s foolish. I have zero desire to do it.

It works both ways.[/quote]

Why cant I appreciate BBers (which I do) but not train in that style and not find it foolish. Just because I have no desire to do it, it doesn’t mean I find it foolish. [/quote]

I can’t see having NO desire to do something and not being able to find it at least a little foolish. Otherwise, I imagine at least a little desire to do it would be there.

But really, I gave up what other people thought about me or what I did in high school.

I simply can’t trust a guy who wont put up pics to back up his stuff. Anyone can seem knowledgable on the internet.

[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:
LOL I just think its pretty funny he started his own “How Do you Train” thread without anyone (at least as it appears) even asking…

you really care what a guy like that thinks about your sport? [/quote]

I know I shouldnt, but I guess I do.

[quote]IFlashBack wrote:
I simply can’t trust a guy who wont put up pics to back up his stuff. Anyone can seem knowledgable on the internet. [/quote]

These pics don’t count?

http://asp.elitefts.net/qa/training-logs.asp?qid=182739

[quote]MattyXL wrote:

[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:
LOL I just think its pretty funny he started his own “How Do you Train” thread without anyone (at least as it appears) even asking…

you really care what a guy like that thinks about your sport? [/quote]

I know I shouldnt, but I guess I do.
[/quote]

People actually did ask him to start his own training thread in Zraw’s thread