T Nation

Libido, Atrophy & Skin Problems

Hi guys, came across this site when planning my cycle and it was a great help, a real wealth of information here. Cut a long story short, I’m really really hoping for some help with lasting negative effects post cycle and would really appreciate your advice.

Just read the ‘Advice for new guys’ thread, so will fill in the blanks as suggested:


age
= 29
height
= 5’9"
waist
= 30"
weight
= 86kg
describe body and facial hair
= Normal, light - body hair increased somewhat after last cycle
describe where you carry fat and how changed
= Additional on lower abdomen and back
health conditions, symptoms
= none
Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever
= none
lab results with ranges
= Serum testosterone level 13.6 nmol/L (6.0 - 27.0) - taken first thing in the morning
describe diet
= 40/40/20 on average, about 12% more calories than maintenance
describe training
= 4 days p/w, varied - heavy, strict (light), drop sets, supersets, etc
testes ache, ever, with a fever?
= no, but feel noticably smaller than pre cycle
how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed
= far more infrequent, although still very occasionally

additional
= unstable energy levels and almost acne like skin condition (was clear before cycle)


It was after my second ever cycle that all this started. I’ll detail it below:

Week 1->12 - Test Cyp at 250mg - Monday & Thursday
Week 12->13 - Test Prop at 100mg - ED for 7 days
Week 2->13.5 - HCG at 300iu - Friday & Tuesday

PCT (starting 2 weeks after last Test Cyp pin - Week 14 on):

Week 1->4 - Clomid at 50mg - 2x per day, morning & night
Week 1->2 - Nolva at 40mg - 1x per day
Week 3->6 - Nolva at 20mg - 1x per day


I think the test prop was where I really went wrong - I get the feeling that it shut me down, real bad. Testicular atrophy was extreme, as I’d managed to avoid the worst of it during cycle with the HCG.

Things were generally OK post PCT, but then two or three months after, everything just dropped off. I tend to do a lot of my own reading, so when initially trying diagnose/correct my current condition, I did another cycle of clomid only for four weeks. This seemed to improve my condition somewhat, but only for the first week or so - then I slowly declined to the condition I am in now.

There you have it - I’ll happily do anything that needs to be done to assist. Just got married a month ago and this low libido is driving me crazy!!

Much appreciated.

First thing I would do is get blood work done to see where your levels are currently at. If you post current blood work the veterans on this site will have a much easier time trying to understand what is going on.

[quote]Jokeshopbeard wrote:
Hi guys, came across this site when planning my cycle and it was a great help, a real wealth of information here. Cut a long story short, I’m really really hoping for some help with lasting negative effects post cycle and would really appreciate your advice.

Just read the ‘Advice for new guys’ thread, so will fill in the blanks as suggested:


age
= 29
height
= 5’9"
waist
= 30"
weight
= 86kg
describe body and facial hair
= Normal, light - body hair increased somewhat after last cycle
describe where you carry fat and how changed
= Additional on lower abdomen and back
health conditions, symptoms
= none
Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever
= none
lab results with ranges
= Serum testosterone level 13.6 nmol/L (6.0 - 27.0) - taken first thing in the morning
describe diet
= 40/40/20 on average, about 12% more calories than maintenance
describe training
= 4 days p/w, varied - heavy, strict (light), drop sets, supersets, etc
testes ache, ever, with a fever?
= no, but feel noticably smaller than pre cycle
how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed
= far more infrequent, although still very occasionally

additional
= unstable energy levels and almost acne like skin condition (was clear before cycle)


It was after my second ever cycle that all this started. I’ll detail it below:

Week 1->12 - Test Cyp at 250mg - Monday & Thursday
Week 12->13 - Test Prop at 100mg - ED for 7 days
Week 2->13.5 - HCG at 300iu - Friday & Tuesday

PCT (starting 2 weeks after last Test Cyp pin - Week 14 on):

Week 1->4 - Clomid at 50mg - 2x per day, morning & night
Week 1->2 - Nolva at 40mg - 1x per day
Week 3->6 - Nolva at 20mg - 1x per day


I think the test prop was where I really went wrong - I get the feeling that it shut me down, real bad. Testicular atrophy was extreme, as I’d managed to avoid the worst of it during cycle with the HCG.

Things were generally OK post PCT, but then two or three months after, everything just dropped off. I tend to do a lot of my own reading, so when initially trying diagnose/correct my current condition, I did another cycle of clomid only for four weeks. This seemed to improve my condition somewhat, but only for the first week or so - then I slowly declined to the condition I am in now.

There you have it - I’ll happily do anything that needs to be done to assist. Just got married a month ago and this low libido is driving me crazy!!

Much appreciated.[/quote]

You need a blood test for a start, other wise it’s just guess work.

First thing though, you started PCT 2 weeks early. Cyp has a 12 day half life so by the time you started PCT you would have had around 200mg of test floating about. Your balls won’t respond until you test levels drop to where they were naturally. So the first 2 weleks for PCT were wasted for a start. 600iu of HCG is low for 500mg of gear but better than nothing. Did you run an AI?

Just saw that you ran prop as well. Why did you feel the need to whack in another 700mg of gear on top of the 500mg you’re already running on your second cycle? The half life of prop is 2 days so you had way to much test in you when you started PCT. No wonder the PCT failed.

Get a full hormone panel and then you’ll have an idea of where your lagging.

Thanks very much for the replies so far guys. I did have my serum test levels done, but I think that is all I could have done when it comes to NHS treatment. So I assume I’ll need to find a fully qualified practitioner in this field.

Could you please let me know what kind of specialist I need to seek out to have these tests done, and then when I have found him/her, exactly what kind of test I need to request?

Once I know I’ll get this done asap.

Thanks again!

Thanks for the replies guys, I had my serum test levels done, but as far as I’m aware that’s all I could get done on the NHS. So I’m assuming I’ll need to find a specialist practitioner to get the kind of tests done that you require, however I have no idea what one would be called.

Could you please tell me what kind of specialist I should be seeking out, and when I have found him/her, what kind of test I need to request?

Once I have those bits of information, the next time you’ll hear from me is when I have my results in hand.

Thanks again!!

PrivateMD Labs you can buy blood work requests and take it to your local quest diagnostics. Its $40-$50. No doctor required. Order the Female panel. That will give you everything you need

[quote]Jokeshopbeard wrote:
Thanks for the replies guys, I had my serum test levels done, but as far as I’m aware that’s all I could get done on the NHS. So I’m assuming I’ll need to find a specialist practitioner to get the kind of tests done that you require, however I have no idea what one would be called.

Could you please tell me what kind of specialist I should be seeking out, and when I have found him/her, what kind of test I need to request?

Once I have those bits of information, the next time you’ll hear from me is when I have my results in hand.

Thanks again!![/quote]

Your GP can sort the tests you don’t need a specialist. Just ask the GP, saying you feel off and have looked up your symptoms on the net and it point to low T. Can you get a full hormone panel for piece of mind. If you don’t have health insurance then just tell the GP you use gear. Not like its illegal over here.

You need Test level, LH, FSH, E2, prolactin and SHBG.

Are your balls still shrivelled? Can you maintain or even get a boner?

Try not to worry anyway. These things are in the head a lot of the time.

Start taking vitamin D3 5000iu everyday, plus some ZMA before bed. Might help you pick up slightly.

You can also pay for private blood tests. Blue horizon is a company in the UK. Look on google. Privatebloodtestuk

Thanks very much for all the help guys. I’ll be back when I’ve had my bloods done.