T Nation

Leucine + Insulin


#1

Currently following Carb Cycling Codex to the tee, and need some clarification regarding the supplementation of Leucine. I know Leucine can stimulate the release of insulin. I also know that too much insulin can be bad, especially when dieting down. Should I only be supplementing the leucine peri-workout, or should it be added to the other carb meals as well? In other words, would it help in the aid of fat loss or hinder it? In my avatar, I am around 13%, and am currently more like 15%. Thoughts?


#2

I think CT said that you'd have to consume a shit ton of leucine to spike insulin as much as a bowl of oats. Basically, don't worry about when and how much leucine you consume, peri-or non-peri workout...


#3

I think it would depend if your in a caloric deficit or surplus. I assume you're in a deficit or maintenance so I wouldn't worry about it.


#4

http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/isolated_pecs_big_shoulders_and_instant_ketosis

A safer (and legal) way to accomplish the same thing is to use Leucine for the same purpose as insulin. Leucine is a ketogenic amino acid. It leads to a large (but within your own natural limits) insulin spike. If you don't consume any carbs 1 hour prior and up to 2 hours after ingesting leucine, your blood glucose will lower significantly, helping you reach ketosis faster.

And from 4 pm you only have protein and fat along with ingesting 5-10g of leucine every 2 hours (5 pm, 7 pm, 9 pm, 11 pm for example). The key is no carbs after 3-4 pm.

This will help you get into ketosis much faster and it will be both easier and more effective to diet down while in a low carb state.

Note that this method can be further enhanced by using supplements that enhance insulin sensitivity (R-ALA, fenugreek, fish oil, etc.), the first two ingredients being found in Biotest's Receptor Max and the third in Biotest's Flameout.


#5

Carb cycling doesn't = keto diet


#6

im posting what CT has said in regards to leucine and insulin. ignore the keto part...


#7

it releases stored insulin...but, it doesn't cause insulin to be produced by the pancreas like carbs...it's like a spiking motion...whereas, carbs elicit a sustained secretion of insulin...

and even if insulin is elevated, your body still burns fat...it is total misconception that insulin blunts all fat burning...


#8

true but it DOES decrease SOME fat burning


#9

yes it does decrease fat burning...you add one substrate and the other one goes down...it's how things work...

the same could be said with dietary fat though....if you ingest fat instead of carbs, your body will burn the dietary fat first before your body fat...

thats why i think it's silly to worry about insulin...granted, there are some people who do have legitamite issues eating carbs, as they are insulin resistant...meaning they will over secrete insulin...There problems will most likely be solved when they diet down to a respectable bf %...


#10

agreed. didnt mean to sound like a dick, i was just pointing it out...


#11

you're simplifying this too much here


#12

... i dont think the point of the post was to give a scientific explanation

it was put in lehman's terms and basic in structure on purpose (i think)


#13

I think he doesn't believe in calories in vs calories out..

which means he is a charlatan


#14

"A calorie is the energy needed to raise the temperature of one kilogram of water one degree Celsius. Your body does not literally burn foods like a calorimeter. Different macronutrients (i.e., carbohydrate, fat, and protein) have different effects on hormones, which have different effects on fat storage, and provide different amounts of energy to the body in different ways."


#15

ahhh ok then. we were talking about different things


#16

everyone on this site eats a high protein diet which also means they are eating a certain amount of fat...A certain level of carbs are also needed to perform glycogen dependent exercise like lifting weights...

there is only a couple variables we can change in our diets...switching fat for carbs is somewhat irrelevant at that point and vise versa...

i also know where that quote is from...Taub's is wrong....he based his idea off of a false premise....the research he used to support his ideas were old studies that used self reported data...teh studies claimed obese and lean people ate the same amount of food...yet, we know now that obese people under report how much they eat and thin people over report...

watch that...yeah that is the truth...


#17

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#18

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#19

Oh, macros certainly do affect all of those things...I'm not denying that...

But, If your eating 1.5g x bw in protein and the fat that comes with a protein intake that high...and your eating at least 100g of carbs a day...

you only have so much to work with...i personally don't think it will make a significant difference...If you could give me an example showing how altering macros beyond my example would affect my hormones, I would like to hear it...

I'm not a close minded person looking to argue against people...I post here because I want to hear different opinions...


#20

I guess I'm confused what you're asking? in your example of eating 100 g CHO, you don't see any way that altering that diet would affect any hormones?