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Lesnar vs. Mir 2 - UFC 98, May 23

http://www.ufc.com/index.cfm?fa=news.detail&gid=18276

Who’s gonna be UFC HW Champ?

Lesnar is bigger and stronger, and he dominated the first fight until he slipped up and Mir caught him. I don’t see Lesnar slipping up again. Mir looked dominant in his victory vs. Big Nog (even though Nog really showed his age during that fight), and I think people underestimate Mir’s fighting toolbox.

Either way, should be a great fight to watch!

Mir by heel hook, Lesnar does not protect his legs when he rides his opponent.

Think Lesnar’s way overrated. He beat an old man who hadn’t fought in a year and someone who’s basiclly a tomato can at this point in his career. Everytime he gets someone on the ground he throws nervous choppy hammer fists that barely connect. His stand up did look better than ever in his last outing, but it’s still subpar. With all that I think he has a shot. However, he’s never fought a great striker, and we’ve never seen his chin- or how he reacts to getting tagged in it-tested. Not saying Mir’s a great striker, but if he show’s the same kind of stand up he did against Nog I think he’ll frustrate Lesnar and force him to make another boneheaded mistake.

I think Lesnar wins.

Mir’s striking did look impressive against Nog, but he’s not going to be able to stand and trade with Brock, and if he continually rushes him with combos like he did against Nog, he risks getting taken down.

Let’s face it Mir is far from a powerful striker, and we actually did see Brock’s chin get tested in his fight with Randy. Sure, Randy doesn’t exactly throw bombs either, but I’d say he’s about on level with Mir in that department.

And, if Brock takes him down (which unless Mir manages to KO Brock early, which I doubt will happen, is pretty much an inevitability), it’s going to be a long (or perhaps very short) night for Frank.

I don’t see Brock submitting Frank, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he wins via TKO due to strikes from the ground, or wins a decision via positional dominance.

On the other hand, Frank’s only real chance is to catch Lesnar in another leg lock (which I suspect Brock has been preparing for).

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
I think Lesnar wins.

Mir’s striking did look impressive against Nog, but he’s not going to be able to stand and trade with Brock, and if he continually rushes him with combos like he did against Nog, he risks getting taken down.

Let’s face it Mir is far from a powerful striker, and we actually did see Brock’s chin get tested in his fight with Randy. Sure, Randy doesn’t exactly throw bombs either, but I’d say he’s about on level with Mir in that department.

And, if Brock takes him down (which unless Mir manages to KO Brock early, which I doubt will happen, is pretty much an inevitability), it’s going to be a long (or perhaps very short) night for Frank.

I don’t see Brock submitting Frank, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he wins via TKO due to strikes from the ground, or wins a decision via positional dominance.

On the other hand, Frank’s only real chance is to catch Lesnar in another leg lock (which I suspect Brock has been preparing for).[/quote]

I could be completely wrong, but I think you’re shortchanging Mir. As stated he’s not a hammer thrower, but I do think he’s a better striker than Couture, or at least he was in his last outing. Also, Couture didn’t REALLY test his chin. If Mir gets at him the way he did Nog I don’t think they trade. I see Lesnar getting frustrated and abondoning his gameplan and Mir capitalizing and submitting him. Then again, I could be completely wrong and Lesnar could eat his lunch.

I have Mir on this one. He is the superior striker. He might get taken down easily, but then Lesnar will be stuck in Mir’s guard and in threat of being submitted.

I think Mir was overwhelmed by Lesnar in the first fight. He wasnt sure what hed be fighting now he has a decent idea. Mir does have a ko of wes sims and a couple of tkos so he has power. Itll be interesting i think th person that controls the ground game wins. Wrestling vs bjj

Mir is a much better with submissions then lesnar, Lesnar is gona come out throwing strikes like a monkey and hes gona slip and Mir will Submit him.

[quote]drewh wrote:
I think Mir was overwhelmed by Lesnar in the first fight. He wasnt sure what hed be fighting now he has a decent idea.
[/quote]

Yes, he was overwhelmed, and frankly (no pun intended) I think he’ll be overwhelmed again. He is absolutely no match for Lesnar physically, he will be fighting a more experienced and better Lesnar than the one he fought in that fight, and he won’t be bailed out with a bullshit stand-up and point deduction against Lesnar when he is being pounded on this time around.

[quote]
Mir does have a ko of wes sims and a couple of tkos so he has power. Itll be interesting i think th person that controls the ground game wins. Wrestling vs bjj[/quote]

Did you watch that fight with Wes Sims? I did, and both Mir and Wes looked horrible. It was actually pretty sad how long it took Frank to KO him and anyone with any substantial power would have done so much, much sooner in that fight.

If you are giving Mir the advantage due to his win in that fight, I think you really need to go back and watch that fight again.

As far as the “person who controls the ground wins” theory, yeah I’ll agree with that. But I’m gonna say that the bigger, stronger, superior wrestler is going to be victorious in that department (really don’t know how anyone can argue that with what we’ve seen from other such match-ups, i.e. GSP vs Penn 2 anyone?).

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
I think Lesnar wins.

Mir’s striking did look impressive against Nog, but he’s not going to be able to stand and trade with Brock, and if he continually rushes him with combos like he did against Nog, he risks getting taken down.

Let’s face it Mir is far from a powerful striker, and we actually did see Brock’s chin get tested in his fight with Randy. Sure, Randy doesn’t exactly throw bombs either, but I’d say he’s about on level with Mir in that department.

And, if Brock takes him down (which unless Mir manages to KO Brock early, which I doubt will happen, is pretty much an inevitability), it’s going to be a long (or perhaps very short) night for Frank.

I don’t see Brock submitting Frank, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he wins via TKO due to strikes from the ground, or wins a decision via positional dominance.

On the other hand, Frank’s only real chance is to catch Lesnar in another leg lock (which I suspect Brock has been preparing for).[/quote]

Hard to argue with this statement.

Unless Brock has a brain fart and leaves a limb exposed or suffers a flash KO, I don’t see him losing to Mir again.

I’m gonna go with Mir. Lesner is getting better but I dont think he’s as good as he thinks he is.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:
drewh wrote:
I think Mir was overwhelmed by Lesnar in the first fight. He wasnt sure what hed be fighting now he has a decent idea.

Yes, he was overwhelmed, and frankly (no pun intended) I think he’ll be overwhelmed again. He is absolutely no match for Lesnar physically, he will be fighting a more experienced and better Lesnar than the one he fought in that fight, and he won’t be bailed out with a bullshit stand-up and point deduction against Lesnar when he is being pounded on this time around.

Mir does have a ko of wes sims and a couple of tkos so he has power. Itll be interesting i think th person that controls the ground game wins. Wrestling vs bjj

Did you watch that fight with Wes Sims? I did, and both Mir and Wes looked horrible. It was actually pretty sad how long it took Frank to KO him and anyone with any substantial power would have done so much, much sooner in that fight.

If you are giving Mir the advantage due to his win in that fight, I think you really need to go back and watch that fight again.

As far as the “person who controls the ground wins” theory, yeah I’ll agree with that. But I’m gonna say that the bigger, stronger, superior wrestler is going to be victorious in that department (really don’t know how anyone can argue that with what we’ve seen from other such match-ups, i.e. GSP vs Penn 2 anyone?).[/quote]

I was just trying to say he has some power. This is a litlle different than penn gsp thoughgsp is a bjj black belt a jj black belt has learned some judo and is the best wrestler in the ufc. I dont think Lesnar has the same pedigree.

[quote]drewh wrote:
Sentoguy wrote:
drewh wrote:
I think Mir was overwhelmed by Lesnar in the first fight. He wasnt sure what hed be fighting now he has a decent idea.

Yes, he was overwhelmed, and frankly (no pun intended) I think he’ll be overwhelmed again. He is absolutely no match for Lesnar physically, he will be fighting a more experienced and better Lesnar than the one he fought in that fight, and he won’t be bailed out with a bullshit stand-up and point deduction against Lesnar when he is being pounded on this time around.

Mir does have a ko of wes sims and a couple of tkos so he has power. Itll be interesting i think th person that controls the ground game wins. Wrestling vs bjj

Did you watch that fight with Wes Sims? I did, and both Mir and Wes looked horrible. It was actually pretty sad how long it took Frank to KO him and anyone with any substantial power would have done so much, much sooner in that fight.

If you are giving Mir the advantage due to his win in that fight, I think you really need to go back and watch that fight again.

As far as the “person who controls the ground wins” theory, yeah I’ll agree with that. But I’m gonna say that the bigger, stronger, superior wrestler is going to be victorious in that department (really don’t know how anyone can argue that with what we’ve seen from other such match-ups, i.e. GSP vs Penn 2 anyone?).

I was just trying to say he has some power. This is a litlle different than penn gsp thoughgsp is a bjj black belt a jj black belt has learned some judo and is the best wrestler in the ufc. I dont think Lesnar has the same pedigree. [/quote]

No, Lesnar is certainly not a bjj black belt, but he is a 2x Div. 1 National champion wrestler. Mir also isn’t a former world champion in BJJ like Penn. So, it’s not like either fighter is on the same skill level as GSP or Penn.

But the comparison is still a valid one. You have a much bigger, stronger, more athletic wrestler vs. a smaller, more experienced BJJ fighter. I really don’t see the BJJ guy dominating the ground game in this one, that’s all I was saying with that comparison.

roberto travern

[quote]drewh wrote:
roberto travern[/quote]

What about him? That he lost to Mir via an armbar?

bjj champ who lost to Mir. Mirs bjj is world class imo. Im predicting mir win via gogoplata

The most exciting thing about Lesnar fights is that they are incredibly hard to predict. Even if he is completely overmatched on paper, he can end a fight with a single shot. Doesn’t even have to be a good shot.

Mir is exciting for the same reason. In the past, he has shown absolutly brutal submissions. Very quick and explosive. He doesn’t give you much time to counter.

I like Brock in this one becuase he doesn’t have to win by catching Mir, where as Mir has to catch Brock to win. If anyone is going to ride out a decision or systematically wear his opponent down, it’s going to be Brock.

This is a much better match-up than Heath or Randy. Style-wise, Mir is probably the worst match-up for Brock in the division. I can’t wait to see this one.

I hate to say it, but I see Lesnar having a good chance of winning this one. I hate that he got the title after only 3 fights, but he won it and he is the champ.

I can’t really call who’s gonna win this one. Mir has the skill to take Lesnar out, but like someone else stated Mir is going to have to win it. If it comes down to a decision I can see Lesnar grinding this one out for the win.

I am sure that if Lesnar leaves any opportunities open Mir is going to eat him up. However we’ve been training under a formerly international ranked wrestler once a week and I can attest to just how brutal they can be on the ground.

Not trying to start a BJJ vs wrestling thing here, but I know that if Lesnar uses his wrestling well, control from the top will not be a problem.

There shouldnt be an argument people should realize its all about skillz.

This will be interesting. I think Lesner will win this time, as he should have won the first as he was on his way to a TKO before a iffy ref stoppage, but then again, Mir has TKO’ed Noguira which has never happened to Nogueria before. Will be interesting, great card to. Hughes and Serra to!