T Nation

Kind of Sums It Up Nicely

http://switch5.castup.net/frames/20041020_MemriTV_Popup/video_480x360.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

Syrian native Wafa Sultan hammering a fundamentalist on Al-Jazeera television.

She was named last year to Time Magazine’s list of 100 influential people in the world.

I had completely forgotten about this, sorry if it’s been posted before.

I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.

[quote]rugbyhit wrote:
http://switch5.castup.net/frames/20041020_MemriTV_Popup/video_480x360.asp?ai=214&ar=1050wmv&ak=null

Syrian native Wafa Sultan hammering a fundamentalist on Al-Jazeera television.

She was named last year to Time Magazine’s list of 100 influential people in the world.

I had completely forgotten about this, sorry if it’s been posted before.

I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.[/quote]

I’ve have seen this before, but it was worth watching again. She is BRAVE. I predict she won’t live long, but I like what she said. The loudest followers of islam demand respect through violence and all it is leading to is world wide disdain for all things islamic.

Even Islam’s staunchest defenders will fall by the wayside if indefensible acts of violence continue. Heck, they have no qualms about killing fellow muslims who don’t agree with them. I assume one day, they’ll have enough.

Yep pretty much all that needs to be said

[quote]rugbyhit wrote:
I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.
…[/quote]

She isn’t Muslim. She says so very clearly in the interview itself. Don’t know what her exact words were but it went something like: “I’m not a Muslim, not a Christian and not Jewish. I’m a secular human-being.”

At one point the opponent asked her if she’s an atheist, she dodged the question and didn’t answer it.

I’m usually skeptical of things out of the MEMRI, but this was kind of interesting to hear. Definitely not a line of thinking you often hear in Arabic.

Does she live in the states?

Anyone knows where I can fetch the unedited video of the show? The one posted is severly truncated.
Don’t matter if it’s not translated.

Thanks,

[quote]lixy wrote:
At one point the opponent asked her if she’s an atheist, she dodged the question and didn’t answer it.

[/quote]

He asked her if she was a heritic, not an athiest.

[quote]lixy wrote:
rugbyhit wrote:
I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.

She isn’t Muslim. She says so very clearly in the interview itself. Don’t know what her exact words were but it went something like: “I’m not a Muslim, not a Christian and not Jewish. I’m a secular human-being.”

At one point the opponent asked her if she’s an atheist, she dodged the question and didn’t answer it.

I’m usually skeptical of things out of the MEMRI, but this was kind of interesting to hear. Definitely not a line of thinking you often hear in Arabic.

Does she live in the states?[/quote]

Yes, she lives in the United States. She wouldn’t be allowed to have a voice as a woman in a middle eastern country.
I have several Indian muslim friends who refer to muslims in the middle east as backward heretics who pervert their religion. From what I have read and understand, the Arabic countries feel that way about the rest of the muslim world. India, Pakistan, and Indonesia are dismissed by the Arab world and are considered second class citizens.
I think this “class” struggle within Islam is going to grow as India and Indonesia become more educated and technologically savvy. The middle east will continue to slide into religious extremism and ignorance.

[quote]lixy wrote:
rugbyhit wrote:
I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.

She isn’t Muslim. She says so very clearly in the interview itself. Don’t know what her exact words were but it went something like: “I’m not a Muslim, not a Christian and not Jewish. I’m a secular human-being.”

At one point the opponent asked her if she’s an atheist, she dodged the question and didn’t answer it.

I’m usually skeptical of things out of the MEMRI, but this was kind of interesting to hear. Definitely not a line of thinking you often hear in Arabic.

Does she live in the states?[/quote]

Lixy,
Honest question?
As you point out, she isnt religious, so you say not a Muslim, but she used to be (she turned away from Islam after a group of Muslim Brotherhood murderers killed her professor), but what of her argument against the actions of Islam? Does her statement of being a secular human detract from her statements/insights in your eyes?

Last I knew she lived in Califonia.

[quote]rugbyhit wrote:
lixy wrote:
rugbyhit wrote:
I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.

She isn’t Muslim. She says so very clearly in the interview itself. Don’t know what her exact words were but it went something like: “I’m not a Muslim, not a Christian and not Jewish. I’m a secular human-being.”

At one point the opponent asked her if she’s an atheist, she dodged the question and didn’t answer it.

I’m usually skeptical of things out of the MEMRI, but this was kind of interesting to hear. Definitely not a line of thinking you often hear in Arabic.

Does she live in the states?

Lixy,
Honest question?
As you point out, she isnt religious, so you say not a Muslim, but she used to be (she turned away from Islam after a group of Muslim Brotherhood murderers killed her professor), but what of her argument against the actions of Islam? Does her statement of being a secular human detract from her statements/insights in your eyes?

Last I knew she lived in Califonia.

[/quote]

I have to admire her for risking her life and speaking out. The nazis used to hunt down Germans who spoke out against their satanism and I’d bet she’s being hunted down now.

Damnned satanists…

[quote]pat36 wrote:
He asked her if she was a heritic, not an athiest.[/quote]

No, that was a MEMRI’s twist!

He asked the lady if she was “moulhida”, that’s female form for “atheist”.

[quote]rugbyhit wrote:
Honest question?
As you point out, she isnt religious, so you say not a Muslim, but she used to be (she turned away from Islam after a group of Muslim Brotherhood murderers killed her professor), but what of her argument against the actions of Islam? Does her statement of being a secular human detract from her statements/insights in your eyes? [/quote]

Hard to believe you’re actually being serious! I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.

I don’t hold people’s religion against them, may they be Jewish, Christians, Buddhists, Scientologists, Zoroastrians or atheists. What a person believes or doesn’t believe is his/her own business. It adds nor detracts nothing from the ability to reason or see things as they are.

I pointed out that she wasn’t Muslim in response to your initial comment;

[quote]rugbyhit wrote:
I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.[/quote]

Hoping it clears things up!

[quote]lixy wrote:
rugbyhit wrote:
Honest question?
As you point out, she isnt religious, so you say not a Muslim, but she used to be (she turned away from Islam after a group of Muslim Brotherhood murderers killed her professor), but what of her argument against the actions of Islam? Does her statement of being a secular human detract from her statements/insights in your eyes?

Hard to believe you’re actually being serious! I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.

I don’t hold people’s religion against them, may they be Jewish, Christians, Buddhists, Scientologists, Zoroastrians or atheists. What a person believes or doesn’t believe is his/her own business. It adds nor detracts nothing from the ability to reason or see things as they are.

I pointed out that she wasn’t Muslim in response to your initial comment;

rugbyhit wrote:
I’d like to believe that there are more Muslim’s with her point of view, but it seems unlikly.

Hoping it clears things up![/quote]

Yes, it clears it up. You just jumped on that point so quickly it left me with the impression that you some how discounted her views because she wasnt Muslim. Sorry to have jumped to conclusions. Like I said, honest question.

So with that out of the way, what are your thoughts on her statements? Did anything stand out as particularly thought provoking or outright dribble? I only ask because you seemed intrigued by it.

[quote]rugbyhit wrote:
So with that out of the way, what are your thoughts on her statements? Did anything stand out as particularly thought provoking or outright dribble? I only ask because you seemed intrigued by it. [/quote]

What got my attention was that such vociferous language is very rarely voiced in Arabic from fear of the obvious consequences. The thought provoking part is obviously the fact that most of modern terrorism stems out of Islamist extremists. No matter how you look at it, it has fostered in Arab countries to the point of making walking in the streets unsafe. Did you hear about the couple of dozen people blown up yesterday in Algiers? The dozen dead in the explosion in the Iraqi parliament today? The five victims of terrorism in Casablanca two days ago? It’s seriously scary!

I naturally try to mitigate the problem by blaming the US-backed regimes in Arabs countries for smuthering Arab nationalism, but, deep down, I feel ashamed my grand-parents didn’t stand up to those dictators. I’m even more ashamed I don’t do it. I know enough people who mysteriously disappeared, were tortured or emprisoned for just speaking out against the regime. Plus, babbling is not gonna change the situation anytime soon. Political reform is impossible by the very nature of the dictatorships in place. It leaves only one solution and that is sadly the one most people go for: violent terrorism; the consequences of which are only to reinforce the dictators’ powers with all sorts of “patriot acts”. What’s the scariest is that even though I have an utter disgust of the extremist islamists’ doctrines and methods, I see them as the only real challenger to the status quo. At what cost? Lot of blood and slipping from an oligargichal and nepotic dictatorship into a theocratic one. Yet, it’s the only hope most people see…

That was for the thought provoking part.

As far as dribble is concerned, she did say a few bits that don’t pack much coherency; keep in mind that the video in question was edited by the MEMRI.

I don’t recall all of them but on top of my head, she did ask whether Jews bombed any German cafes. I don’t think they ever did, but in Palestine Moshe Dayan and his terrorist crew was doing horrific things. Moreover, she mentionned Islamists’ attacks on synagogues and churches but fails to see that numerous mosques were torched in the US and Europe after 9/11. Then she goes on rattling about how intellectually superior Jewish people are. Not to mention her distorted interpretation of the Quran and the Hadith.

Other than that, she’s a very courageous gall.

I found the full length speech of the show (is there anything Wikipedia can’t do?) but it’s in audio only. Here it is for those of you who
don’t like their info from one-sided sources.

http://www.aljazeera.net/mritems/streams/2006/2/21/1_599171_1_13.wma

[quote]lixy wrote:
pat36 wrote:
He asked her if she was a heritic, not an athiest.

No, that was a MEMRI’s twist!

He asked the lady if she was “moulhida”, that’s female form for “atheist”.[/quote]

Fair enough, I certainly don’t speak arabic.

Well, you are talking cheddar when it is clearly Brie time.

Her point was the the Jews did not and do not attack german buisnesses and german people in response to the holocaust.

Mosques and Arab looking people were attacked after 9/11, 700 incidents of hate crimes were reported to the Arab Anti-Disrimination League in the month after the attacks.

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=159

Those incidents were terrible, but the Muslim religion has a long history of intolerance of other religions:

-The destruction of the Buddhist statues in Afganistan.

-Rioters in Bierut burned churches in response to the cartoons of mohammed

-Protestant churches are attacked in Turkey

-A muslim convert to christianity was condemned to death in Afganistan
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/03/22/afghan.christian/index.html

-Assyrian nuns attacked in Iraq (prior to the war)
http://www.aina.org/releases/cecilia.htm

-Churches attacked in Indonesia http://www.asianews.it/view.php?l=en&art=7313

-Orthodox church attacked by muslims in Serbia http://www.kosovo.net/news/archive/ticker/2005/February_01/13.html

I google searched “Islam attack church” to find these articles.

To be fair, I searched “Christian attack mosque” and “Catholic attack mosque” and found one incident in Scotland (bottles thrown through windows of a mosque) and references to the 1998 revenge burnings of mosques and churches in Indonesia.