T Nation

Keeping Gains, Decent Info?

I was talking to a guy who had been trying to find people’s opinion on using gear, He reckoned that most people kept about half their gains when they went ‘off’. He seemed to think this was worth it, however I asked a few more questions and it seemed that this keeping half was based on an ‘off’ period of about 6 months, with another cycle following.

My question (maybe I’m asking the wrong people, i.e. active juicers) how permanent are the gains (after the initial loss)? in other words if someone goes off for an extended period (say 4 or 5 years)do their gains eventually disapear? I know it will depend on compound(s) used cycle length training regime PCT etc but anyone got ideas (or even better 1st hand experience)?

This is such a broad question I doubt you get many responses. These are the variables that determine what you keep:

Compounds

  • Are you holding a lot of water weight that you will lose during PCT, are you using very suppressive drugs or very suppressive dosages?

PCT

  • Are you using a good protocol, are you taking advantage of the different drugs available (hcg, serms, peptides, etc.) and are you using them effectively?

Habits

  • Do you drink or party too much?

Workout regimen

  • Are you maintaining good workouts and a consistent workout schedule even though your not still on cycle?

Diet

  • This is one of the biggest things. Do you maintain a good and well thought out diet plan year round, or are you using aas to make up for your lack of commitment to the kitchen.

Genetic potential

  • Have you reached your natural genetic potential?

From my own personal experience I pretty much keep all my LBM gains and lose the water weight. However I can say with confidence that positively adhere to the above criteria.

[quote]dean12345 wrote:
This is such a broad question I doubt you get many responses. These are the variables that determine what you keep:

Compounds

  • Are you holding a lot of water weight that you will lose during PCT, are you using very suppressive drugs or very suppressive dosages?

PCT

  • Are you using a good protocol, are you taking advantage of the different drugs available (hcg, serms, peptides, etc.) and are you using them effectively?

Habits

  • Do you drink or party too much?

Workout regimen

  • Are you maintaining good workouts and a consistent workout schedule even though your not still on cycle?

Diet

  • This is one of the biggest things. Do you maintain a good and well thought out diet plan year round, or are you using aas to make up for your lack of commitment to the kitchen.

Genetic potential

  • Have you reached your natural genetic potential?

From my own personal experience I pretty much keep all my LBM gains and lose the water weight. However I can say with confidence that positively adhere to the above criteria.[/quote]

Good post. I would add that if you have managed to bring yourself well above your genetic potential and then stay off for a long period of time then you can follow all of the above conditions and you are still going to lose mass. However, you do not have to lose everything that you gained from cycle 1. You should be able to maintain a pretty good, but not enormous, body off cycle for a long time.

\cheers for the response, I know it was broad but didn’t think it was worth trying to tighten up too much.
On a similar vein, I have heard from several people that strength after a cycle or two ( a LONG time after) remains higher than it would’ve been. Ligament / tendon strength is the usual explanation; however I’m more inclined to think it’s neurological and, possibly, psychological (i.e. confidence).