T Nation

Keep Going With Bench?

well latetly this is how my bench training has been working. ive been doing 5x5 every 8 days for 3 weeks then taking a back off week and adding 5 pounds each week. doing straight sets. i started at a paused bench max of 245

week sets
1 195x5x5
2 200x4x5
3 205x5x5
4 back off
5 210x4x5
6 215x4x5
7 220x2x5
8 220x4x5
9 back off
10 225x4x5
11 230x3x5
12 235x4x5

ive oviously feel pretty fitigued and tired altetly, as i am on the brink of over training. i feel i have a few choices.

Choices:

  1. back off but make it a week and a half back off and keep moving up for more prs

  2. take a full week off of benching then
    go back down to 225x5x5 and keep moving up and try to move up and hit lots of prs again

  3. take a full week off of bench and then keep adding weight but with 3x3 and hit prs that way. but touch n go, as i have been pausing everything for a very long time.

im most partial to choice 1, but was just wondering.

oppinions?

am I reading correctly that you went from a 1rm of 245 to doing 4 sets of 5 with 235 12 weeks later? Or is that just a projection? If you were able to make that kind of improvement, dont change what you’re doing until you actually stagnate.

Man if its working dont stop. Or why not stick to 5x5 and progress you arent doing 5x5 any more stick at a load until you get it. say you get 3x5 and 2x4 come back the next week same load but aim to improve on that, Might also think about chaning it up a bit. throw in a bit higher rep will aid joints etc, some sets of 8-10 then maybe sets of 3-1.

Or if feeling beta up kee doing what you are except every other week have a deload one like you are every three and then between that a not realy de load but higher rep still intense but its different a different stimulus.

Like
5x5
4x8 75% approx
5x5
deload
etc etc…

but hell that progress ride it out man though it seems to have stalled a bit lately for instance these two weeks

Those are essetially the same total poundage was actually a LOT less, 360lbs less from week 10-week 11

hows the rest on these consistant??

Prob not a lot of help buit more quetions you can ask to help you maybe or add to confusion

[quote]KBCThird wrote:
am I reading correctly that you went from a 1rm of 245 to doing 4 sets of 5 with 235 12 weeks later? Or is that just a projection? If you were able to make that kind of improvement, dont change what you’re doing until you actually stagnate.[/quote]

He said 245 with a pause. If I were you I would go to a 3x3 or 4x3 workout. The volume isn’t that much and would let you recover without actually stopping. The reason I would do this is that when you just take a week off to rest, sometimes it can take another week to get back into it and all of the sudden you’ve stagnated for 2 weeks. If you are overtraining just lower the volume.

[quote]tveddy wrote:
KBCThird wrote:
am I reading correctly that you went from a 1rm of 245 to doing 4 sets of 5 with 235 12 weeks later? Or is that just a projection? If you were able to make that kind of improvement, dont change what you’re doing until you actually stagnate.

He said 245 with a pause. [/quote]

Ive never tested the relationship between my 1rm pause bench and what I can rep for 4 sets of 5

The quickest way to avoid stagnation is to change your reps. In fact, you have probably have become very efficient with sets of 5 as far as energy system needs, reflexes etc.

I would switch to triples and ride that for a while, still 5 sets. You are not at a plateau but you are feeling burned out.

Or cut to just 2 sets of 5 for 3 weeks, but try do

240/245

Then 245/250 then

250/255

[quote]KBCThird wrote:
tveddy wrote:
KBCThird wrote:
am I reading correctly that you went from a 1rm of 245 to doing 4 sets of 5 with 235 12 weeks later? Or is that just a projection? If you were able to make that kind of improvement, dont change what you’re doing until you actually stagnate.

He said 245 with a pause.

Ive never tested the relationship between my 1rm pause bench and what I can rep for 4 sets of 5[/quote]

all my reps of my sets are paused on my chest if that was of any confusion

[quote]Phill wrote:
Man if its working dont stop. Or why not stick to 5x5 and progress you arent doing 5x5 any more stick at a load until you get it. say you get 3x5 and 2x4 come back the next week same load but aim to improve on that, Might also think about chaning it up a bit. throw in a bit higher rep will aid joints etc, some sets of 8-10 then maybe sets of 3-1.

Or if feeling beta up kee doing what you are except every other week have a deload one like you are every three and then between that a not realy de load but higher rep still intense but its different a different stimulus.

Like
5x5
4x8 75% approx
5x5
deload
etc etc…

but hell that progress ride it out man though it seems to have stalled a bit lately for instance these two weeks

10 225x4x5
11 230x3x5

Those are essetially the same total poundage was actually a LOT less, 360lbs less from week 10-week 11

hows the rest on these consistant??

Prob not a lot of help buit more quetions you can ask to help you maybe or add to confusion

[/quote]

i like some of the ideas you posted. ill definitly give it all some thought. the 4x8 on week 2 seems like an interesting idea. the rest isnt exactly consistant. as its been getting heavyer ive been just giving myself enough time till like i feel i can handle the next set of 5.

[quote]mertdawg wrote:
The quickest way to avoid stagnation is to change your reps. In fact, you have probably have become very efficient with sets of 5 as far as energy system needs, reflexes etc.

I would switch to triples and ride that for a while, still 5 sets. You are not at a plateau but you are feeling burned out.

Or cut to just 2 sets of 5 for 3 weeks, but try do

240/245

Then 245/250 then

250/255

[/quote]

yah i looks like im gonna keep going with the 5s. if it starts to get real heavy maybe ill drop the sets to 3 or 2. but then after i stop making progress with that then ill drop to the 5 sets of 3.

[quote]redsox348984 wrote:
mertdawg wrote:
The quickest way to avoid stagnation is to change your reps. In fact, you have probably have become very efficient with sets of 5 as far as energy system needs, reflexes etc.

I would switch to triples and ride that for a while, still 5 sets. You are not at a plateau but you are feeling burned out.

Or cut to just 2 sets of 5 for 3 weeks, but try do

240/245

Then 245/250 then

250/255

yah i looks like im gonna keep going with the 5s. if it starts to get real heavy maybe ill drop the sets to 3 or 2. but then after i stop making progress with that then ill drop to the 5 sets of 3.[/quote]

oh im stupid the first time i read your post i wasent really paying enough attention i guess. i was think you meant to do around 240 to 245 for my sets of 5, not 1 set of 5 with 240 and 1 set with 245 lol. thats actually an interesting idea. i might give that a go as the volume is lowe rand will probly prevent be from feeling as beat up.

i was also considering changing my week to a 9 day week. as i am already on an 8 day week. there already were a couple occasions during this where i took the extra day rest and used a 9 day week

I like rotating exercises more often than rep ranges. When you stagnate you might want to switch up the movements. Do some floor press or DB bench for a few weeks, come back and you’ll be stronger than ever.

[quote]Donut62 wrote:
I like rotating exercises more often than rep ranges. When you stagnate you might want to switch up the movements. Do some floor press or DB bench for a few weeks, come back and you’ll be stronger than ever.[/quote]

no no no. Rotate reps first, exercises later.

That’s some impressive progress. How do your shoulders feel? Do you balance the benchpressing with exercises for your upper back?

[quote]redsox348984 wrote:

ive oviously feel pretty fitigued and tired altetly, as i am on the brink of over training. i feel i have a few choices.
…[/quote]

This is a red flag guys.

Why encourage him to keep at it. Do you want him to collapse? To you want him to tear a triceps or hurt his shoulders?

I would back off for a week, doing light db work perhaps. Low weight, high reps.
Then ease back into it, going heavier with db’s, rotating reps for another 2-3 weeks.
This would mean, lay off benching for at least a month. I would prefer 6 weeks actually.

And in the future, rotate reps frequently.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
That’s some impressive progress. How do your shoulders feel? Do you balance the benchpressing with exercises for your upper back?

redsox348984 wrote:

ive oviously feel pretty fitigued and tired altetly, as i am on the brink of over training. i feel i have a few choices.

This is a red flag guys.

Why encourage him to keep at it. Do you want him to collapse? To you want him to tear a triceps or hurt his shoulders?

I would back off for a week, doing light db work perhaps. Low weight, high reps.
Then ease back into it, going heavier with db’s, rotating reps for another 2-3 weeks.
This would mean, lay off benching for at least a month. I would prefer 6 weeks actually.

And in the future, rotate reps frequently.[/quote]

my shoulders feel fine. for back i do 5 sets of dumbell rows and 5 sets of lat pulldown each week.

i have never injured myself before and i feel no pain, so i don’t really see much of a reason to be worryed about injury.

on my back off week i already do dumbell work for low weight high reps actually. last time 65 pounds dumbells 3x10 on my back off week.

maybe laying off bench for that long would be a good idea, but you gotta understnad it would be almost impossible for me to do that, because i am making very good gains right now in bench.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
That’s some impressive progress. How do your shoulders feel? Do you balance the benchpressing with exercises for your upper back?

redsox348984 wrote:

ive oviously feel pretty fitigued and tired altetly, as i am on the brink of over training. i feel i have a few choices.

This is a red flag guys.

Why encourage him to keep at it. Do you want him to collapse? To you want him to tear a triceps or hurt his shoulders?

I would back off for a week, doing light db work perhaps. Low weight, high reps.
Then ease back into it, going heavier with db’s, rotating reps for another 2-3 weeks.
This would mean, lay off benching for at least a month. I would prefer 6 weeks actually.

And in the future, rotate reps frequently.[/quote]

My reasoning is that in the low to mid 2’s for sets of 5, he’s is still learning to push hard. At that stage, I truly benefitted from the basic system of going for 3 weeks at about 5 sets and then cutting drastically to just 2 hard sets for at least 3 weeks. It was in the 3 cut back weeks that my weights jumped, but I cut back all of my volume.

My basic progression for (total) VOLUME is:

Week 1: 60%
Week 2: 80%
Week 3: 100%-overreaching
Weeks 4-6 taper: 40%

I think people need to modify based on that cycle, but every new cycle you can either pick a new rep scheme: 2-6 on heavy days, or a new exercise.

Another idea is to bring your hands in each week but try to keep the same weigh-Normal (wide), Medium, Medium/Close, Close. By that time you should be 10% stronger.

[quote]redsox348984 wrote:
oh im stupid the first time i read your post i wasent really paying enough attention i guess. i was think you meant to do around 240 to 245 for my sets of 5, not 1 set of 5 with 240 and 1 set with 245 lol. thats actually an interesting idea. i might give that a go as the volume is lowe rand will probly prevent be from feeling as beat up.[/quote]

Great hope something helps.

The rest then really its tough to gauge how much you progressed I mean say you started at 225 5x5 and only rested 2 mins, then you jump up 10 lbs but rest 3 mins, Your fresher you rest more Is that really progress.

I on anything Im repping not using maximal loads like say going for a new 1-3 RM then Ill rest as much as I feel needed. or heck even if I go for a 5 or 8RM. This is one all out set.

But then if doing sets of reps ala 5x5, 4x8, 10x3, 3x3, etc I pick and stick to a rest period any where from 1-3 mins usually, stick to that and thats really the only real way to judge if youve advanced or just rested more. Can also help you gauge how much you need to rest when going for maximal presses.

Best of Luck,Nice work
Phill

[quote]Phill wrote:
redsox348984 wrote:
oh im stupid the first time i read your post i wasent really paying enough attention i guess. i was think you meant to do around 240 to 245 for my sets of 5, not 1 set of 5 with 240 and 1 set with 245 lol. thats actually an interesting idea. i might give that a go as the volume is lowe rand will probly prevent be from feeling as beat up.

Great hope something helps.

The rest then really its tough to gauge how much you progressed I mean say you started at 225 5x5 and only rested 2 mins, then you jump up 10 lbs but rest 3 mins, Your fresher you rest more Is that really progress.

I on anything Im repping not using maximal loads like say going for a new 1-3 RM then Ill rest as much as I feel needed. or heck even if I go for a 5 or 8RM. This is one all out set.

But then if doing sets of reps ala 5x5, 4x8, 10x3, 3x3, etc I pick and stick to a rest period any where from 1-3 mins usually, stick to that and thats really the only real way to judge if youve advanced or just rested more. Can also help you gauge how much you need to rest when going for maximal presses.

Best of Luck,Nice work
Phill
[/quote]

well the reason ive been resting until i feel ready is because every week i have been going for PRs. my best set of 5 paused before i started this was 210. so i know i have progressed

You guys sound like addicted gamblers on a roll.

Take your profits and walk away from the table.

I still suggest you stop pushing yourself. You’ve been at it for 12 weeks. Now give yourself a couple of weeks rest. What’s the worst that could happen? You loose some of the gains?

That’s not the nightmare scenario. The nightmare scenario is that you get hurt, will have to lay off for weeks or months and loose ALL your gains.

But hey, it’s your body.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
You guys sound like addicted gamblers on a roll.

Take your profits and walk away from the table.

I still suggest you stop pushing yourself. You’ve been at it for 12 weeks. Now give yourself a couple of weeks rest. What’s the worst that could happen? You loose some of the gains?

That’s not the nightmare scenario. The nightmare scenario is that you get hurt, will have to lay off for weeks or months and loose ALL your gains.

But hey, it’s your body.[/quote]

well i do take back off weeks, which does give the body some time to recover. i feel no pain when working out so i dont see why i should be worryed about injuring myself at all. i means if like my shoudlers were bothering me and stuff i would be more worryed. i am gonna give myself a longer back off week this time so i cna get a little more time to recover