T Nation

Just Starting. Looking for Advice


Ok so I've been working out on and off for about 6 months and I have really enjoyed it and seen some decent gains, Im ready to take it up a notch. Im 6'6" about 245-250 and my last body fat measurement (5 weeks ago and I was 10-15 lbs heavier) was 22%.

Im currently taking Oxy Elite Pro, ANS Muscle Maxx (yes I learned quickly and I will NEVER visit GNC again!) and Muscle Milk 100% Whey Protein (mainly because its cheap).

My Questions are;

What is a good Pre Workout formula? I understand its different for everyone but what has worked well for you?

What protein should I take, if any at all, If Im trying to lean out a bit?

Do ECA (Ephedrine Caffeine Aspirin) stacks work better than a regular thermogenic?

I would appreciate any advice..thanks in advance


Since you have been at it for six months:

Pre work out: A good diet. Period.

What protein?: Fish, Meat, Fowl

ECA: Old school fat burner that a certain guy, (that shall remain nameless) popularize. Better or worse is not the question. A proper diet will help you loose fat. Fat burners will only help, but does jack shit if you dont have a proper diet.


Ive been a little slack recently but when i was working out most consistently (before summer school started) my diet was roughly

5 AM- Multi Vitamin and Oxy Elite 16Oz water and 20g protein bar
7 AM- 32 OZ Water Another Protein Bar
10 AM- 6in Subway sandwich Turkey lettuce tomato oil and vinegar on wheat (no cheese) 32Oz water
3 PM- Post workout protein shake (About 2 Liters of water during workout)
6 PM- Chicken breast or Tilapia with steamed veggies and occasionally brown rice

and by "Which Protein should I take" I meant protein supplements/powder...my bad


Let me rephrase.


Your days are filled with supplements. You add supplement when your diet is good, you dont take supplements to replace food.

Get rid of the bar, most are filled with crap anyways. Good in a pinch, but twice a day? Oatmeal, eggs, cottage cheese, etc

And you are not eating enough.


I'm gonna have to second JFG. Eat more food. Hell, I'll even second exactly what food he mentioned. Eggs, oats, meat, and fowl are all awesome. I don't like cheese, especially cottage cheese, but I'll acknowledge its health benefits. Drink milk. Maybe some fruit? I like bananas before and after workouts. How many calories are you getting per day?


I was worried that I wasnt eating enough... The reason I use protein bars is because I go to work from 5 am to 10 am then school from about 1030am till 845pm most days so carrying actual food isn't convenient. On those days I work out in the morning or before bed (which I hate).

So on the days Im not at school I should ditch the protein bars and eat actual protein and probably more slow carbs (sweet potatoes and whole grains) ?


Lunch box? They have come a long way since my days. I guess you can still get a Happy Days box, but look into thermal bags.

Go to wal mart, get a bunch of good containers (glass jars with snap on lids are amazing), prep your food in the morning or the night before or for the week.

Its all about time management.


Cook things ahead of time and just warm them up when you're hungry. I usually have a big ass tub of beef and rice or chicken and rice in my fridge so I can shovel some real food down quickly.


Since were on the diet subject what are your thoughts on Olive Oil and Balsamic Vinegar to add flavor to white meat chicken? From a health standpoint of course


That's a basic vinaigrette. Excellent. I also use it on tuna.


No protein powders? todays protein powders are vastly superior to any food protein. and who wants to cook, meat, fish, fowl, 7x per day.


The whole idea that most of your protein should come for foods, is old world thinking. I eat 7x per day. I only have 1 solid meal per day. the rest are protein shakes. I also take a good vitamin/mineral pill. and numerous others. protein is protein. except, protein powders get in your blood alot faster and are more potent than just food.


It went completely over your head.

If all you take is protein powder, its called the Velocity Diet.

Old world, new world, doesnt matter. If you ignore the basics, well, good luck with that.

If you want to drink 7 shakes a day, go nuts. Once you stop, let me know how you feel and look. Besides, no shakes at the restaurants I go to.

Basics: Good diet, lift heavy, sleep like a baby. That recipe has worked for a very long time.

And btw, definition of supplement is: something added to complete a thing, supply a deficiency, or reinforce or extend a whole.

If you dont have a whole, you are not supplementing.

Anyways, Im not posting here anymore. We are detracting from OP's questions.

OP, nothing wrong with supplementing (I really like Biotest products and take Metabolic Drive myself), but I have often strayed and taken Muscle Milk, PVL and GNC to name a few. Whey is less expensive (usually) and you can often buy in 10lbs bags. Good for the pocket book. Get yourself a few mixing cups, couple scoops of powder and add water only when you want to drink it. Just to save on weight.



There are some days where my only pleasure is a nice breakfast. And now I learn there is another man out there who sits down to a breakfast of a protein bar. WHY?!

You're 6'6". Please eat real food. Make people think you're in the NFL, not the NBA.


Eat real food. Oats, chicken, veggies, eggs, what everyone else said.

Look at Fitday.com Make a food log. If you haven't read Bernardi's "The Seven Habits" you should.

Basically what everyone except the crazy guy above said.


Put the supplements/vitamins away until you have your diet straightened out. You are putting the cart before the horse. Seriously go put all the stuff you bought at GNC in the back of the cupboard right now.

You need to eat a real breakfast with some carbs or at least some fat to get your metabolism going and energy for the day. Some eggs, ham, oatmeal, cheerioes, fruit, etc. If you don't have time to make eggs in the morning than hard boil a dozen or two and keep them in the fridge.


Thanks for all the advice guys...So in summary eat more good food less supplements...what about post workout protein powder? Or would I be better off with chicken breast and some fruit or vegetables?


if your going to eat 3x per day, by all means have all food. but if you want to actually make gains, you will have to eat much more frequently. if you want carbs with your protein, throw in a bananna to your shake like i do.


listen buddy, why on earth would you want to eat chicken or any food right after a workout?? the goal of post workout is to get the protein in your blood as soon as possible. that means protein shakes. I have been lifting for a very long time. you can listen to these 100lb nothings, or you can listen to someone who knows what hes talking about.