Just How Heavy Do We Need to Lift?

I think @cdep89 hit it on the head… most of us on this site are not claiming the above.

I will say, it’s just kind of personally ironic you chose this specific example. I had some injuries that required a couple lower back surgeries. After, I got myself back into the gym with the specific goal of deadlifting 500 lbs. Not for any reason, I just wanted to. That doesn’t mean anything to anyone but me, I just chuckled a little. My back does feel better now that I can than it did before, to be fair, but time and healing are variables there.

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If you stop deadlifting because its dangerous but you exceed the speed limit when driving, text/eat and drive, shower without an anti-slip mat, don’t floss regularly, regularly consume alcohol and fast food, there’s a chance that your “danger sense” needs calibration.

I’m all for being healthy and safe. Let’s get the big rocks first.

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I read a quote once that is quite relevant in this case…
“There are old squatters and bold squatters, but very few old, bold squatters.”
Got to be a reason for this…and bench pressing, deadlifts, dips, overhead presses…in fact anything done heavy and with questionable form.
Maybe they just got bored or life got in the way but there has to be some reason why there aren’t many senior lifters who’ve been lifting for years lifting large poundages in gyms.

By chance, have you ever read the one by Voltaire?

What’s the goal of this thread?

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As I said, let people’s reasons be their reasons. Maybe the big fat powerlifter had to save himself from diabetes, maybe the lean clean bodybuilder had to sort his mental health out, maybe old father John decided he’d got as far as he could ever want to with his lifts and has switched focus to see how far he can take his endurance.

It doesn’t really matter. We’ve all got to find our “why”, and that is subject to change.

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One component of this is the body’s cartilage just can no longer support the heavy poundage. I went through this starting at about 62 years old. I began noticing that when I unracked over 500lbs that my spine would do what I called a “compression adjustment”. From the top of my back to the bottom I could feel each spine bone adjust. Out of caution, I dropped the weight. About the same time my hip joints were getting to be bone on bone.

I now have artificial hips. The doctor told me not to hold more than 100lbs while standing.

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To make excuses as to why not to lift heavy. Misery loves company.

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Pontification, mostly.

Kidding, but only a little. :laughing:

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It seems that the question the OP has is whether there is a consensus or general statement on how strong one should become when training just for health. The answer is there is none. Individuals define their own standard

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I’m also wondering whether there are certain exercises that are either required, or redundant for general health gains.
I’m guessing that there are no elite strength athletes who are posting here…so the issue is relevant to most at least.
Is the risk to reward ratio of certain exercises too skewed in favour of risk to make them viable for most of us?

IMO, not at all when exercises are done in good form. That said, I don’t believe there are any health benefits exercising with anything more than your own body weight.

By and large, this entire discussion seems pointless. At best, some might be looking for a reason to not lift heavy weights. I, for one, don’t believe there is any necessity to lift heavy for any health benefit. If you are looking for justification for not lifting heavy weights, I don’t believe you need any justification.

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I’d disagree, politely of course. Shoulder, wrist, back, elbow, knee – weight lifting pretty much covers it all. Runners are always criticized for the high % of running injuries, but I know guys still out running 20 or 30 miles a week, where as other buddies have dropped their gym memberships and are just doing push ups, have switched to isometrics, etc., because of orthopedic issues.

Most of our ortho issues from weights are due to the non-primal/non-legacy aspect of this activity: we didn’t evolve doing bench presses, squats, using machines (I’d toss barbells, benches in with this as they’re machines). An MD first pointed this out to me many, many years ago (and of course, I didn’t listen).

OTOH, our ancestors ran, climbed, swam, walked, built shelters, carried food or tools or weapons. Everything we’re doing since the late 1800s in terms of strength training is all new and something humans simply never did until a very, very short time ago over the last 2 - 5m years of our evolution. Our caveman ancestor Grok’s injuries were no doubt from fights, falls, making a tool, tripping while evading an enemy or chasing down lunch.

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I think about this type of topic. I often get “why are you still doing X, Y, and Z so hard? You’re getting older. Back off.”

Do you know anyone in this boat? I don’t. If you are exercising for general health, as many do, then 2-3 cardio sessions (think elliptical, jogging) and 2-3 resistance sessions (think banded, easy calisthenics, machines) is what one does. Go to a lunchtime mainstream gym and this is what you’ll see people doing.

This. You’re much more likely to get injured playing recreational sports (basketball, soccer, softball, etc…) than you are doing a circuit of squats, pull ups, and presses. I do agree, though, that anyone focusing on a single modality to the extreme for long periods of time (powerlifting or ultra marathon running, as examples) tend to develop more problems as they age. Most on this board, though, focus on strength and conditioning, moving through wide ranges of motion and continually adjusting our workouts.

So, “How heavy do we need to lift?”. Well, you NEED to lift at all. No one’s making you, and you see people living to a ripe old age who aren’t lifters.

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I know for a fact we have pro strongmen and bodybuilders posting here. I’m not trying to be argumentative, but I think you want to tell everyone what they should do based on your goals. Your goals are great, but they’re yours.

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Well if there any elite strength athletes who read and post in Dr Darden’s forum group, then my sincere apologies go out to them…and yes their goals are far different than mine as are the exercises they should / will be using.
I wouldn’t dream of actually TELLING anyone how to train. That is their choice. However social media / exercise media is rife with “advice” on exercises to use for general health gains which I wouldn’t consider appropriate for many.
Heck there is even an exercise movement that promotes training to survive life, along with any zombie apocalypse that comes along, which is rife with unsafe and inappropriate movements.
So although not guilty of telling / advising people how to exercise, there are plenty out there who are…

“Just How Heavy Do We Need to Lift?”
The correct answer is heavier than the vast majority of other people. This is T-Nation. I regret watching the first video and could only bring myself to watch the first minute of the second one.

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Somewhat, but there’s a time and a place. I think back to doing heavy goodmornings. So should you ever tabletop a squat you won’t fold up and die.The idea being, you have to be strong enough to overcome a bad position. So train in a bad position with MODERATE intensity to prepare your body. It has a valid place, but should be trained intelligently.

And they’re mostly wrong. This one drives me bonkers because I’ve seen it everyday for 15 years. Look at any sign in a workplace, “lift with your legs.” They tell people to squat things off the floor, but we all know when the weight increases you can’t because that’s not the way the human body or geometry works.

Agreed. First and foremost with any training is, define your goals. If your training to play baseball, don’t practice basketball.

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But they didn’t live very long.

Maybe if they lifted heavier weights the would have lived longer.

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What would you consider appropriate movements?