Just Can't Lose It

Well, what I was boiling down to was this. Stop worrying about your food. I*t is obvious that you are not eating enough. Concentrate on your training and eat everytime your body says “hey mother fucker, I’m hungry” and I guarentee you will gain some muscles , lose some weight and feel good about yourself.

I think instead of eating less, you should eat alot more and you will lose weight. What? Does that make sense? sure it does. Here’s why. When you go on these ridiculous diets, your body goes into starvation mode or even a state of ketosis if you are not eating at all. This puts the body in panic mode, it starts storing fat while you are at a calorie deficit. It eats away at your muscles for energy.

I love fat people who starve themselves and sit around all day with no exercise and wonder why they are fat when they eat once a day, some 2000-2500 calorie meal too. i know the type. My dad. He’s 6’ 275lbs and eats once a day with a light lunch. He comes home from work and overeats his starving body by eating a 2000 type calorie meal.

My advice was not to just lift hard. Its to eat hard. That in turn will produce better workouts, make the body happy. And in the end make you happy.

If you eat 4-5 decent meals a day, your body will thank you. Eat everytime your hungry, but don’t overeat either… your body doesnt like that either. Think of your body as a machine. Keep the gas in the tank so you can drive all day and run out of gas at the end of the day.

Drive on a low tank and the machine breaks down. Overfill the tank and you got a mess.

Rule#1 to not being fat and being muscular. Eat when you’re hungry and don’t overeat.

Rule #2 to not being fat and being muscular. Exercise when you have the most energy and don’t overexercise. Your CNS doesn’t like that either.

Listen to your body, not the nutritionist and the trainers. Your body knows what it wants better than anyone else.

In short (point #2) EAT!

BUILD MUSCLE was point #1

Put them together and you will look damn good.

The hardgainers won’t EAT but they EXERCISE!
The fatboys will either OVEREAT and not EXERCISE or UNDEREAT and EXERCISE!
BOTH need the same recipe… a normal diet and intense training.

Bottom line EAT & EXERCISE… believe it or not, your body actually enjoys both of those things.

[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
Well, what I was boiling down to was this. Stop worrying about your food. I*t is obvious that you are not eating enough. Concentrate on your training and eat everytime your body says “hey mother fucker, I’m hungry” and I guarentee you will gain some muscles , lose some weight and feel good about yourself.

I think instead of eating less, you should eat alot more and you will lose weight. What? Does that make sense? sure it does. Here’s why. When you go on these ridiculous diets, your body goes into starvation mode or even a state of ketosis if you are not eating at all. This puts the body in panic mode, it starts storing fat while you are at a calorie deficit. It eats away at your muscles for energy.

I love fat people who starve themselves and sit around all day with no exercise and wonder why they are fat when they eat once a day, some 2000-2500 calorie meal too. i know the type. My dad. He’s 6’ 275lbs and eats once a day with a light lunch. He comes home from work and overeats his starving body by eating a 2000 type calorie meal.

My advice was not to just lift hard. Its to eat hard. That in turn will produce better workouts, make the body happy. And in the end make you happy.

If you eat 4-5 decent meals a day, your body will thank you. Eat everytime your hungry, but don’t overeat either… your body doesnt like that either. Think of your body as a machine. Keep the gas in the tank so you can drive all day and run out of gas at the end of the day.

Drive on a low tank and the machine breaks down. Overfill the tank and you got a mess.

Rule#1 to not being fat and being muscular. Eat when you’re hungry and don’t overeat.

Rule #2 to not being fat and being muscular. Exercise when you have the most energy and don’t overexercise. Your CNS doesn’t like that either.

Listen to your body, not the nutritionist and the trainers. Your body knows what it wants better than anyone else.

In short (point #2) EAT!

BUILD MUSCLE was point #1

Put them together and you will look damn good.

The hardgainers won’t EAT but they EXERCISE!
The fatboys will either OVEREAT and not EXERCISE or UNDEREAT and EXERCISE!
BOTH need the same recipe… a normal diet and intense training.

Bottom line EAT & EXERCISE… believe it or not, your body actually enjoys both of those things.

[/quote]

Okay, you brought up some good points here. However, ask what “hungry” is to an anorexic and Professor X and you’ll get completely different answers.

[quote]kevbo wrote:

Okay, you brought up some good points here. However, ask what “hungry” is to an anorexic and Professor X and you’ll get completely different answers.[/quote]

right! 2 different bodys

2 different meal plans

I wouldn’t suggest my meal plan to anybody. But it works for me and my body. I eat anywhere from 5 to 10 times a day. Usually small meals all the time. I barely ever eat a big meal. I have been a sandwhich freak for the last say 15-20 years. I use to eat a turkey or ham sandwitch every hour or so. Maybe a 200- 300 calorie sandwhich and 8 of those is still only 2400 calories orf so. Even at work, I’d find time to snack on something. I am a chronic eater and have always been very low bodyfat.

I can tell you this much though… the one time I went on a “diet”, I GOT FAT.

I was skinny before the diet, but I was trying to see how cut up I could look. Well all i did was lose muscle and gain fat and that weight losss diet. And I felt like shit all day long too. I was starving, I felt skinny and looked fat. You know the type… all flab and no muscle tone. I had a better body before the diet.

When I want to get ripped. I do this. I increase my food intake and work out a hell of alot more intensly. I hit the heavybag and start going crazy in the gym. I get shredded by actually increasing my food intake. Go Figure. I guess i break the rules. I don’t know. What are the rules? MY RULE IS “DIETS” are exactly what is in the word… you will DIE if you don’t EAT. Literally!

[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
kevbo wrote:

Okay, you brought up some good points here. However, ask what “hungry” is to an anorexic and Professor X and you’ll get completely different answers.

right! 2 different bodys

2 different meal plans

I wouldn’t suggest my meal plan to anybody. But it works for me and my body. I eat anywhere from 5 to 10 times a day. Usually small meals all the time. I barely ever eat a big meal. I have been a sandwhich freak for the last say 15-20 years. I use to eat a turkey or ham sandwitch every hour or so. Maybe a 200- 300 calorie sandwhich and 8 of those is still only 2400 calories orf so. Even at work, I’d find time to snack on something. I am a chronic eater and have always been very low bodyfat.

I can tell you this much though… the one time I went on a “diet”, I GOT FAT.

I was skinny before the diet, but I was trying to see how cut up I could look. Well all i did was lose muscle and gain fat and that weight losss diet. And I felt like shit all day long too. I was starving, I felt skinny and looked fat. You know the type… all flab and no muscle tone. I had a better body before the diet.

When I want to get ripped. I do this. I increase my food intake and work out a hell of alot more intensly. I hit the heavybag and start going crazy in the gym. I get shredded by actually increasing my food intake. Go Figure. I guess i break the rules. I don’t know. What are the rules? MY RULE IS “DIETS” are exactly what is in the word… you will DIE if you don’t EAT. Literally![/quote]

That wasn’t my point. My point is the mentality of the OP vs a normal person on this board. An anorexic can eat a piece of bread in the morning and go ~8 hours until realizing they are hungry because they have trained themselves to suppress their hunger. Somebody who is truly health conscience has a much lower threshold of hunger than someone who is trying to starve themselves.

[quote]kevbo wrote:
That wasn’t my point. My point is the mentality of the OP vs a normal person on this board. An anorexic can eat a piece of bread in the morning and go ~8 hours until realizing they are hungry because they have trained themselves to suppress their hunger. Somebody who is truly health conscience has a much lower threshold of hunger than someone who is trying to starve themselves.[/quote]

Yes yes…

I think a doctor or psychiatrist might be in need here. My thoughts are for the normal of mind and body.

I don’t know a thing about anorexia and would probably think they could use a hypnosis at this point.

This is beyond the realm of reason if I am talking to someone that just doesn’t like chicken and turkey and thinks that if they eat it they will all the sudden turn into a 400lb blob. Is there a doctor in the house? I am untrained in the absence of food theory. I like food. I like it alot. In fact… just talking baout these turkey sandwhiches is making me hungry and I have to go raid the fridge.

Ok, I will eat more… about 2500 cals/day, low-carb(~100-150g carbs/day, breakfast and post workout), I will train with MORE intensity, and hopefully it will produce some results(losing fat especially).
I will weight and measure myself next morning, and hopeffully I will see some results `till next week.

PS: I cant find professional counseling in this country, the "dieticians" tell me to eat sugar if I have a sore muscle after an intense workout, they think fats(all of them) are EVIL :)) Theyre level of knowlege is from the 50`s or so…

Stop dropping cals. You’re killing your metabolism. Raise your cals back up, and drop the carbs instead. Subsist on fat and protein and make sure you eat clean.

[quote]dirxx wrote:
Ok, I will eat more… about 2500 cals/day, low-carb(~100-150g carbs/day, breakfast and post workout), I will train with MORE intensity, and hopefully it will produce some results(losing fat especially).
I will weight and measure myself next morning, and hopeffully I will see some results `till next week.

PS: I cant find professional counseling in this country, the "dieticians" tell me to eat sugar if I have a sore muscle after an intense workout, they think fats(all of them) are EVIL :)) Theyre level of knowlege is from the 50`s or so…
[/quote]

certain fish oils help prevent muscle soreness.

How the hell do you know how many calories you are eating. i have never had a clue in a day. How can you possibly count them.

I think your calorie counting theory is a waste of time.

Screw richard simmons and his deal a meal squeal.

Just eat some fucking food. Jesus christ! you are making this so tough on yourself and it is so easy it really is. I hate to see people suffer, especially from deprieving themselves of food. I see it all the time. 9 out of 10 times its some fatty that is too lazy to do any type of physical activity and wants to lose the weight by not drinking their usal 2 liter of coke everyday. UN-FUCKIN-REAL!

Put the calorie counter devise DOWN!

go raid your fridge, eat all the turkey sandwhiches you can for a month. Beat the hell out of that heavy bag, do your normal lifting. put some effort into the movement of the body, not the food.

You are not gonna notice any difference day to day.

give this some time to work.

even if you weigh yourself…how in the hell are you going to know if its fat, water, or muscle that you are losing? or gaining?

would you rather lose 2 pounds the first 2 days and only 1 more the rest of the month? or lose none the first week then as your body adapts it loses 15 over the next 3 weeks?

Patience man, you seem inpatient… give things some time to work

(the first 8 reps may not do a thing, but how about the last 4 that make all the difference in the world)

you need a new perspective my man.

think positive and go thru no matter what. that was something Arnold had used for his entire life and had alot of success off of it.

Let your body readjust to eating normal, and then maybe it will act as you want it to the intense workouts. Did that ever occur to you? When people have bodys that they don’t want, there is usually a direct correlation to what you are doing to it and the shape that its in.

NOW, gO eat that fuckin turkey sandwhich i was talking about.

You will learn more from the articles and from the coaches themselves on this site (they each have forums for you to post questions in), than you will from us.

Read as many articles by John Berardi as possible, and follow them.

You can even click on the articles and click on the “high impact” button if you’re having trouble weeding through all of the articles.

Take the advice of the experts here first before coming to “us”.

There are people from all different walks of life posting here, and many may have just learned for THEMSELVES that they need to eat a ton of food for THEM to grow.

Anyone with this kind of new information, that they’ve put to use and worked for them will be anxious to tell others about it, and some might not understand that there are many different body types out there who won’t get the same results with the same type of eating.

If you have the “fatguy genes” it aint that easy to lose weight, thats why I must control every variable I can.
If you are saying that all I need to lose weight and gain muscle is to raid the fridge, I think you are very wrong.

What about Berardi, Chris Shugart & etc. and they`re diet plans. Are they all idiots for telling us to count our calories, carbs, protein and fats and make a solid meal plan, clean an nice, to which we should stick at least 90% of the time? :slight_smile:

[quote]dirxx wrote:
If you have the “fatguy genes” it aint that easy to lose weight, thats why I must control every variable I can.
If you are saying that all I need to lose weight and gain muscle is to raid the fridge, I think you are very wrong.

What about Berardi, Chris Shugart & etc. and they`re diet plans. Are they all idiots for telling us to count our calories, carbs, protein and fats and make a solid meal plan, clean an nice, to which we should stick at least 90% of the time? :)[/quote]

I think its a fucking headache. by the time you get done counting and picking every exact food out of the grocery store, you could have worked out twice, got laid, and lost 2 lbs in the process.

You don’t need all of that. Those coaches have good advice. But there is no universal plan for everyone. You would have to get a specific diet plan for yourself to work. and even that is still a waste in my opinion. I’ve watched my family members gain and lose weight like crazy. I’ve observed fat people at work. They tend to want to count calories instead of just count how many times they ate what they wanted too and still lost weight.

If your talking about specific foods… COOL! buy the good shit and quality protein. It still wont do you any good if you ate your manditory 2955 calories that day.

You should be eating based on your body’s energy needs, not some diet plans caloric counting number in a 24 hour period.

The body doesn’t work that way. If i eat 2700 today and 3300 tomorrow… that means nothing if i need 3000 both days for my enrgy expenditure. I probably just starved a little the first day and now stored some fat the next day.

Some days you may need 4000 calories, some 2000.

You can do the calorie counting if you want. all i know is that every calorie counter i ever met was a fatty or just lazy. Not saying you are either, but I think fat people have no clue how to work a body. It doesn’t have to do with a certain count. It has to do with a certain need. Sometimes i need 6 hours sleep, sometimes i need 8. Do you get what i’m saying. Sure the average person needs the 3000 cals a day and 8 hours sleep. but they dont need the same amount everyday, and every person doesn’t need the same as everyone else.

No diet program is suited for the average. you would have to get one created for you.

Here’s how to do it without a degree and 1000’s of dollars of help. It’s called the follow what your body wants to do program. If your tired… sleep. If your horny… fuck! If you have energy… use it If you are hungry… eat If you are full… stop eating(even if you only ate your 2950cals and need 50 more to be “dietly correct”

There is nothing wrong with wanting to eat healthy or clean, but if it takes a bigger precidence on you than actually just exercising your body and giving it energy when it wants some, then you’re not going to get anywhere on a diet program. I think people fail these programs because they are not set up for people, they are set up for computers.

You will need an elictrical devise that can tell you exactly how much caloric(heat) you are buring and how much more you need. This does not exist. That is if you can tell exactly how many calories you are eating and how many you are burning.

Your body is the computer and it lets you know 24 hours a day when it needs energy(food) and sleep.

If this so called diet plan was universal, that means that you and I should go take it and since we are the different physiolgicaly that we will still have the same results. right?

Bullshit! I am against depriving the body of food at any point in someones life. If you are fat? Get the hell off of your ass and move it. You eat based on caloric needs. It will never be the same from one day to the next. and you have the secret formula elictrical devise that tells me how many calories I need today to maintain my exact weight. Then I’ll buy it and give my brain a rest.

[quote]dirxx wrote:
If you have the “fatguy genes” it aint that easy to lose weight, thats why I must control every variable I can.
If you are saying that all I need to lose weight and gain muscle is to raid the fridge, I think you are very wrong.

What about Berardi, Chris Shugart & etc. and they`re diet plans. Are they all idiots for telling us to count our calories, carbs, protein and fats and make a solid meal plan, clean an nice, to which we should stick at least 90% of the time? :)[/quote]

You don’t have fat guy genes you’re just not doing it right.

No one is telling you to raid the fridge… they’re telling you that you are hindering your weight loss by NOT eating enough. What you are doing is not working, and we have all agreed on one thing, and that is that you need to add calories to your diet in order to lose fat and for general health purposes. If you do not heed our advice then you are seriously beyond the pale and need more help than we can offer you.

I`ve been fat all my life… when I was a little kid I was OBESE… so I think I probably have the “fatguy” genes

[quote]dirxx wrote:
I`ve been fat all my life… when I was a little kid I was OBESE… so I think I probably have the “fatguy” genes[/quote]

Yes, because you were inactive and didn’t eat the way a sedentary person should eat. People are much fatter than they were 50 years ago; does this mean the fat gene is evolving?

Look, if you don’t try the advice given to you, then don’t complain that you “can’t lose weight.” We don’t have a secret conspiracy to turn you into a fat blob. If you seriously think you have a thyroid disorder or something, see a doctor.

[quote]kevbo wrote:
dirxx wrote:
I`ve been fat all my life… when I was a little kid I was OBESE… so I think I probably have the “fatguy” genes

Yes, because you were inactive and didn’t eat the way a sedentary person should eat. People are much fatter than they were 50 years ago; does this mean the fat gene is evolving?

Look, if you don’t try the advice given to you, then don’t complain that you “can’t lose weight.” We don’t have a secret conspiracy to turn you into a fat blob. If you seriously think you have a thyroid disorder or something, see a doctor.[/quote]

i agree man, if you eat clean and exercise right you won’t get fat trust us damn’it… it takes time dude, if you aren’t willing to work hard enough for it FORGET IT… i don’t mean to be harsh, just telling the truth

I AM trying the advice… and doing what`s right(I hope).
Thx guys for helping me

[quote]dirxx wrote:
Ok, I will eat more… about 2500 cals/day, low-carb(~100-150g carbs/day, breakfast and post workout), I will train with MORE intensity, and hopefully it will produce some results(losing fat especially). [/quote]

See, that’s kind of counter-productive. You’re essentially saying “ok, I’ll eat more, but by God, I’ll be sure to burn off those extra calories!”

Right now, your body is angry at you, and it is fighting against your goals. You want to lose fat and look good nekkid. Your body wants to live. More to the point, it sees these goals as mutually exclusive, at least the way you’re going about it.

Your through process is “if I eat less, I’ll burn more fat.” You body’s thought process is a bit more complex. When you put it into a steep caloric deficit, as you have, and then toss a lot of high intensity physical activity at it, as you also have, your body says something like the following:

“Holy hell, I’m gonna die! I need to do something about this. Let’s start by lowering our metabolic rate. That way, we aren’t burning as many calories as we were before. Now, let’s cannibalize some of this muscle tissue; it’s a good source of energy, and it burns calories just sitting there. Two birds with one stone! Hey, we’ve got some fat tissue laying around, but that’s my emergency reserve, so I’m not going to take too much away from that.”

The reason people are telling you to eat more is to counteract your body’s “holy hell, I’m gonna die” response. You want your body to know that it’s going to get enough nutrients to make it through the day. A quick guideline:

Body weight in pounds * 15 = maximum calories per day
Body weight in pounds * 10 = minimum calories per day

Or, for you:
78 kg = 172 pounds, roughly

172 * 15 = 2580 calories per day maximum
172 * 10 = 1720 calories per day minimum

Since you’re body is currently in the “I’m gonna die” stage of things, you should tend more to the high side, around 2600 calories per day. If you do that, along with a solid lifting and cardio routine, you should see the weight start to come off, on the average of one to two pounds (half a kilogram or so) per week.

Try eating 2600 calories a day for a couple of weeks. You should drop about a kilo, maybe less, since you need to repair your metabolism. If, after a month or so, you arn’t seeing a half kilo drop per week, you can start playing around with calories per day, adding or subtracting 200 per day until you find your sweet spot.

And remember, 1720 is your minimum, which means you never, ever eat less than 1720 in a day. Ever. And usually, you should be eating more.

[quote]dirxx wrote:
I will weight and measure myself next morning, and hopeffully I will see some results `till next week. [/quote]

I’m in the “weigh yourself every day” camp myself, but to get an accurate assessment of how you’re progressing, you should always weigh yourself first thing in the morning, after you hit the bathroom, and before you eat or drink anything. That cuts down on fluctuations in water weight, et al.