T Nation

Just an Honest Question

Does anybody else feel that taking steroids is cheating in some shape or form? I feel that If I were to take the weightlifting 100% seriously and put all I’ve got into it and done it entierly myself…

I would feel great! because I’ve accomplished this all by myself without the aid of steroids,and I would feel that I haven’t accomplished as much if i did use them…

Do you know what I mean?

Yet I still admire those who spend hour after hour in the gym creating muscle bound bodies with the strength of 5 men!..I Just want to know how elite weight lifters feel about this statement…i don’t intend to be a ‘troll’

In a sport like bodybuilding where EVERYBODY uses them, is it still cheating?

DG

Personally I think the whole ‘cheating’ thing stems from the fact that AAS is illegal in many countries and frowned upon by most sporting bodies.

IF they were legal would there be the same stigma attached? If the media wasn’t so uneducated and misinformed would the masses be so biased against AAS? No, of course not.

There are a thousand ways via legal supplements to get an edge and just because AAS is illegal and more powerful on the whole it’s cheating?

Bullshit. Of course it’s not.

Inject and be damned? No. Inject and be all that you can.

Most times when a person says, “I’m just asking an honest question,” somehow it doesn’t wind up looking that way once hearing or reading it.

Sorry, I don’t think this is even a real question at all, it’s just a method to state your position against steroids, in a steroid forum. Which was a waste of time.

I really doubt you were interested and open to learning anything different to your existing position.

So much for the “honest question,” IMO.

Oh yeah, and most times when someone writes, “I don’t intend to be a troll,” well, I’ll leave it to each person’s own judgment as to how that usually works out.

How is it cheating? Most people who use steroids aren’t playing a ‘game’. It’s like saying don’t you think having a turbocharger on your sports car that you don’t race is cheating.

Firstly, define cheating.

Unfair advantage over others maybe?

If so, then having more athletic parents makes you a cheat.

I believe that provided it’s a non-tested sport, steroid use levels the playing field, by diminishing the role of genetics.

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:

I really doubt you were interested and open to learning anything different to your existing position.

[/quote]

I agree Bill but:

He’s like 15 years old, he doesn’t have the life experience to have formed any valid positions yet.

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

[quote]Dirty Gerdy wrote:
In a sport like bodybuilding where EVERYBODY uses them, is it still cheating?
[/quote]

Yes – if you’re competing in a drug-tested organization.

As for everyone else, it no more cheating than protein powder or any other tool that takes you beyond what the average person uses.

[quote]Kruiser wrote:
Bill Roberts wrote:

I really doubt you were interested and open to learning anything different to your existing position.

I agree Bill but:

He’s like 15 years old, he doesn’t have the life experience to have formed any valid positions yet. [/quote]

Thanks, that is exactly where I stand!I am only 15 which means I lack life experience. I am neither pro steroids or anti-steroids…I personally would not use them because it would disqualify me from all my other sports at the moment but I am simply trying to view a perspective from some of the professional weight lifters.

Also, In schools steroid use is heavily frowned upon. In my GCSE Pe class we dwell too much on the disadvantages like side effects.

Has anyone here suffered SEVERE side affects?or any?

I have no real knowledge of a first hand perspective on steroids so this is what Im trying to discover at present. I do not intend to start any arguing or here to provoke hostility.

My position is that steroids are cheating if and only if the person using them is the ONLY person using them AND that person is apart of a competition that specifically bans the use of PED’s.

But I also feel that if someone sleeps in a hyperbaric chamber to increase red blood cell count or gets corrective eye surgery or has superior equipment that isn’t available to anyone else etc. is also going to lend an advantage to the user.

In a given situation any one of the above mentioned things can create a wider gap than steroids can.

For the average Joe using steroids is probably only cheating the big drug companies out of money, because of their legal status in most places.

No it’s not cheating.

[quote]aidyquinn wrote:
Does anybody else feel that taking steroids is cheating in some shape or form? I feel that If I were to take the weightlifting 100% seriously and put all I’ve got into it and done it entierly myself…

I would feel great! because I’ve accomplished this all by myself without the aid of steroids,and I would feel that I haven’t accomplished as much if i did use them…

Do you know what I mean?

Yet I still admire those who spend hour after hour in the gym creating muscle bound bodies with the strength of 5 men!..I Just want to know how elite weight lifters feel about this statement…i don’t intend to be a ‘troll’[/quote]

It is a fair question. Just because you aren’t of the same view as me or ‘us’ does NOT mean it is a view not worth listening, or responding to.

I know what you mean - i thought similar things for a few years - in an on and off fashion - after my first couple of Dbol cycles (around 8-9 years ago now). BUT back then i didn’t have the same aspirations and goals as i do now. They dictate my feelings to PED’s to a high degree.

But over the past 10 years training with Barbells and Dumbells, i only actually decided i wanted to be as big as humanly possible (for me) about 10 months ago.

Anyway… while my aims and goals were different, i DID feel a bit like i was cheating myself by using AAS. I actually did! I did it (steroids) in a very restricted way, short, mild cycles(6wk deca - yes. tis true…;D) - and got killer gains.

A little muscle history. I am 5’8" and many here are snide towards young lads of 170lbs… and 2 years training. Well by the time i had been training um… about 4 years(!) 18-22, i had gotten to a massive 140lbs!

Now believe me that bigger is better, however at 140lbs i would draw compliments on my body regularly and was seen as a young lad who was serious enough about lifting to actually be able to get some results worth having (as those who know what training is like - the results come long and slow…!).

I would often end up in conversations about weights, gym, fitness etc at that age and at only 10stone. At the time i thought i was hercules. The mind truly boggles!
Now at 200lbs it is a different story of course.
But i digress…

So i was always kinda muscular, a true ecto-mesomorph and lean with visible muscle bellies… which definitely responded to stimuli, and always slim with slim joints etc… which made any muscle growth i did achieve all that much more noticeable i guess, even if it was sloooooooow as all hell to grow past 24.

I had a few growth spurts upto that age, some helped with AAS, somne natural. But damn. Natural training with a 6 week cycle every year or two on average (often less) is painfully slow.

Over the years… life happening all the while - yet with the one constant - consistent training - I have managed to gain a TON of muscle.
Nowadays I have realised new goals of muscularity and size, and learnt slowly over the years of training naturally and not,

That the ways those goals may be actually reached will need to be through the carefully controlled, sensible yet thorough use of PED’s. And with that realisation i have also become to feel that i will be cheating no-one when i work as hard as i do, in the gym and out, to achieve those goals, drugs or not.

The drugs don’t take away from my attainment or achievement. They just assist. I mean that in as true and pure way as it can be spoken. i believe that as though it were the word of god. (yes, the same one i dont believe in) I MEAN that deeply.

I use the drugs to assist my trsaining and body in realising the goals i have set for myself.

Is that so wrong?

Also over the past year - and why i gave a little history above - i have also learned that for my particular genetic make-up, that if i was to want to compete on any level of play naturally, it would be so fucking low - they would have to re-invent the sport… :wink:

Honestly, I have hit my genetic potential. I got the benefit of being ‘muscley and veiny’ from as young as 14! Honestly! I trained from then with bodyweight till 18 when i got bars and dumbells.
What i am saying is - I am an OK natural… not a competitive ‘ok’ just an ok…ok.

Supra-natural i can not only realise my goals but i suspect with the correct discipline and control, i may surpass a couple of them. That isn’t about cheating, gaining the upper hand,

Denial or getting something i don’t deserve, it is about being willing to go the step further to realise what i dream, about being tough willed enough to gamble with my health for a simple thing such as extreme muscularity. And it is extreme muscularity i desire.

I slam anyone who comes to this site with moderate muscularity dreams yet wanting to shoot a whole manner of drugs to get there. That is BS.
It is being a Hardcore Bodybuilder. Or Hardcore Aspiring Bodybuilder!!! lol
The clue is in the name, it isnt “drugs” or “cheating”.

It is being risky, edgy and hardcore enough to do whatEVER it takes to get there… to the top of the game. to where you can be with every last breath, every last sweat bead, with every last pump of the heart… and THEN some more of whatever it needs… THEN re-assess where you are… and go at it some more.

Here’s to being more than we dreamed.

:wink:

[quote]aidyquinn wrote:
Kruiser wrote:
Bill Roberts wrote:

I really doubt you were interested and open to learning anything different to your existing position.

I agree Bill but:

He’s like 15 years old, he doesn’t have the life experience to have formed any valid positions yet.

Thanks, that is exactly where I stand!I am only 15 which means I lack life experience. I am neither pro steroids or anti-steroids…I personally would not use them because it would disqualify me from all my other sports at the moment but I am simply trying to view a perspective from some of the professional weight lifters.

Also, In schools steroid use is heavily frowned upon. In my GCSE Pe class we dwell too much on the disadvantages like side effects.

Has anyone here suffered SEVERE side affects?or any?

I have no real knowledge of a first hand perspective on steroids so this is what Im trying to discover at present. I do not intend to start any arguing or here to provoke hostility.[/quote]

I apologize if I was overly cynical. Though probably 99% of the time the two sorts of statements mentioned would correctly be tip-offs that the purpose is not simply to ask a question for the sake of learning answers, and that the disclaimer against being a troll usually means that that is exactly what the post is,

There will be the 1% of the time where that is not so. And in those cases the person is being treated unfairly. I’m sorry if I did that as it looks like I did.

As for side effects: just about everything is due to non-inherent side effects (e.g. side effects from excess estrogen, from too much use of alkylated compounds, or to some extent from too much DHT)that simply are not inherent to androgen steroid use but can be the case depending on particular choices made; or are due to excessively long periods of use without planned breaks.

The outcome of even that is simply reduced natural testosterone production, not some horrible health problem.

Even if a user neglects each of these areas and exposes himself to each of these unnecessary side effects, there is exactly zero evidence that the resulting health risk is anywhere near as great as if he smokes or drinks to excess.

The obsession some people have with attacking steroid use has more to do with psychological issues on their part than anything else, I believe. Many of them also have instinctive (apparently) revulsions against weight training, high protein consumption, or any sort of acquisition of large amounts of muscle including when achieved drug-free.

Some of them even hate creatine. Basically, IMO these individuals are reacting not against actual health issues with anabolic steroids, but because anabolism or the idea of “anabolic” itself bothers them for some reason.

I love anabolism

[quote]aidyquinn wrote:
Kruiser wrote:
Bill Roberts wrote:

I really doubt you were interested and open to learning anything different to your existing position.

I agree Bill but:

He’s like 15 years old, he doesn’t have the life experience to have formed any valid positions yet.

Thanks, that is exactly where I stand!I am only 15 which means I lack life experience. I am neither pro steroids or anti-steroids…I personally would not use them because it would disqualify me from all my other sports at the moment but I am simply trying to view a perspective from some of the professional weight lifters.

Also, In schools steroid use is heavily frowned upon. In my GCSE Pe class we dwell too much on the disadvantages like side effects.

Has anyone here suffered SEVERE side affects?or any?

I have no real knowledge of a first hand perspective on steroids so this is what Im trying to discover at present. I do not intend to start any arguing or here to provoke hostility.[/quote]

right on man, that is a very mature response from a person your age especially :wink:

I was a collegiate baseball player and I would never take steroids and participate in a sport. I don’t bash anybody that does as I knew and know many who still do.

I personally feel that steroids would be considered cheating if used in any sport that banned them from competition. I also agree with the points stated that people using technology to their advantage that others cannot use can also be considered a form of cheating or getting an edge.

What I do believe in is the EDUCATED and PROPER use of steroids by your common person. I feel that if your average weightlifter who is not participating in PED banned sports then who am I to tell them what they want to do with their body and how they wish to achieve their goals.

I also don’t have a problem (obviously) with the use of steroids and PED’s in Bodybuilding. I believe in ‘drug tested’ shows that using AAS and PED’s is cheating and I think those people are the lowest of the low.

That would mean that they are not good enough to compete with those of us who compete in untested events, so they must cheat and beat those who wish to stay natural.

I also believe that if ANYBODY truly does their research and educates oneself on the topic of steroids that they would find that they are not as bad as people think. I know of many people who have are healthier and have better bloodwork after steroids than they did before they started using.

The Media has hyped it up beyond belief and now the common misconception is that it makes you RAGE and destroys your body. In fact, I know many people whom which test puts them in a better mood so no RAGE and PEDs are designed to help build up one’s body and not tear it down.

Well there is a decent amount of my opinion. My avatar pic is me…naturally…this past July. I have just recently started my first steroid cycle and am using to make my gym experience a little more fun as well as better myself in that arena.

I am also a bodybuilder and wish to one day step on the Olympia stage…and win it. I know that this CANNOT be done without the use of steroids.

DG

as long as the barbell isn’t on steroids… who cares?

no its not cheating,and I suggest you forget EVERYTHING you have ever heard about steroids.
I can bet that they are most if not all untrue. and at 15 the only thing you should worry about is lifting and eating and getting stronger,nothing more

well maybe you should also think about girls once in a while.

I used to think it was cheating but that was because the people who “educated” me LIED to me and simply made shit up, or perhaps they repeated the lies that they were taught. Either way, many people have some really screwed up opinions about steriods that are not based on fact.

I don’t like fear tactics. After actually learning some of the facts about steroids, I don’t think that it’s cheating at all.

Thanks, this was a great help! great to hear from a first hand perspective!