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Is Pasta Bad?

is pasta bad for you?
i have heard ‘stuff’ about building up an insulin resistance if you eat too many ‘bad’ carbs and yesterday i made spaghetti and meatballs with 5 pounds of beef and 3 boxes of spaghetti

i am eating that for lunch, pre workout, and post workout meals

is that bad?

Pasta is bad for you but it hasn’t to do exclusively w/ the high carbohydrates, but rather that it is tough on the digestive system, particularly the whole wheat variety, which some mistakenly espouse as a healthier alternative to the regular.

I’m not an advocate for eliminating grains from one’s diet, but I firmly believe that all grains should be prepared properly and that means soaking them prior to cooking. All grains are high in phytic acid which binds minerals like magnesium and zinc and causes them to be excreted by your body. They also contain enzyme inhibitors which hinder proper digestion causing your body further strain. These are at least partially neutralized by soaking which involves soaking the grains in a bowl of warm water and an acidic medium like lemon juice overnight prior to cooking. I do this with oat groats and to a lesser extent brown rice, which has much lower in phytic acid and any enzyme inhibitors. Of course, a processed, manufactured product like pasta is not a suitable candidate for this. Soaking is a practice commonly used for legumes like beans, but the practice has been largely forgotten when it comes to proper grain preparation, much to the detriment of the many people today who suffer from indigestion and other digestive discomforts and sensitivities when consuming grains. If you want to consume wheat in a more healthful, digestive-friendly manner, try sprouted toast instead:

http://www.alvaradostreetbakery.com/

Otherwise, I’d recommend potatoes and rice as primary staples for starch over pasta any day.

If you do wish to continue eating pasta, at least do so infrequently and in moderation and opt for a high quality organic brand like Bionaturae which’ll spare you all the synthetic pesticides and other garbage found in the mainstream brands:

http://www.bionaturae.com/pasta.html

hope this helps

Excellent post wise one. I couldn’t have said it better. Really everyone on here should read this post to understand these concepts better if they don’t already. OK enough ass kissin, just though ot was nice to see someone that truly understands.

[quote]wise11 wrote:
Pasta is bad for you but it hasn’t to do exclusively w/ the high carbohydrates, but rather that it is tough on the digestive system, particularly the whole wheat variety, which some mistakenly espouse as a healthier alternative to the regular.

I’m not an advocate for eliminating grains from one’s diet, but I firmly believe that all grains should be prepared properly and that means soaking them prior to cooking. All grains are high in phytic acid which binds minerals like magnesium and zinc and causes them to be excreted by your body. They also contain enzyme inhibitors which hinder proper digestion causing your body further strain. These are at least partially neutralized by soaking which involves soaking the grains in a bowl of warm water and an acidic medium like lemon juice overnight prior to cooking. I do this with oat groats and to a lesser extent brown rice, which has much lower in phytic acid and any enzyme inhibitors. Of course, a processed, manufactured product like pasta is not a suitable candidate for this. Soaking is a practice commonly used for legumes like beans, but the practice has been largely forgotten when it comes to proper grain preparation, much to the detriment of the many people today who suffer from indigestion and other digestive discomforts and sensitivities when consuming grains. If you want to consume wheat in a more healthful, digestive-friendly manner, try sprouted toast instead:

http://www.alvaradostreetbakery.com/

Otherwise, I’d recommend potatoes and rice as primary staples for starch over pasta any day.

If you do wish to continue eating pasta, at least do so infrequently and in moderation and opt for a high quality organic brand like Bionaturae which’ll spare you all the synthetic pesticides and other garbage found in the mainstream brands:

http://www.bionaturae.com/pasta.html

hope this helps

[/quote]

That was some smart shit he just said. I was just gonna say that Whole Wheat pasta has more fiber and whole grains are better for you anyway. I dont eat alot anyway, some and some of that chunky meat lovers prego goes nicely.

Damn man, i guess im wrong.

[quote]BluePfaltz wrote:
That was some smart shit he just said. I was just gonna say that Whole Wheat pasta has more fiber and whole grains are better for you anyway. I dont eat alot anyway, some and some of that chunky meat lovers prego goes nicely.

Damn man, i guess im wrong.[/quote]

Dont get me wrong, whole grains are definitely better than skeletonized grains (i.e. white flour, white rice,etc), but with the MAJOR caveat that theyre first prepared properly (overnight soaking (the easiest method), sprouting or old-fashioned sour-leavening ex. Sourdough bread). The fiber and nutrients found in the bran of the grains which is removed during processing, confer numerous health benefits but only if we can absorb and use them properly. What many people dont realize is that you can actually be deficient in a certain nutrient while consuming foods abundant in it, if those foods were not properly prepared. Wheat is a perfect example. Its rich in minerals like magnesium, but unless the phytic acid naturally present in it is neutralized prior to its preparation, you wont be able to absorb most of it. The fiber in grains, although recommended by the mainstream health orthodoxy as a veritable defense against colon cancer, hearty disease and a number of other maladies has actually been shown to be highly irritating to the intestines unless subjected to one of the above methods of proper preparation.

The championing of whole grains has become almost axiomatic today, but people must make the necessary distinction between whole grains that have undergone the all- important preparation process that will truly make them a healthy food. This is all the more important to bodybuilders who consume grains frequently and in substantial quantities.

On a further note, I urge you to remember that just as consuming processed white flour (ie the starchy portion of a grain) is unhealthful, consuming straight bran or germ isnt too smart either. The bran is where the phytic acid concentrates. Oat bran in particular is especially high in phytic acid. The lesson here is 2-pronged: Consume properly prepared grains and dont consume them with any of the components separated from each other.
(and of course eat them in moderation).

Also, in case youre wondering about the status of cold-boxed breakfast cereals, make sure to read the following post:

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;?id=538197

Check out the Carb Roundtable discussion with Berardi and Lowery.Some of the discussion revolves around the glycemic response and speed of absorbtion to isocaloric meals versus the glycemic response to mixed meals.

My conclusion-No pasta is not bad when prepared properly and eaten in the right amounts.

Smartass response- Yes pasta is bad.Every time I let it out of the box it runs over and pissed on the arm of the couch.

Oh, and the ads are nice too.The people who wrote those deserve every penny.
What exactly is a state of the art artisian production method?

Wise11-

Incredible article about processed foods! Just sickening how we are getting diseases and cancers all in the name of big business. I had no idea shreaded wheat isn’t really a truly healthy food. It’s healthier than Cocoa Puffs, but we can do better.

Question - I don’t have time to heavily research this, so could you post an explaination about what the difference is between sprouted grains and regular grains? And, of course, why sprouted is healthier?

THANKS! I really appreciate you sharing these resources!

TopSirloin

Also, are old fashioned rolled oats acceptable??? And, some of us don’t have the time to soak our grains, so are there any other healthy yet quick foods we can prepare/buy?

Thanks again,

TopSirloin

Wise11,
How do you feel about the low card varieties? My thoughts were that they could be a valuable source of fiber (12 grams per serving). Although they don’t say which type of fiber I am assuming it is primarily insoluable.

I occasionally use this as a post workout meal, and my kids don’t notice the difference. Is this a misguided effort at proper nutrtion?

[quote]TopSirloin wrote:
Wise11-

Incredible article about processed foods! Just sickening how we are getting diseases and cancers all in the name of big business. I had no idea shreaded wheat isn’t really a truly healthy food. It’s healthier than Cocoa Puffs, but we can do better.

Question - I don’t have time to heavily research this, so could you post an explaination about what the difference is between sprouted grains and regular grains? And, of course, why sprouted is healthier?

THANKS! I really appreciate you sharing these resources!

TopSirloin[/quote]

I’m glad you enjoyed the article, and its always my pleasure to share this information with everyone. People really need to be awakened to the fact that the conventional nutritional establishment is primarily beholden to the interests of the food processing industry. You need to keep your eyes open and spread the word. Knowledge is power.

I get angry enough when I see fellow citizens munching on some American Heart Association-endorsed snack thinking theyre doing something good for themselves, when in reality theyre being played as suckers for the food companies. But what gets me particularly steamed is when I see natural bodybuilders and other strength-training enthusiasts who demonstrate exemplary discipline, commitment and sacrifice in everything they do fall prey to this disinformation. It really bothers me to witness such people who go out of their way, going to great lengths to do whats best for their bodies unknowingly compromise the results they well-deserve, or worse-their health, because they were confidently following the conventional wisdom.

Certain foods that we have been indoctrinated to regard as proverbially ?healthy? (as shredded wheat for example, as you mentioned) are in truth nothing but cheap processed garbage that through slick marketing campaigns and heavy promotion by agencies like the American heart Association ensures steep profit margins for the food giants at the expense of unwitting consumers health. (Notice the little AHA heart healthy symbols emblazoned on the next box of ?healthy whole grain cereal? you see in the supermarket. Hey it must be healthy if the American Heart Association is promoting it right? Right.)
Welcome to Food Politics.

In regard to your questions: Unless Im misunderstanding you, (?what the difference is between sprouted grains and regular grains??) the difference is not in the grains themselves but the preparation method–there is no such thing as regular grains, but I presume what you might mean by regular is unsprouted? in which case, as I explained in the previous post above, sprouting, or simply soaking enhances the digestibility and nutritional value of the grain by helping neutralize phytic acid and other enzyme inhibitors. Historically speaking all traditional societies wisely observed this practice and up to a few decades ago, a recommendation for subjecting oats to an overnight soaking prior to cooking was featured on containers. Here is some more info about the process:

http://www.nowtoronto.com/issues/2003-09-18/goods_health.php

http://www.sproutnet.com/Press/fresh_sprouts.htm

http://www.galaxynutrients.com/RawFood.html

And yes, old fashioned rolled oats are acceptable although you may wish to try oat groats (the whole oat grain) see arrowhead mills:

http://www.arrowheadmills.com/products/product.php?prod_id=389&cat_name=grains

As far as not having the time to soak the oats, just keep in mind that its a relatively simple matter-put whatever amount you are to cook into a bowl of water, squeeze a bit of lemon juice in it and let it sit overnight. In fact, one of the merits of the soaking practice is that the grains actually cook FASTER after soaking, as you will find out yourself.

Stay well.

[quote]Testy1 wrote:
Wise11,
How do you feel about the low card varieties? My thoughts were that they could be a valuable source of fiber (12 grams per serving). Although they don’t say which type of fiber I am assuming it is primarily insoluable.

I occasionally use this as a post workout meal, and my kids don’t notice the difference. Is this a misguided effort at proper nutrtion?[/quote]

Keep in mind that the phytic acid is concentrated in the fiber, and being that the grain used in the manufacuring of the pasta is not first soaked, it is not something I’d recommend, especially in such high quantity. Fiber from grains not properly prepared, and especially in large quantities is tough on the digestive system. Also, I don’t know which “low carb” pasta youre referring to, but I know that a lot of the popular low carb food variations out there today e.g corn tortillas, chips, etc. include soy flour, soy protein, other soy products and other dangerous additives so be careful.

Besides that, why are you using a low-carb food for post workout nutrition?

Wise,

Must the cereals All Bran and Grape Nuts be soaked as well?

Thx

Tyler

[quote]wise11 wrote:
Also, I don’t know which “low carb” pasta youre referring to, but I know that a lot of the popular low carb food variations out there today e.g corn tortillas, chips, etc. include soy flour, soy protein, other soy products and other dangerous additives so be careful.

Besides that, why are you using a low-carb food for post workout nutrition?
[/quote]

The Fiber is a modified wheat starch.

My bad on the “low carb”, it is actually “reduced carb” with 31 grams of carbs per 2 ounce serving. This means I can still get 62 grams of carbs in a meal with out going overboard on calories. I do consume a PWO drink, this is for my meal 1-1/2 to 2 hours later.

I also make it a point to consume quite a bit of fiber daily, with no discernable ill effects (except for 3 or 4 trips to the restroom).

My question is more, is this an unsuitable source of fiber?

Thanks,

Wow, great stuff wise11. I had never heard anything like this before. That’ll change my eating habits. I’ve begun to distrust the AHA for their disinformation, now it just takes it further. One thing I don’t get, you neutralize and acid with… an acid? Unless phytic acid is actually just a conjugate, I’m confused.

[quote]Orbitalboner wrote:
Wise,

Must the cereals All Bran and Grape Nuts be soaked as well?

Thx

Tyler[/quote]

Yes, the idea is for the grains that they are made of to have been soaked Prior to their production. Im not sure if you are inquiring whether you yourself should soak them prior to eating but I think the answer to that is quite obvious-being that they’re already cooked soaking them will accomplish nothing but make them soggy.

Incidentally, I have recently learned that Grape nuts, although not made from grains that have been soaked or sprouted is one of the very few cold boxed breakfast cereals on the market that is NOT produced by the deleterious method of extrusion. So in that respect at least they are a marginally better choice than other cold boxed breakfast cereals, but again are not something that I would personally eat, especially not on a frequent basis.

[quote]Testy1 wrote:
wise11 wrote:
Also, I don’t know which “low carb” pasta youre referring to, but I know that a lot of the popular low carb food variations out there today e.g corn tortillas, chips, etc. include soy flour, soy protein, other soy products and other dangerous additives so be careful.

Besides that, why are you using a low-carb food for post workout nutrition?

The Fiber is a modified wheat starch.

My bad on the “low carb”, it is actually “reduced carb” with 31 grams of carbs per 2 ounce serving. This means I can still get 62 grams of carbs in a meal with out going overboard on calories. I do consume a PWO drink, this is for my meal 1-1/2 to 2 hours later.

I also make it a point to consume quite a bit of fiber daily, with no discernable ill effects (except for 3 or 4 trips to the restroom).

My question is more, is this an unsuitable source of fiber?

Thanks,

[/quote]

In my opinion, it is definitely not a source of fiber that I would rely on to meet my soluble fiber requirements. There is nothing inherently wrong with the fiber from grains like wheat, but again, when the grain hasn’t been properly prepared beforehand, the fiber has the potential to produce some ill effects. You may not have experienced any overt ill effects, but just bear in mind that the problems that frequent consumption of such untreated fiber can create—like mineral malabsorption—is something that manifests Over Time. As are many gastrointestinal disorders and food sensitivites. I prefer sprouted wheat or rye toast, sold by companies like alvarado st. bakery: http://www.alvaradostreetbakery.com/
or brown rice or oat groats to get fiber from grains. Either way, I always make it a point to eat all grains, soaked or not, in strict moderation, and laying off of them altogether periodically (i.e. taking a break from eating all grains for a week or two), because they do have the potential to cause allergies and food sensitivities.
I’m of the opinion that grains, although confering some undeniable health benefits, should still not be regarded as a Staple of one’s diet, but more as an occasional complement to a meal. Especially the glutinous grains. Brown rice I am not as conservative with.

[quote]veruvius wrote:
Wow, great stuff wise11. I had never heard anything like this before. That’ll change my eating habits. I’ve begun to distrust the AHA for their disinformation, now it just takes it further. One thing I don’t get, you neutralize and acid with… an acid? Unless phytic acid is actually just a conjugate, I’m confused.[/quote]

From what I read in Sally Fallon’s superb book Nourishing Traditions, soaking the grains in an acidic medium–she recommends either a tablespoon of Whey (real whey, not protein powder whey) or lemon juice helps expedite the neutralization of phytic acid and enzyme inhibitors.

When soaking raw almonds or any other nuts prior to roasting however, she recommends soaking in Salt water. Adding salt to the water of soaking GRAINS however would actually inhibit the neutralization process.

I thought that sprouted actualy meant germinated.Thats when a seed is wetted until the germ actualy starts to grow and breaks the hull.When the germ is wetted a synthesis response causes the germ to start growing and increases its protien content and thus the nutritional value.
Isn’t this how all plants that germinate from seeds procreate?

If there is a reaction between phytic acid,water and lemon juice, then what is the by product of this reaction?

What are the effects of the by product?

Can you provide a link that proves this through quantitative analysis?

The reason I’m playing the devils advocate on this is that it seems that the origional poster may have some misunderstandings about the interplay of the basic macro-nutrients, and being inundated by an opinion from the lunatic fringe isn’t going to help.

The problem is highly unlikely to be from one single chemical compound.The problem of not achieving ones desired goals usualy lies in the inability to balance and maintain the energy and nutrient requirements necessary to achieving the goal.
So, with that in mind, Show me a study. Peer reviewed,from a major university, with complete documentation of methodology, conditions, subjects, and an abstract.
Otherwise I’m calling Bullshit on this whole soak your grain business. Carbohydrates aren’t bad-peoples dietary habits and ignorance are bad.
Phytic acid doesn’t stop one from achieving their goals, but taking solace in an unfounded idea that gives you an easy out will.

I have to respectfully say that I am unconvinced in some respects.

While I do recognize the marketing and political aspect of things, I am not easily convinced of the “dangers” of basic (not overly processed) foods.

No matter which food you attempt to eat, there will be somebody claiming it is the root of all that is unhealthy. Milk, eggs, meat, grains and so on.

If you have health issues, or merely sensitivities, then yes, I’ll agree that various foods can be problematic. However, barring issues or sensitivities, I’m not going to change any of my eating habits at this point.