I’m 33 and just started TRT. My initial free T number was 475 out of a range of up to 1000 (I believe). I started for all the classic benefits and also as off label use because I am a type 1 diabetic. I’m currently 6’4 and about 220 lbs. They have me on a 1ml injection once a week of cypionate (which I believe is equivalent to 200mg) that has aromatase inhibitor mixed in and 50 units of HCG twice a week. Is the HCG protocol standard? It seems a tad low to me considering what I have been reading. Thoughts…
The AI mixed in is not a good way to go. How do you know how much you need? If you need to change you can’t. Using HCG at the start makes dialing in the T hard. Currently you have 3 variables to contend with at once. Think how much easier it’d be if you started with one, got that right and if needed added the others.
I agree with @dextermorgan
I don’t have much of a choice on the AI mixed in. It’s what the clinic I use is sending me. Do you think the HCG dosage is adequate for the amount of test cypionate one injection per week?
If you never want to feel optimal I think you’ve got the perfect setup. Refer to my previous post for answers to the query I imagine the last sentence may generate.
Google anti-aging clinic and in 5 min you’ll find one that will do everything over the phone and for cheaper than you’re paying this place. There’s zero reason to have an AI incorporated into your T especially when you have no clue how much AI or T you even need. They likely did it to because it makes them more money. The HCG is the perfect amount to make the situation more complicated but not enough to have any real effect.
This will sound less dickheaded-ish in 6 weeks when you really start feeling not great especially if you crash your E2.
You should start out by posting all relevant pre-TRT labs including TT, FT, estrogen and SHBG levels. If your TRT clinic didn’t test at least all of these, this is a sign they don’t know how this hormonal game is played.
You always have a choice, you can seek care somewhere else or if your location is an issue, there are telemedicine options available. If you’re a diabetic like myself, then you must have low SHBG because this biomarker low is associated with diabetes.
A once weekly protocol will not work for people like us, we need frequent injections, I need at a minimum injection EOD or daily to benefit from TRT. A 200mg weekly dosage is on the high side if seeking therapeutic levels, the averages is right around 100mg weekly, some need a little more and men like myself need less.
HCG dosing is in iu, not units. If it’s 50iu then this dosage isn’t enough to do much of anything except a waste of you money. A more practical HCG dose is 100-150 daily, 250 EOD and 350-500 twice weekly. HCG will increase estrogen and some men don’t tolerate it well, meaning HCG isn’t for everyone.
TRT in isolation is best starting out.
I appreciate everyone’s input and don’t think anyone is being dick ish. My initial labs showed everything in normal range. My initial t labs prior to trt were smack dab in the normal range. Only my BUN was slightly elevated due to a high protein low carb diet I follow. It’s always a tad out of range and my GP and Endo are never concerned. Other kidney markers are normal. I’m going with a very reputable telemedicine men’s health clinic already. That’s kind of what makes me rest assured that the protocol is tried and true. My hcg dosage concern is from reading various doses people are on. I’m really trying to not take the self prescribing route, but various things on hcg I’m reading have me baffled. I don’t think they’d have me on this protocol (which seems pretty standard) if it weren’t tried and true.
TRT is giving someone X amount of T, waiting several months then get labs & ask how they feel and change dose up or down. That’s TRT. For the folks that don’t do their own research they are leaving it in someone’s hands that have a shit-load of other people to think about and will base dosage on a 2-20 min conversation. TRT clinics are businesses first. That’s not a bad thing but it’s reality. The more knowledge you attain the better results you will eventually achieve. Everyone is unique and so to are their optimal TRT protocols. Labs in range does not necessarily equal feeling bestest. They are just snapshots of things at that second in time. My exact protocol is yours without the AI & HCG but with the T split up into daily shots. I started with your exact protocol (200mg with AI) and it took me 8 months to figure out what was wrong and get to what was right. Good luck bro
If you say so, but for the fact you’re encountering contradictions on this forum should have you pause for concern. I’m not selling you a product therefore I have nothing to gain for any this, this clinic however is running a business.
The current research and studies coming out regarding these AI’s is not good, blocking estrogen removes minerals from bone if suppressed too low for long periods of time.
Let me ask you this, did this clinic even demonstrate a need for an AI?
The reason I ask is because not everyone requires the use of an AI and for those that don’t need one, these men are in for a rude awakening. As a rule of thumb, if a clinic prescribes an AI right away at the start of TRT, this is a sign this clinic is prescribing a cookie cutter protocol to everyone, but everyone is unique and needs are different.
Some guys don’t aromatase as much as others, so by starting everyone out with AI’s is a mistake. All we can do is give the the info, but only you can decided to take it.
I forgot to mention some guys are AI over-responders, I can’t even take 1/8 of a 0.050 anastrozole without damaging my knees from crushed estrogen. It took a few days to recover estrogen levels, but took me weeks to recover from the damaged caused by low estrogen.
My labs follow up is at I believe 13 weeks. Im going to stick to the current protocol as I don’t have much of a choice. I’m assuming they’ll adjust the aromatase inhibitor accordingly after the labs. I’ll keep you guys posted and further educate myself as time passes.
You’ll be back here long before 13 weeks, trust me.
Hey man. I am also Type 1 so quite interested in your results. Now that its a year later, were there any complications with your diabetes? Kidneys, liver, blood pressure, etc? Thanks if you take the time to read and respond!
My hematocrit went up and as well a hemoglobin. My lipid profile took a hit. My HDL is now around 60, it used to be in the mid 80s. I’m going to lower my dose and see if that does anything.
Hey just a question about this. I see it mentioned a lot that you should get dialed in on T only first. My question is isn’t it possible that some guys would never get dialed in on t only and might need other medications? How would you know, and couldn’t you end up spinning your wheels for a long time? Thanks.
Thanks for the reply.
Possible? Maybe but not probable. Somewhere between 100 and 200mg with enough time at each interval and you can find what works best. When you get there and have been there long enough you can add another variable and more accurately know how that variable itself is effecting you.
There’s a lot of folks that try several things at once and almost always end up with a long ass log they never ends with “mission accomplished”.
But you do have a choice. Call the clinic and tell them that you want a new vile with T only, and return your old Vile in exchange. They should comply. Youre the patient and youre the patron. If you dont separate the AI from your protocol you have no one to blame but yourself, because you have been warned by experienced patients. Call your Docs office immediately, you are in charge.