T Nation

Is a Correct or Even Adequate Regimen?


#1

Hello gents!
Yet another long time lurker who has found T-Nation to be more helpful than most, if not all other forums, so I bit the bullet and signed up as I have more questions than there seems to be answers for. Hopefully you guys can help.
In an effort to keep this as short as possible, I will give brief history, stats and while I don’t have the latest blood work on hand, I will post what I can remember. (I will work on getting copies of labs after the holiday weekend.)
37
5’11"
230
36
Normal body hair I reckon, facial hair = mustache and chin whiskers full, everything else somewhat patchy
From what I remember slow and steady, though one school year was a 7 inch growth spurt… that was fun…NOT!
Occasional teste aches
Apathetic mostly
Depression and Anxiety
Libido in the tank… I want to want to though, does that count ??? Lol
Normal temp most of the time
Skin and nails seem fine
Only salt is what is in the foods I eat, nevery purposely added
Seafood, not as often as I’d like
I’m sure there have been some chemicals along the way
No hair loss drugs
Only medications right now is a blend of test Cyp and test pro 1x weekly, 1.5 anastrozole day of injection and .5 day 3 post inject.

I was originally diagnosed low t in 2009 by my GP, started on injections and didn’t like the roller coaster, switched to Androgel. He also had me on SSRI’s, B12 and D supplements.
Went like that for years, granted I wasn’t the best patient and we played with the dose alot, but all.in all it wasn’t too bad.
I decided after my second divorce, I wanted off of all of it as I’d lost weight (was then about where I am now) got down to about 190, and was working out more, going out more and having more fun.
Succesfully got off of everything and all seemed well.
Then slowly started noticing mood swings/irritability but it wasn’t too bad. (Or so I thought, Gf had different opinion)
All in all was off everything for about a year maybe year and a half when the brain fog and irritability and anxiety started tearing me up. Was able to convince primary to do labs, and BW came back about where it was in 09, so we started back with the injections.
Ended up at a clinic on the weekend due to just feeling like all out crap, doc there did some BW said all looked good except E2, it came back at 149.
Told primary, he suggested cutting test dose in half to lower estrogen (even though TT and FT were good)…
He was promptly fired for that issue, and I’m now at a clinic where they seem pretty knowledgeable about TRT.
I lost insurance and had to go back to Androgel w/.5 anastrozole mon day and thursday.
That lasted about a month, started a 2 pumps per day, ended up at 1 per day as it made my chest hurt/ weird heart feelings. Doc said most likely stress/anxiety and NOT the Agel, but…
Finally have insurance again and just got 2nd injection Friday.
Labs from last week prior to restarting injections, no Agel that morning and no adex for a week =
FT 6.8
TT 265
E2 24
I apologize as I don’t remember anymore of the results and don’t know the ranges for the lab they use.

I’m sure I left out other info that may be helpful, so please ask if so, and I will provide it or get it.

Thanks fellas!


#2

Hopefully you can get a more thorough blood work done. E2 is fine now from so high I’m surprised you weren’t on sex reassignment therapy. Trt was not very good so I am not shocked that E2 was under control. It might not be now

Read the stickies post labs, post temps, morning at waking and day. You have insurance on your side now you should do fine


#3

Thanks for the reply and voteof confidence.
I will post most recent BW as soon as I can get it next week.

Also, I failed to mention in the OP that I started back on the ssri (lexapro 5 mg) this morning.

I recently became self employed and my current contract requires a lot of travel so getting the anxiety in check asap is a priority.


#4

That just means that you are not going to be able to accurately figure out if any mood changes sexual side effects things like that, are related to the testosterone or the serotonin uptake inhibitors


#5

What are your actual doses. Speaking in times and volumes doesn’t relate to dosage.


#6

Sorry about that.
If you are asking about past dosages I cannot accurately remember.
Currently on 110-120 (sometimes I have to go in a day early so it’s 110) weekly of cyp/pro blend.
If I remember correctly it’s something like 80/20.
500 HCG at same time.
1.5 anastrozole day of injection, usually after supper, and .5 anastrozole 3 days post injection.

And now 5mg lexapro as well.


#7

You need to read up on the sticky posts. Your T dose is fine, but you will want to take smaller doses of HCG spread out and up the HCG dose. If you are only allotted 500iu I would take it two days apart later in the week where you could use stimulation. Not the same day as test. Second, way to much anastrozole. You need about 1mg per 100mg T. So take .5mg with your shot and another .5mg half way later int he week.


#8

You seem to be skirting around the thyroid, iodine, iodized salt and body temperature issues. Please post oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky.

You sometimes have felt cold more than made sense?
Outer eyebrows sparse?

There is not enough iodine in food, that is why salt has been iodized for almost 100 years.

Typically we see that guys need near 1mg anastrozole for every 100mg T ester. If E2 goes to low, you can have a lot of negative effects.

Please read these stickies found here: About the T Replacement Category

  • advice for new guys
  • things that damage your hormones
  • protocol for injections
  • thyroid basics
  • finding a TRT doc

Anastrozole serum levels need to match T levels and that is not going to work right with the changing levels of T from injecting once a week. Suggest that you self inject twice a week and take anastrozole at time of injections.

Your weight gain could easily be increased by low thyroid function. The symptoms of low thyroid function and low-T are largely the same. If thyroid function is low, you can still have significant issues while on TRT, including lethargy and mood/depression issues.


#9

Ok fellas, I apologize for not responding sooner, just life right now.
I had taken some temp readings but then my thermometer walked off and I haven’t remembered to get another when I’m at the store.
I will try and upload what I have with my most recent labs from my gp.

Well, I guess we’ll see if that worked!


#10

Also, I’ve never been a big fan of adding salt, however KSman (and others) per reading through some of the stickies, I have tried to get better about adding iodized salt to my meals at least 2-3 times a day.(I typically eat 4-5 times a day currently due to the fog getting worse and just feeling off every 3 hours or so).
GP did an ultrasound of thyroid and said it had a little Swiss cheese look, but not bad, she also recommended adding in the salt.

The labs posted above were taken about 20-30 minutes after I had eaten, so that may explain why glucose is a tad high. (Or so I’m told)

Haven’t changed anything dosing wise as of yet, am looking into it though with my GP, as she seems fairly knowledgeable and pretty open to suggestion. (Within reason) so I’m thinking hoping I can switch my TRT to her and start self injecting.

She also seems to prefer tamoxifen over anaatrozole… anyone have any thoughts on this?

Thanks a million gents!


#11

for what?

Anastrozole, an AI reduces E2 buy reducing T–>E2

Tamoxifen [a SERM] interferes with estrogens at estrogen receptors in SELECTED tissues and SERMs typically increase estrogen levels.

Labs should be estradiol, E2, not total estrogens.

Please study the stickies


#12

KSman,
That’s what I thought I had read, thank you for clarifying.

I am actually doing labs today at my current TRT place, so I will have those numbers with estradiol instead of total estrogens next week. I included the above labs as they showed everything done at new GP, as well as A1c and Thyroid tests.
Also, what are your thoughts on calculated free T versus serum levels on a lab test?


#13

Cannot calculate without knowing albumin and SHBG. Why deal with that when a direct method exists.

But why Quest FT numbers are 4-5 times higher than LabCorp? How do calculate FT numbers fit into that world? If these boys cannot agree on ranges and results, what do you compare calculated FT numbers to?