T Nation

Is 150mg Testosterone Cypionate Weekly Sustainable for Muscle Gain?

T Replacement
#1

I’ve been on it for 3 months was just getting 100 mg my urologist was willing to go to 150 mg when I saw him again this month but made the comment “there’s no reason to go more than 150 mg a week” I was hoping to get to 200 mg weekly and not asking for more due to the fact that I’ve had prostate cancer but have had 0 psas for several years. There is a risk of the prostate cancer returning it used to be that doctors would not even give testosterone to someone who’s had prostate cancer ever but now it’s changed and there’s doctors saying those that have had pc should absolutely get testosterone to get their quality of life back as the science mostly backs that it’s safe and from what I remember a study of 1250 people who had pc got on testosterone and only around 32 had their pc return. My regular doctor was against it giving the old saying “it’s the fuel that feeds the fire” but two urologists who are more educated in the subject had no problems giving it to me.

But assuming he will refuse to ever go to 200 can I continue to make gains on 150 mg for an indefinite amount of time? Or does it depend on the person? I started overweight with no muscle mass more or less a beginner 39 years old. I started with extremely low testosterone levels in the 100s when I saw him it increased to 293 probably over 300 by now. Would like to double that at least eventually. Is it like just a matter of time that it will increase to that or is it dose dependent or again depends on the person?

#2

At 150mg your T levels should multiply into the 1000ng/dl sector, and your progress will be a slow steady climb, better than most natty guys you know. At 200mg you could notice a boost that is simply not necessary, but can yield better and faster results, but you’re going to have to come back down to 150mg for TRT, if that is where you feel best. You can also experiment with only 100mg as TRT and 150mg as a cycle. All safe zone dosages and lots of room to see what you like. At 160mg my libido is distracting and gains are good. At 220mg I gain great muscle but libido drops a bit. At 300mg I feel good, but also think about my HCT, BP and PSA constantly which are not really a concern, but the thought does cross my mind.
I say if you’re prescribed150mg, start with 100mg and test 12 weeks later. See where you are and climb if needed.

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#3

Imagine my shock at 35 years old I was lifting weights seeing no gains so I thought “hrmm, I think I’ll have my testosterone levels checked” and sure enough it was low, oh and btw you have psa of 16. Ended up prostate cancer and losing my prostate and radiation. Fun times.

If I hadn’t had decided to check my testosterone levels on my own i probably would be dead right now or close to my death bed because doctors do not check for prostate cancer because it does not happen in your 30s, except to me.

#4

If your testosterone is in the higher end of the normal range then expect your gains to be similar to what you’d make as a natural with healthy testosterone levels, plus a tad more.

#5

Wonder how long it will take to get from I think around 140 nl to 1000. Can’t wait.

#6

Within 24 hours of your first shot.

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#7

Damn, I’m proally at like 20,000 nl by now then.

Oh nm, meant ng.

#8

How so?

#9

Because you said it will go from 140 nl to 1000 in 24 hours. I have been taking shots for several months. So I must be up to like 20,000 now.

#10

No, think of a beginner powerlifter, weightlifter or bodybuilder. Improvements are greater and will come faster during your first year of training than your tenth. No one puts 10kg on their squat every month indefinitely. The growth curve tends to flatten out over time.

More testosterone will help you get stronger and gain muscle. Sure, there is a point of diminishing returns, but it is no where near 150-200mg a week. There is a reason some athletes use 1000-2000mg test a week. There is a small number of guys who find they feel better at 150mg than 200mg, so yes, results do depend on the person.

Are you at 300ng/dL currently, on TRT, at 150mg a week? If that is the case, you should not have trouble finding a doctor who will move you to 200mg.

Or maybe triple it.

#11

It doesn’t work like that. There is no cumulative effect once you hit stable levels. Taking Xmg each week will land you at whatever number, but it doesn’t keep adding up because your shot from last week has already started to fade.

Here’s a chart from the other day. It illustrates what the mg released looks like for someone taking 125mg of sustanon twice a week over the course of 12 weeks.

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#12

Yeah I didn’t word that very well I realize after 1-2 years your gains are very slow no matter who you are unless you’re on roids.

I was at 300 nl on 100, he increased to 150 at that time in which I haven’t seen any lab work for yet. I will not know until June what my levels for 150 are.

#13

So I do not know what my levels on 150 is yet it increased to about 300 on 100 mg per week. But what you’re saying is whatever it is increases to I’m stuck there it won’t increase more than once regardless of how long i take it? So my levels most likely won’t get above maybe 4 or 500 ng max on average?

Or are you saying every week I take it it goes all the way up to 1000 ng in 24 hours then goes down down down until the next week when I take it again?

#14

You get a quick spike on injection day. From there the ester is cleaved from the hormone at a consistent rate. It’s steadily released throughout the next 7-10 days (depending on the ester) and eventually the dose you took on Monday is cut down to half and then half again and then half again. That’s why you constantly take it.

Now as far as what your number ends up looking like, I have a question. You said 100mg got you to 300. How many days after your shot was that blood work done? Because a 300 trough reading means a peak number that would be much higher than that, perhaps in the 700-800 range. Dose timing also has an effect on what numbers you achieve. Lay out your protocol for me and include what day blood work was done relative to your shot, please.

#15

Well they do the injections for me as well and I had them do an injection and take my blood work for psas and testosterone levels in the same appointment. Only problem is I don’t remember which came first the injection or the bloodwork. Trying to remember but can’t. It’s a big difference I guess of these levels being from 5 minutes ago or a week ago. Next time I’ll have them check the levels before the injection but that’s not til March.

#16

Wait, what isn’t until March? Blood work or your next injection?

#17

Blood work, I get injections weekly.

When I go next Wednesday I’m going to ask the nurse to check my levels before the injection. Not sure if she will or can though because I don’t have an appointment coming up.

#18

It won’t make a difference. You’re testing trough levels, which is fine, but it’s not telling you much of you keep repeating the same test with the exact same inputs every time.

#19

You can make incredible gains on 150mg of test a week. Eat alot, sleep, and train hard. Don’t slack off and use TRT as a crutch and you can blow up even at 160. TRT basically results in steady state levels so instead of fluctuations you get naturally from stress, overtraining, dieting, lack of sleep, alcohol, etc, they just stay elevated. If you take advantage of this you will be shocked at how much you gain instead of thinking “if I could just take 200mg id be even bigger”

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#20

Very true. Tons of men in TRT eat and train like shit and never get that look. Then you got guys who work hard, as though they don’t have TRT helping them, and they blow up.

More plates more dates guy on YouTube has a good video on this. He found some good studies showing guys at low doses of T and 500mg of T had the same amount of muscle built … those numbers above is not accurate, but you get the idea.

Mentality goes a long way and you are spot on.