T Nation

IR & Body Temp


#1

how was the proposed figure of 500-750mg for IR derived?

could more than this be required for IR?

also, regarding body temps measured orally, although 98.6 appears to be the "target temp", if you are measuring this via oral thermometer, it appears unlikely that you will get this reading:

"The commonly accepted average core body temperature (taken internally) is 37.0 °C (98.6 °F). The typical oral (under the tongue) measurement is slightly cooler, at 36.8° ± 0.4°C (98.2° ± 0.7°F)"


KSman is Here
#2

If you have not been eating, drinking, talking, exercising for 1/2 hour, you should get oral 98.6, many do. So don’t let that distract you. I could not get to 98.6 before my IR, now I am there routinely. Oral temps in a doctors office will be lower than 98.6, so the wiki would be correct in that setting.

As per sticky, adults store 1 - 1.5 grams of iodine. If intake history has not included long term iodized salt or from vitamins and body temperatures are low, one should try IR to see if temps and body/brain function improves. Assuming one is low and cannot know what ones stores are, it is a reasonable guess to take 1/2 of the larger storage range, so that is 500- 750mg. Nothing deep or scientific. Seems to do the job and dose resolve problems in many cases. More? Perhaps not. If low temperatures do not resolve, time to look for things that cause interference such as rT3 - adrenal issues or bromines. IR will displace bromines, one can stink and feel unwell until the displaced bromines are excreted. If that happens, you know that you had a bromine problem - good to have that perspective.


#3

ok KSman, thanks for the response - and apologies for missing the 500-750mgs rationale in the thyroid sticky!

My query regarding the dosage was that i had spotted, in another thread, a comment that IR could result in a raised TSH result.

At your suggestion (from our previous lengthy PM correspondence) i did IR and blood tests conducted during the IR period returned slightly out-of-range values.

free T4 11.6L pmol/L (12-22)
TSH 4.57H miu/L (0.27-4.20)

I used Lugol Iodine Solution (80mg iodine + 40mg iodide per ml) for my IR. I started with a low dose and gradually worked up to a higher dosage and just kept that until i finished the bottle (30ml)

Since IR my mid-afternoon temps have reached 37C on a couple of occasions but generally tend to flucuate between 36.6-36.8C.


#4

TSH=4.57: Have you been tested for tyroid antibodies? Thyroid enlarged? I can’t recall our old PM traffic.


#5

Tsh would be elevated while on IR no? People should be tested for hashi’s and grave before doing IR!!!

Tsh
Ft:3
Ft4
Tgab
Tpo and an added TSI test for diagnosing graves.

Why test the thyroid while ur messing with it with high levels of iodine???

Look it up its normal for tsh to go out of bounds when loading that much…


#6

iw84 - that is why i asked if “IR could result in a raised TSH result”!

previous PM correspondence with KSman over a lengthy period of time had led to me doing IR.

thanks.


#7

KSman - just noticed your reply, sorry!

Our previous correspondence was regarding gyno - almost certainly brought about by long-term use of cimetidine.

Thanks.


#8

Yes it could. I respect ksman very much for what he does here but I don’t agree with everyone just hopping on 50 mg per day of iodine… Low body temps could mean many things… Low iodine could be one yes but loading at that level could give the wrong person a heart attack!!

We need to be more careful with what put in our body. The thyroid levels above and ruling out problems with the adrenals should be done before an attemp to load.

May I ask you a question?

What are your body temps now?

I think what works for some doesn’t work for others and ksman had a good experience and that’s awesome.

I on the other hand did not. And my friend spent the day in the ER with heart palpitations


#9

give me some time to get my notes, lab results over a period of years etc. and i’ll post some more info. thanks for the interest.


#10

morning temp varies from 97.1-97.5; mid-day usually around 98.2. i can only recall it reaching 98.6 occasionally. I’m converting from C as that is what my inexpensive digital thermomenter measures in and i have sometimes doubted the accuracy of it!

Results from 18/06/13 blood test:
(only thyroid was retested as result of previous test results)

Thyroid peroxidase antibody level 6.1 IU/ml (0-34)
Serum THS level 6.72 miu/L (0.27-4.20) HI

GP said TSH was “a little high but can be affected by numerous things” so wants retest first week in September, if still high will refer back to endo.

Results from 24/04/13 blood tests:

sodium 141 mmol/L (133-146)
potassium 4.3 mmol/L (3.5-5.3)
urea 6.1 mmol/L (2.5-7.8)
creatinine 127 umol/L (50-120) HI
E-GFR 53 ml/min - non-diabetic patients <30 refer to nephrologist; 30-90 follow joint RCP & Renal Assoc CKD guidelines; >90 normal.

AFP(STHCT) 1.9 (0-6 ku/L)

total bilirubin 11 umol/L (0-21)
total protein 69 g/L (60-80)
albumin 45 g/L (35-50)
globulin 24 g/L (20-36)
alb/glob ratio 1.88
alk phosphatase 47 u/L (30-130)
ALT 39 u/L (5-40)

TSH 4.57 miu/L (0.27-4.20) HI
Free T4 11.6 pmol/L (12-22) LO

Prolactin 126 mu/L (86-324)

LH 3.2 u/L (2-9)
FSH 4.9 u/L (3-12)

Testosterone (STHC) 13.8 nmol/L (9.9-27.8)

Estradiol 52 pmol/L (28-156)

Results from 02/0812 blood tests (endocrinologist):

TSH 2.55 miu/L (0.3-4.7)
Free Thyroxine 12 pmol/L (9.5-21.5)

LH 4 iu/L (3-13)
FSH 5.4 iu/L (1.3-9.2)

Prolactin 123 miu/L (0-450)

Testosterone 15.4 nmol/L (9-25)

Estradiol <60 pmol/L (0-180)


#11

How did IR fit into the time line of the labs?
What was total IR mg load.

People with Hashi’s get hyper thyroid peaks early in the tissue destruction phase. That cam happen if one is taking iodine or not.


#12

Do you have stocks in iodine or what lol 50 mg of iodine is stupid if one has thyroid problems. It’s just dumb… Your liver enzymes are on the high end there.

I would get a thyroid ultrasound and test rt3 plus above mentioned tests


#13

[quote]KSman wrote:
How did IR fit into the time line of the labs?
What was total IR mg load.

People with Hashi’s get hyper thyroid peaks early in the tissue destruction phase. That cam happen if one is taking iodine or not.[/quote]

KSman - as per previous post:

“I used Lugol Iodine Solution (80mg iodine + 40mg iodide per ml) for my IR. I started with a low dose and gradually worked up to a higher dosage and just kept that until i finished the bottle (30ml)”

I was dosing this at the time of the 24/4 blood test and had finshed the bottle of lugols before the 17/6 test.

(btw - our previous correspondence was PM’d as “tokon reference info”.)


#14

My PM’s are all gone. There were so many, the data base indexing of these was making the forums very slow. So I asked that they be deleted and the problems were solved. My topic subscriptions were also a problem.

TSH 4.57 miu/L (0.27-4.20) HI
Free T4 11.6 pmol/L (12-22) LO

fT4: mid range is 17, so whatever is going on, its not an iodine deficiency. And fT4=11.6 is certainly not indicative of iodine+Hashi’s leading to toxic fT4 of fT3 levels.

We had someone else in this situation, he got tested for antibodies like you did and was positive. I think that you are going to be on thyroid meds. Not good news.

Getting worse:

Thyroid peroxidase antibody level 6.1 IU/ml (0-34) HI
Serum THS level 6.72 miu/L (0.27-4.20)

but!

How is 6.1 in a range of 0-34 high?


#15

apologies, i have re-edited. it should read:

Thyroid peroxidase antibody level 6.1 IU/ml (0-34)
Serum THS level 6.72 miu/L (0.27-4.20) HI

After seeing the endocinologist (referral re gyno) 02/08/12 his letter to my doctor stated that there was no evidence of any endocrine function problem.

what the hell has happened since? have i overdone the iodine and messed myself up?!

TSH retest is first week in September, if still high i will be referred back to an endocrinologist.


#16

My levels are much worse since IR and now my thyroid physically hurts and the glands are inflamed. My thyroid is enlarged now among other problems… Wonderful isn’t it…


#17

iw84aces - i have not actually felt as if I have suffered any undue/noticable ill-effects of IR; it just seems strange that my thyroid test results have gotten worse since I did it.

I don’t feel “cold”, even in the morning when my body temp is lowest.

i do feel fatigued/low energy at times but that has been ongoing over the last few years, even when thyroid readings were OK. i had thought that was symptom of either: falling testosterone levels; the medication that probably led to my developing gyno (cimetidine); or the chronic immune response condition (urticaria) that I was prescribed that medication for!

once you start messing with one area of hormones it just seems to snowball!


#18

With low body temps I feel to hot not cold. I started getting hot flashes on iodine. They haven’t left…


#19

Ok, i have found results from some previous labs as follows:

25/11/99 17:30hrs (specimen is serum/plasma unless stated)

urea 6.7mmol/l (2.5-7.0)
creat. 110 umol/l (50-120)
r.glucose 4.4mmol/l (3.0-9.5)
AST 59u/l (2-40)
ALT 116 u/l (2-40)
cholesterol 5.1 desirable <5.2 high >6.5
triglycerides 1.7 (0.3-2.3)
HDL Cholesterol 1.21 (males >0.9)
LDL cholesterol 3.1 (males <3.5)

There are also some routine haematology results from this date detailed showing RDW 13.7 (11.8-14.8).

01/02/01 18:00hrs (same lab as above)

If I recall correctly, I had these tests done a few weeks after I had been diagnosed by my GP as having had a “post-viral fatigue syndome” following some other blood tests (conducted by GP) showing disruptions in testosterone and thyroid levels - but I cannot locate these results.

Routine haematology showed RDW 11.6 (11.8-14.8) This was the only haematology result outside normal range.

urea 5.5mmol/l (2.5-7.0)
creat. 115umol/ (50-120)
cholesterol 4.9mmol/l desirable <5.2 high >6.5
triglycerides 2.1mmol/l (0.3-2.3)
HDL cholesterol 1.21mmol/l (male >0.9)
LDL cholesterol 2.7mmol/l (male <3.5)

TSH 1.83 mu/l (0.35-5.50)

AST 52u/l (2-40)
ALT 96u/l (2-40)

Testosterone 11.7nmol/l (9.0-25.0)
FSH 2.3 f IU/l (1.4-18.1)
LH 2.3 IU/l (1.5-9.3)

12/04/01 18:05hrs (same lab as above)

Routine haematology showed RDW 11.5 (11.8-14.8) otherwise everything else within normal range.

urea 7.0nmol/l (2.5-7.0)
creat. 132umol/l (50-120)

ALT 54u/l (2-40)

no thyroid, testosterone or lipid profiles appear to have been done on that date.

12/06/08 17:25hrs (same clinic as above)

routine haematology showed everything within normal range

urea 10.9nmol/l (2.5-7.0)
creat. 115umol/l (50-110)

ALT 47u/L (0-40)

cholesterol 4.9mmol/l (3.0-6.5)
triglyceride 1.4mmol/l
HDL cholesterol 1.46mmol/l
LDL cholesterol 2.8mmol/l
TChol/HDL Ratio 3.4

Testosterone 9.9nmol/L (8.0-29.0)
FSH 4.7 f iu/L (1.4-18.1)
LH 2.5 iu/L (1.5-9.3)

no thyroid profile

10/06/08 09:50hrs (tests at GP clinic)

serum total bilirubin level 9umol/L (0-17)
serum total bilirubin 73g/L (60-80)
serum albumin 45g/L (35-50)
alk phos 52u/L (30-125)
alt/sgpt serum level 42u/L (5-40) HI
serum globulin 28g/L (20-36)
R Alb/Glob ratio 1.61
serum sodium 141 mmol/L (134-147)
serum potassium 4.1mmol/L (3.7-5.0)
serum urea 7.5mmol/l (2.5-7.0) HI
serum creatinine. 120umol/l (50-120)
creatine kinase 574u/l (24-195) Hi - repeat 12wks

erythrocyte sedimentation rate 35mm/h (2-28) HI

ALT 42u/l (5-40)

plasma glucose 4.9mmol/l (3.3-5.9)

cholesterol 5.0mmol/l (desirable <5.2)
triglycerides 0.7mmol/l (0.5-1.7)
HDL cholesterol 1.54mmol/l (0.90-1.76)
LDL cholesterol 3.14mmol/l (high risk >5.0)
total cholesterol:HDL ratio 3.2

TSH 3.23miu/l (0.27-4.20)

Testosterone 20.5nmol/l (9.9-27.8)

18/06/08 11:03hrs (GP clinic)

serum total bilirubin level 11umol/L (0-17)
serum total protein 72g/L (60-80)
serum albumin 46g/L (35-50)
alk phos 54u/L (30-125)
serum globulin 26g/L (20-36)
R Alb/Glob Ratio 1.77
ALT 47u/l (5-40) HI - slightly repeat 6wks

creatine kinase 360u/l (24-195) HI - improving repeat 4wks

estradiol 67pmol/l (28-156) OK

16/07/08 (GP clinic)

serum creatinine kinase level 395u/L (24-195) HI

serum testosterone 18.0nmol/L (9.9-27.8)

serum total bilirubin level 12umol/L (0-17)
serum total protein 74g/L (60-80)
serum albumin 48g/L (35-50)
alk phos 55u/L (30-125)
ALT/SGPT serum level 37u/L (5-40)
serum globulin 26g/L (20-36)
R Alb/Glob ratio 1.85

erythrocyte sedimentation rate 9mm/h (2-28)

20/10/08 (GP clinic)

serum total bilirubinlevel 12umol/L (0-17)
serum total protein 74g/L (60-80)
serum albumin 46g/L (35-50)
alk phos 53u/L (30-125)
alt/sgpt serum level 37u/L (5-40)
serum globulin 28g/L (20-36)

30/03/12 (GP clinic)

estradiol 121 pmol/L (28-156)

testosterone (STHCT) 21.8 nmol/L (9.9-27.8)

AFP (alpha foetoprotein) 1.8 ku/L (0-6)

FSH 5.1 u/L (3-12)
LH 4.0 u/L (2-9)

total bilirubin 13umol/L (0-21)
total protein 69 g/L (60-80)
albumin 46 g/L (35-50)
alk phosphatase 47 u/L (30-125)
alt 36 u/L (5-40)
globulin 23 g/L (20-36)
alb/glob ratio 2.00

11/05/12 (GP clinic)

estradiol 85pmol/L (28-156)

FSH 4.4 u/L (3-12)
LH 2.4 u/L (2-9)


#20

KSman - are there any strategies that might improve my thyroid function? IR diesn’t look to have helped - unless, of course, I overdid it and this is the reason for the test results?

Thanks.